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Originally Posted by Florian
Because some people on an internet site disagree and would much rather see me enjoy a 400$ speaker that they can all agree on?
Maybe there's a communication barrier, but that's not what they're saying at all.
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Originally Posted by Florian
Its funny, i didnt like McDonalds in the US either and Burger King or Wendys was much better. Now here in germany i prefer McDonalds much more then Burger King. But in the end i drink a good beer and eat a fat swine in the beer garden :biggrin5:
As a general comment to some of our members.
I am asuming that you vote in your country. Your vote, whichever way it was has affected many lifes. In your own country and the countrys around you. Maybe you drive a big Truck that takes a lot of gasoline which then polutes my entire continent?! I am sure that you buy your wife some gifts every now and then, plus maybe a big screen TV? You could take that money and feed some hungry children.
I have the money to life in a seperate section of my parents house, i pay rent, electricity and a share of the food bill. I work 3 weeks a month as a teacher for the german military at 22, i teach at DEKRA one of the biggest schools in germany. I do contract work as a network engenieer here in my area. I can build a 3500$ crossover and enjoy speakers that cost as much as a car. And yes i am picking up a second pair in Italy. I am in the position to enjoy these toys, have good friends and a girlfriend. Maybe i find a apartment this year and complete my school, why should i not enjoy these moments? Because some people on an internet site disagree and would much rather see me enjoy a 400$ speaker that they can all agree on? I am not limited by children, car bills, house bills, or a family. Give me one good reason why i should not use my options?
Hey Flo,
You should do what makes you happy. Eveyone has their own dreams to chase. Don't let anyone tell you what should mean the most to you. Not that you needed me to tell you that.
A girlfriend huh? Been holding out on your buddies? So? What's she like? Is she 6' and blonde? Come on man. Spill it.
You may already know that much of what I make already goes overseas to my wife's family. They are very poor and need it just to put food on the table.
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Originally Posted by jocko_nc
The thing is, however, the original question posted here asked to confirm that Bose were the best-in-class performers. Now, if this were a hamburger forum, can anoyne possibly imagine a question asking whether the Big Mac is the best-in-class? Unlike McDonalds, Bose is generally assumed to be the best.
Well, not the original question that started the thread. But I know what you mean. Your question of, do we know of any other company like Bose. There most likely is not an exact match anywhere. Some will be like them in one area not not others. Then other companies will be the same in another area but not the whole picture either. Companies are like snowflakes. No two are exactly alike. Cool huh? Stupid but funny with a little truth mixed in.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GMichael
Hey Flo,
You should do what makes you happy. Eveyone has their own dreams to chase. Don't let anyone tell you what should mean the most to you. Not that you needed me to tell you that.
A girlfriend huh? Been holding out on your buddies? So? What's she like? Is she 6' and blonde? Come on man. Spill it.
You may already know that much of what I make already goes overseas to my wife's family. They are very poor and need it just to put food on the table.
Well you know i do what i want anyways :-)
Well she is 5.2ft tall ( i am 6.3) so its kinda funny looking. She has long blond curly hair and loves music, lord of the rings and like me doesnt take **** from noone, and she gets what she wants. Pretty good match so far :-)
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Originally Posted by njspeer
He he, this is great. Are you telling me people don't want McDonald's? Are you telling me that McDonald's has forced it's self on millions of helpless victims through hype, who would otherwise be eating tofu and asparagus? I don't lightly accuse people of smoking crack, but you sir are smoking crack if you don't think McDonald's is filling a niche.
Boy, you're dense. Which would be the highest quality meal dip-wad? That's the question. Of course McD's fills a niche. A nicely developed one at that (thanks to their marketting) that people think they can't live without. All the hype in the world doesn't make them quality food or the best tasting options, but I assure you the hype keeps the business going and making billions. Which completely flattens your stupid assertions that only quality products result in successful businesses.
Bose, Big Mac... really the same thing in a different wrapper. A lot of people buy Bose, a lot of people like them. If they tried other speakers, would they conclude that Bose is the best? Of course not (unless they're deaf maybe). But it fills their ears when they don't otherwise care. And they do it because some advertisement told them they were getting something great, with two all-beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions, on a sesame seed bun. Really all they got was two dry pieces of bread with a smattering of meat-like substance and 8 cents worth of condiments... but it was presented so darned nicely.
