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  1. #1
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    Best Bang-for-the-Buc Sub (Choices, Choices)

    Please advise....

    1) 10"/250watt Infinity PS10 ($263)
    2) 12"/300watt Infinity PS12 ($322)
    3) 10" Titanic MKIII Kit ($350)
    4) 10" Polk PSW404 ($400)
    5) 10" HSU STF-2 ($425)
    6) 10" SVS PB10-ISD ($470)
    7) 12" Polk PSW505 ($500)
    8) 10" Velodyne DLS-3750R ($500)
    9) 10" HSU VTF-2 MK 2 ($525)

  2. #2
    My custom user title This Guy's Avatar
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    there's a topic just like this down the page. read it cause this has already been covered.

  3. #3
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    I would add the Adire Rava and the Acoustic Visions MRS-10 to your list as well. Those are sealed subs, which might work better for you if you have a smaller room.

    Rather than get too obsessive about which sub to choose, you should also get to know how to properly set the thing up and how to address room acoustical issues. As you get further into the lower frequencies, the room's influence over the bass increases dramatically. Some of the threads this week on the Behringer Feedback Destroyer (BFD) are a very good introduction to this topic. IMO, addressing room issues is every bit as important as which subwoofer you choose.

  4. #4
    BooBs are elitist jerks shokhead's Avatar
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    svsubwoofer 25-31pci
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    The 10'' Titanic Mark III kit will outperform any of those subs and most that cost sugnificantly more. It is an easy and quick set up and I would definatly recomend it.
    -Shwamdoo

  6. #6
    BooBs are elitist jerks shokhead's Avatar
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    Do a comparison spec sheet between the 25-31,the mark III and hus vtf and see how they do on paper.
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    Spec Sheet - Titanic Mark III

    Sounds like a good idea, what specs should I really be keying in on? Not to experienced when it comes to great subs.


    Shwamdoo: I take it you own, have owned, at least heard the Titanic?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by shokhead
    Do a comparison spec sheet between the 25-31,the mark III and hus vtf and see how they do on paper.
    The specs taken outside in a "quasi-anechoic chamber" are meaningless at best. One would have to decide if sound quality or bass extension is the determining factor for purchasing a sub first. Will it be used for HT or music primarily?

    Port the Titanic and it's a whole new ballgame...seal the other two and see how they do. I'd personally be wary of anyone selling subwoofer based on specs alone. There is a world of difference in sound between ported and sealed designs. If you want added boom and extension at the expense of musical refinement, then I would recommend a ported sub.
    There's some Sony speakers out there with better specs than Dynadio's...doesn't mean anything.

    Jamison162: The best comparison I can give is my subjective opinion. I traded in a VTF-2 to buy a PW-2200, this was a fantastic upgrade. I later built my parents the 12" Titanic MKIII. It was a better sub than mine for less money.
    You'll have to make a decision yourself though. SVS fans claim SVS subs are the best, Hsu Research fans haven't been impressed with SVS offerings. How many of these people have actually listened to different models at the same time in the same room? Probably very few.

    Though I haven't heard the Rava, I have heard Dayton DVC subs which use the almost identical driver (built by the same manufacturer). The Rava's driver is a small step up on the DVC and by everything I've heard from installers/builders familiar with both, is a better value. With a nice oak veneered cabinet already included, I would tend to recommend this.

    Given the wide variety of designs and personal tastes, it's doubtful a "best value" will emerge.

  9. #9
    BooBs are elitist jerks shokhead's Avatar
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    Of course you dont just go by spec's,never said that but it is where most start at to see which are in there ballpark. I would'nt waste my time with a sub that showed it would do 35Hz@90DB. Thats off my list to even bother with but one that says 25Hz@105Db,then i'm checking it out. I'm a beliver in testing,not just buying from spec's but they are a starting point to weed out the ones not meeting what your looking for.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by shokhead
    Of course you dont just go by spec's,never said that but it is where most start at to see which are in there ballpark. I would'nt waste my time with a sub that showed it would do 35Hz@90DB. Thats off my list to even bother with but one that says 25Hz@105Db,then i'm checking it out. I'm a beliver in testing,not just buying from spec's but they are a starting point to weed out the ones not meeting what your looking for.
    This sort of tells me you'd use a subwoofer for both music and HT. I don't think I'd buy a subwoofer that didn't go to at least the high 20 Hz for HT either. For music only, I wouldn't worry about much below 30 Hz, I'd look for short xmax, and definitely a sealed cabinet. Any classical or even electronic music I listen to rarely has signals in the 20's and I'b willing to lose that 1% if the next octave up was better. Better yet though, buy an inexpensive 15" woofer and have the best of both worlds.

