Center channel theory

[kexodusc]

Not quite on this one. The suck out is between 1-4kHz where the wall plays no role in the output. You are going to have a bass boost with the suck out intact if you place the speakers close to the wall.

The only way to avoid this kind of suck out is to use a hard center speaker to replace the phantom center image.

Oh ok, like I said, I didn't know anything about a suckout in phantom mode - i don't use it in my system because I've always prefered CC's. Either way, the difference between the 3rd L/R at center and just phantom mode that I tuned into wasn't in the 1-4kHz range so much but more 200Hz -1.5 kHz range or thereabouts...if phantom mode had a suckout, it wasn't as bad as the sound from the CC up against the display. Then again, we were focusing on vocals, mostly dialogue, and were probably more attuned to the boost than the omission.

What is going on in the phantom mode that's causing that suckout that doesn't occur in regular stereo music listening? Can you explain it to dummies like me?

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Oh ok, like I said, I didn't know anything about a suckout in phantom mode - i don't use it in my system because I've always prefered CC's. Either way, the difference between the 3rd L/R at center and just phantom mode that I tuned into wasn't in the 1-4kHz range so much but more 200Hz -1.5 kHz range or thereabouts...if phantom mode had a suckout, it wasn't as bad as the sound from the CC up against the display. Then again, we were focusing on vocals, mostly dialogue, and were probably more attuned to the boost than the omission.

Boost are hard to ignore, they are in your face. A suck out is definately more difficult to hear because....it is just not there! The only reference point that a suck out exists, is a percieved spaciousness with mono signals(like a voice suspended between two speakers in a two channel system), or a thin-nes or lack of body to an instrument.

What is going on in the phantom mode that's causing that suckout that doesn't occur in regular stereo music listening? Can you explain it to dummies like me?

It does exist in regular stereo programming, you just don't notice it because you like the effect, or it has been equalized out during mixing and mastering in post.

With a good two channel system, have you noticed how spacious a vocal sounds suspended between the two speakers? That effect partially comes from the suck out at 1-4kHz, and depending on the depth of that suck out, it can sound anywhere from spacious, to damn right thin and lacking body. Some mixers like that effect, as do quite a few audiophiles. However if the mix has alot of instruments, the voice would be drowned out if the suck out is not messaged. So we add alot of EQ to the vocals to thresh them out of the mix, or they would be smothered by the instruments(some folks do not realize how much EQ it takes to do this). I think audio purists would have a heart failure if they understood how much processing is really in some "audiophile" recordings.