Enjoy your 901 quarter-pounder. Learn that there are those of us who like steak.
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A quick question, i see B&W and Axiom etc.. advertising everywhere. They usually contradict themselves in Test reports too. It says they are the best, is it ok if i order a non-box meal too?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Florian
A quick question, i see B&W and Axiom etc.. advertising everywhere. They usually contradict themselves in Test reports too. It says they are the best, is it ok if i order a non-box meal too?
Well gee, maybe that's why one should depend on some science? some testing? some statistics? Perhaps have a look at the quality of construction? Maybe get opinions other than the ones that come from the marketting department? High-end steakhouses in this city advertise too. Lucky for them, they have the product to back it up.
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How can i base it on statistics. McDonalds is highly popular, and acording to statistics very good. So is B&W and Axiom is highly popular it must be good! On second thought, maybe the masses are completely wrong. I think ill stay with my previous order.
-Flo
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Perhaps you fail to grasp that in a certain price range there can be bests and worsts. Axiom, B&W, Paradigm (and whoever else you want to list) all offer some very good performance within and sometimes above their given price brackets. Are they the best? Depends on what you're talking about but I'm not sure how we got to this from Bose because they don't win those kinds of compliments in their price brackets.
Popular is sometimes a judge of what's good, sometimes not. But even still, you can call Paradigm or B&W or Axiom popular but they're popular among a small group of people. The masses don't generally think hard enough to even stumble across them.
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Originally Posted by emorphien
Perhaps you fail to grasp that in a certain price range there can be bests and worsts. Axiom, B&W, Paradigm (and whoever else you want to list) all offer some very good performance within and sometimes above their given price brackets. Are they the best? Depends on what you're talking about but I'm not sure how we got to this from Bose because they don't win those kinds of compliments in their price brackets.
Popular is sometimes a judge of what's good, sometimes not. But even still, you can call Paradigm or B&W or Axiom popular but they're popular among a small group of people. The masses don't generally think hard enough to even stumble across them.
Perhaps you fail to grasp the size of B&W and they are most definetly mass market. Axiom is big too, i want to know the page hits of this site and the amount that click on the banner and buy something. This entire thread is completely useless but B&W is definetly mass market same as Paradigm, JBL or Infinity. Not that its bad, but its still a product for the masses.
:-)
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Originally Posted by Florian
Perhaps you fail to grasp the size of B&W and they are most definetly mass market. Axiom is big too, i want to know the page hits of this site and the amount that click on the banner and buy something. This entire thread is completely useless but B&W is definetly mass market same as Paradigm, JBL or Infinity. Not that its bad, but its still a product for the masses.
:-)
Mass market isn't inherently bad however. You with your expensive tastes and seemingly limitless budget aren't like us mere mortals. They are an option to many people, and certainly deserve a look as do the smaller boutique brands. Axiom wasn't always "big" either but caught on fast.
B&W and Paradigm (and Axiom to an extent) are mass market but I'd say probably not at the level of JBL, Polk or Infinity. I've got no numbers, but based on what's available at most B&M stores and online retailers, those will probably tend to be big sellers and the most identifiable brands.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emorphien
Mass market isn't inherently bad however. You with your expensive tastes and seemingly limitless budget aren't like us mere mortals. They are an option to many people, and certainly deserve a look as do the smaller boutique brands. Axiom wasn't always "big" either but caught on fast.
B&W and Paradigm (and Axiom to an extent) are mass market but I'd say probably not at the level of JBL, Polk or Infinity. I've got no numbers, but based on what's available at most B&M stores and online retailers, those will probably tend to be big sellers and the most identifiable brands.
Wow the way i am going now ill be a millionäre in a week or two. B&W, Paradigm are definetly not like the low budget infinity and jbl designs that is true, but where do you get the idea from that i am filthy rich and loaded?
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I'd be willing to sit down with a plate of McHamburgers and listen to Florian's system anytime. Does that mean we can all get along????