    Of course, it depends on your speakers as well. Ported cabinets often have a hump in the response at higher bass frequencies, hopefully your speakers could be crossed over low enough to avoid this.

  11. #11
    BooBs are elitist jerks shokhead's Avatar
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    Funny tou should say that as i have a 15" Klipsch sub{not real cheap at 1000 bucks at trhe time} and found my B&W 603's worked beetwer with a 60Hz x over then an 80.
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    Smile Jamison162

    To answer your question Jamison162, I helped my friend build a Titanic Kit about three weeks ago. It was incredibly speedy build and it sounds fantastic. It definitly outperforms the Polk Audio PSW subwoofers and the SVS and Velodyne subs that I have heard within its price range. It doesn't look that bad for a kit either.
    -Shwamdoo

  13. #13
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    Adire Audio

    I finally got to researching Adire Audio. For $399+shipping the 12"/250watt Adire Rava looks and "sounds" unbelievable. Not a kit either, I believe it comes fully assembled. I wonder why they don't use the spiked feet. I'll prolly go this route or the Titantic MK III 10" or 12" kit. Either of these two options would be better than the Infinity PS10 or PS12 right?

    Any reviews?

  14. #14
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamison162
    I finally got to researching Adire Audio. For $399+shipping the 12"/250watt Adire Rava looks and "sounds" unbelievable. Not a kit either, I believe it comes fully assembled. I wonder why they don't use the spiked feet. I'll prolly go this route or the Titantic MK III 10" or 12" kit. Either of these two options would be better than the Infinity PS10 or PS12 right?
    Here's a review for the Rava ...

    http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...er-6-2002.html

    I use a Rava in my system and it's formidable sub for the price. The common perception is that it is a "musical" sub and not well suited for home theater. But, in my experience, it has more than enough low end pop for all but the deepest HT effects. It lacks spiked feet, but you could always install your own. I simply use a set of rubber feet since I have hardwood floors that I don't want damaged by spikes.

    The in-room response that I have is flat down to 25 Hz, and -3 db at 22 Hz and -7 db at 20 Hz. Keep in mind that I use a parametric EQ to tame the room induced peaks. Without the EQ, my in-room response would have had three frequency peaks of at least +10 db.

    My room is less than 400 sq.ft., so there's a lot of room gain that boosts the low bass. This is the reason why I opted for a sealed sub, and at the time I bought the Rava, it was the only preassembled option I could find for under $500. Since then, several new options have become available.

  15. #15
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    My understanding of the 10" Titanic is that most people use it for car systems, not home theater or even stereo, though some would use it for the latter. The 12" Titanic is a far superior unit to the 10", worth the money if you can spring for it (free shipping too).
    If your room isn't huge though you can easily get by with the Rava, $400 with oak veneer is a really good deal. All comes down to how much you want to spend.
    I really think for your purposes, the 10" Titanic isn't the right sub for you.

  16. #16
    BooBs are elitist jerks shokhead's Avatar
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    What is a musical sub vs a movie sub? Whats makes a sub better or worst for music? A good sub is a good sub.
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  17. #17
    Silence of the spam Site Moderator Geoffcin's Avatar
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    Sound & Vision did a review of "budget subs" a few months back

    Quote Originally Posted by jamison162
    Please advise....