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Originally Posted by jocko_nc
I'd be willing to sit down with a plate of McHamburgers and listen to Florian's system anytime. Does that mean we can all get along????
:cornut: Sure :-)
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Man, this thread's gone all over the place, hasn't it? I think the analogies made between Bose and McDonald's are wrong, since one very key issue has been left out: price. Whether one prefers Mickey D to Burker King, Wendy's or turns all three this way and that, all three fill a marketing strategy that's similar: offer reasonably good food at a low price, and offer it cionsistently, day after day after day. Fast food is immensely popular with Americans, not because of intense marketing, but because Americans like the stuff. No one forces anyone to eat at McDonald's (or any other fast food palace) yet, millions do on a daily basis, and enjoy themselves too.
Bose, on the other hand, sells a product that may in some ways be unique, and has always offered extensive marketing efforts behind those products. The nonsense of "direct-reflecting" sound from their "01" series of speakers was supported with more advertising and promotional in-store materials than practically all other speaker manufacturers combined. Personally, I thought it was pure BS, but, BOY, did they do a masterful job of promoting themselves, and supporting their dealers across the country.
I think there is no other company even remotely like Bose, and I think that's a good thing. Imagine a car company for example that launched a totally fabricated campaign about the "virtues" of that car as compared to others, promoted it extensively, and managed to get consumers to pay three, four and five times as much money for that car as another. Say what you will about BMW, Mercedes and others, they may be expensive, but they're all good automobiles. Bose products are, at best, OK, but priced astronomically high when compared to anything similar. That, and that alone, puts them in a class by themselves.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Florian
Well you know i do what i want anyways :-)
Well she is 5.2ft tall ( i am 6.3) so its kinda funny looking. She has long blond curly hair and loves music, lord of the rings and like me doesnt take **** from noone, and she gets what she wants. Pretty good match so far :-)
She sounds great. Carefull dancing.
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Originally Posted by emaidel
Man, this thread's gone all over the place, hasn't it? I think the analogies made between Bose and McDonald's are wrong, since one very key issue has been left out: price. Whether one prefers Mickey D to Burker King, Wendy's or turns all three this way and that, all three fill a marketing strategy that's similar: offer reasonably good food at a low price, and offer it cionsistently, day after day after day. Fast food is immensely popular with Americans, not because of intense marketing, but because Americans like the stuff. No one forces anyone to eat at McDonald's (or any other fast food palace) yet, millions do on a daily basis, and enjoy themselves too.
Bose, on the other hand, sells a product that may in some ways be unique, and has always offered extensive marketing efforts behind those products. The nonsense of "direct-reflecting" sound from their "01" series of speakers was supported with more advertising and promotional in-store materials than practically all other speaker manufacturers combined. Personally, I thought it was pure BS, but, BOY, did they do a masterful job of promoting themselves, and supporting their dealers across the country.
I think there is no other company even remotely like Bose, and I think that's a good thing. Imagine a car company for example that launched a totally fabricated campaign about the "virtues" of that car as compared to others, promoted it extensively, and managed to get consumers to pay three, four and five times as much money for that car as another. Say what you will about BMW, Mercedes and others, they may be expensive, but they're all good automobiles. Bose products are, at best, OK, but priced astronomically high when compared to anything similar. That, and that alone, puts them in a class by themselves.
That's it! You guys have made me hungry now. But should I get a good steak and listen to Bose or stop at Jollybees on my way to Flo's?
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Originally Posted by GMichael
That's it! You guys have made me hungry now. But should I get a good steak and listen to Bose or stop at Jollybees on my way to Flo's?
Just be sure to listen to your 8-track in your car on the way over!
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Originally Posted by emaidel
Just be sure to listen to your 8-track in your car on the way over!
Can't. :sad: I ran out of matchbook covers to shove under the corner of the tape. :incazzato:
Now I get to hear three songs at once. It's kind of like being at a parade. :idea:
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Well, anyone who pays...
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Originally Posted by jocko_nc
I stand corrected. "321" is a two channel system. Yipes. $1400.00 for a DVD player, two plastic speakers, and a bass box...Just add a cheesy sub (woofer).