    1) 10"/250watt Infinity PS10 ($263)
    2) 12"/300watt Infinity PS12 ($322)
    3) 10" Titanic MKIII Kit ($350)
    4) 10" Polk PSW404 ($400)
    5) 10" HSU STF-2 ($425)
    6) 10" SVS PB10-ISD ($470)
    7) 12" Polk PSW505 ($500)
    8) 10" Velodyne DLS-3750R ($500)
    9) 10" HSU VTF-2 MK 2 ($525)
    I don't have the review handy, but I remember the the PSB sub came out the winner. I've never heard that sub, but it won both the performance specs, and the listening tests. If I were in the market I would at least look them up.
    Audio;
    Ming Da MC34-AB 75wpc
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    PS Audio 4.5 preamp,
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    Arcam Alpha 9 CD.- 24 bit dCS Ring DAC.
    Magnepan 3.6r speakers Oak/black,

  18. #18
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shokhead
    What is a musical sub vs a movie sub? Whats makes a sub better or worst for music? A good sub is a good sub.
    You are correct in that a good sub should be a good sub. There's no reason why any sub couldn't be used for both purposes with good results. However it is a well known fact that certain design parameters lend themselves to enhancing the musicality of a subwoofer or the suitability for its use in home theater.
    Consider that the typical home theater will turn the output of the subwoofer up a bit higher than that of a stereo only application. We wouldn't expect the same level of output for U-571 as we would for Neil Young or something.
    Ported designs are known for two things: lower bass extension and higher SPL. But to acheive this they sacrifice a few things, tightness and transient response. Sealed subs are known for being much less "boomy" and naturally have zero port noise or port resonance. A sealed sub uses the woofer to achieve it's bass extension, whereas a ported sub relies on the hollow cabinet to take over. The bass roll-off of a ported sub is also much faster than a sealed, which can make specs misleading.
    You'll typically see people describing the sound of a ported sub as a "bah" and the sound of a sealed sub as a "pah".

    The great thing about ported subs is they get you alot of extra bass for cheap, usually with a lower F3. The downside is the sound quality. Since most of us have budget constraints, ported subs are nice. I have a ported unit right now, PW-2200. It's being replaced with a sealed sub with an F3 of 21Hz and extension down to 17Hz or so, I should be able to get the best of both worlds.

  19. #19
    BooBs are elitist jerks shokhead's Avatar
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    Talking

    Interesting.
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  20. #20
    rod
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    Velodyne.

  21. #21
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    Rava

    Do you think the Rava would be adequate for my room size and needs. 19' x 19' with 11' ceilings and hardwood floors. Not gonna be able to watch all our movies full-on. Yall know how woman are about bass and I have a 1.5 yr old to think about. Just wanna fill in whats missing in the low end with my Polk RTi Series system. I would like to feel a little rumble/vibration with say Jurassic Park, but I don't wanna knock any pictures off the wall or split the crown moulding.

  22. #22
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    I've done quite well with a PW-2200 in 2 rooms larger than yours. Unless you're really demanding 100+ dB of SPL consistently you shouldn't have much problem. Actually the Rava has a legit long excursion woofer, lots of air being pushed by that unit.
    To be honest, if the Rava doesn't cut it in your room, I'm doubtful any 12" worth listening to at loud SPL's is going to be enough, in which case you're stuck looking at 15" subs (and increasing the budget) or adding a second sub.
    Do you have a sub now, and if so how does it handle? Do you have an SPL meter to measure your typical listening volumes from your seating position?

    I'd be shocked if any of the 12" units mentioned in this thread weren't sufficient for you.

  23. #23
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    Good answer....

    Currently no sub. I have been putting together a new system.

    My previous HT experience: 1st system was a Sony HTIB, not bad but I soon wanted more; I remember those satellites and sub really sucked - but surround sound was cool.

    I moved on to the Onkyo LSV-500C HTIB. A step in the right direction, however, I soon found that I did not like the Receiver/5 DVD player combo unit and starting having trouble with the player. The speakers weren't bad and the 8" downfiring sub (sealed enclosure I believe) was nice. I still had trouble with the wife on turning it up to take full advantage during action flix.

    Anyways, I sold the Onkyo and have purchased a Denon AVR 1804 Receiver, Denon DVD 2200, and Polk Audio Speakers (RTi4 fronts, CSi3 center, and FXi3 surrounds). I also have a pair of JBL Northridge Outdoor Speaker on the screened porch.

    Just need my sub. A 10" would prolly do it, but I can always turn down the 12" and have the extra punch if i ever want/need it. The Rava sounds great at $399.

    Thanks all! I'll let you guys know how it works out!

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