...MSRP is a fool...that system can be had for around $700 at some "warehouse" retailers...yeah, I know another nail in it's coffin, but for someone looking for plug'n'play convenience, what could be better than picking it up, along with the five-pounder of Doritos and a gallon of Taco-Bell salsa?
And quite honestly, none of the HT stuff they peddle sounds particularly bad...after all it's only tee-vee with a fancy name...as if the average Joe gives a r@t's @$$ about soundstage or any of the supercilious audiopile BS...bring on the laser totin' mechanical lizards and pass me a cold one...
BTW, for the record...it's not a sub...and the cheese is on the nachos...
jimHJJ(...ah! the altruistic audio-geek...)
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Originally Posted by GMichael
Hey Flo,
You should do what makes you happy. Eveyone has their own dreams to chase. Don't let anyone tell you what should mean the most to you. Not that you needed me to tell you that.
A girlfriend huh? Been holding out on your buddies? So? What's she like? Is she 6' and blonde? Come on man. Spill it.
You may already know that much of what I make already goes overseas to my wife's family. They are very poor and need it just to put food on the table.
GMichael you are awesome. I could not respect you anymore than I do right now.
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Originally Posted by JohnMichael
GMichael you are awesome. I could not respect you anymore than I do right now.
Thanks, but will you still respect me in the morning?:yikes:
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Originally Posted by Resident Loser
...MSRP is a fool...that system can be had for around $700 at some "warehouse" retailers...yeah, I know another nail in it's coffin, but for someone looking for plug'n'play convenience, what could be better than picking it up, along with the five-pounder of Doritos and a gallon of Taco-Bell salsa?
And quite honestly, none of the HT stuff they peddle sounds particularly bad...after all it's only tee-vee with a fancy name...as if the average Joe gives a r@t's @$$ about soundstage or any of the supercilious audiopile BS...bring on the laser totin' mechanical lizards and pass me a cold one...
BTW, for the record...it's not a sub...and the cheese is on the nachos...
jimHJJ(...ah! the altruistic audio-geek...)
Right, these are the easy way for people who don't want to mix & match. One thing to buy. One thing to plug in. It sounds "good enough." Actually, they don't sound bad. Just not the best for the buck. I have a Yamaha 6.1 HTIB system (that I got free, sorta). List price was $750 when it was new. You could buy it for less now, I'm sure. Bet it sounds better than the 3.1. But who cares? The 3.1 is easier. And you get to tell your friends (who also don't care) that you have the best. It says Bose. They are the best.
You got a laser totin' mechanical lizard? Way cool! Can I have a cold one too?
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Originally Posted by GMichael
Thanks, but will you still respect me in the morning?:yikes:
I'll let you know in the morning.:blush2:
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Originally Posted by jocko_nc
I find the whole Bose arguement fascinating...
I cannot think of another company in another industry analogous to Bose. Their products, brand name, and pricing. Seriously, I think their story is unique. Someone help me out here, name another company that has managed to pull off what Bose has done.
The closest analogy I can come up with is Jaguar autos in the near past. They really did have a mystique and brand loyalty that far exceeded the cars they were producung. My in-laws have had a number of them since the 80's, some left a lot to be desired. Yet I have to give credit, they always did look fabulous.
There is probably a good analogy in fashion, I just don't know anything about it.
Somebody come up with an analogy and keep this Bose-bash thread going. Food. Travel. Appliances. Cars. Tools.
FWIW, my parents have a Bose system for which they no doubt paid a good bit of money. That sort of says it all.
jocko
Actually I can but no one ones it really happened. Iomega. At the time Iomega came out with their Zip Drive another company, Imation came out with the super disk. I could get into the technical reasons, but basically the Super Disk by Imation was far, far superior. However because of Iomega's marketing the Super Disk failed. People want to be told what to be no one wants to research. I blame the Zip disk for floppy drives existing today. Had the Super Disk technology won out it was backwards compatible with floppy disks. It just goes to show how adverstising beats out the better product.
I'm an IT technician and I get very annoyed a stupid consumers when I still have to use a floppy disk.
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