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  1. #1
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    Angry Death of a Community

    Is it just me or has this new board format killed our old community ?

    Has the activity level dropped due to a change of format ?

    Seems counterproductive....................

  2. #2
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    This new format hasn't helped up postings and attendance

    At least from what I can observe.

    Oh well.

    Guess who's doing a solo gig here in January?

    Jon.

    Dave

  3. #3
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    I thought you would agree Dave.

    You and I have been discussing great tunes here on this board for 6 years now........did you realize it had been that long ?

    I don't recall a time when the activity level has been as low as it is right now...............sad.

    Why is Jon solo ? Are you planning to attend ?

  4. #4
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    I saw it coming from day 1

    I *****ed in the verry beginning and a bunch of folks chimed in and said they were used to it and liked it. Yeah right. Thats called going with the crowd. I said from the start that if you can't read the headers and follow who replied to what, action is going to drop. The site is also real slow and now all the gimmicks and stupid avatars have to load along with all the advertisements.

    I chose to stay and give it a try.....it sucks! The main reason it was done was to make it easy for administration and nobody cares how it effects the users. Yes I know it's free but that does not make it any easier. The lame reason about how it's the most popular type board, doesn't flush. The reason it's the most popular is because it's the cheapest code, easy for admin, and it's the one they cram down your throat. They tell you it's popular therefore it must be.....Kinda like the stupid show-Everybody Loves Ramond. Would anyone watch if it was called-Everyone Hates Rymond? I doubt it but because they told people everybody loves him, of course the crowd followers are right there sucking it up.


    OK back to class.......

    I'll take the old board back in a heartbeat but I don't think it will be a happening.

  5. #5
    Crackhead Extraordinaire Dusty Chalk's Avatar
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    I don't know what you're talking about. Troy and I and several others just had an extended discussion in this thread, and on a weekend, no less. Anything that fills up over one page (see the little 1 2?) is got to be a pretty "hot topic" by our standards.
    Eschew fascism.
    Truth Will Out.
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    you guys are crackheads.
    I remain,
    Peter aka Dusty Chalk

  6. #6
    Dubgazer -Jar-'s Avatar
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    not leaving

    The place feels different. There's no doubt about that. I think folks are less likely to post tangent threads or responses with this new format. Much less sprouting of mutant branches off the threads, so to speak.

    I'm not leaving. But it's not the same as it was. I can't disconnect my idea of what our community was with the way the board looked before the change. It feels like it was decided that we would move to a completely different website, and not everyone made the trip. And even with the friends that are here, the feel is just, not the same.

    In a way it's good though, because, we are getting more new folks posting. But it's more work to read through the threads. I find myself not reading as much as I used to.

    my fiddy cent.

    -jar-
    If being afraid is a crime we'll hang side-by-side,
    at the swingin' party down the line..


    The Replacements

  7. #7
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    Yeah, wot Jar said.

    My own decline in activity lately has been partly due to my recent work activity and travel schedule. But yeah, the new format has changed the chemistry here, and not necessarily in a good way.

    Then again, I could help to change that by posting an interesting new thread topic. Maybe one will spring to mind...
    Mr. MidFi
    Master of the Obvious

  8. #8
    all around good guy Jim Clark's Avatar
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    Ya, sure. The old board was brimming with non-stop action everyday. Or can it be that you have simply forgotten? Come on, you're not that old and it hasn't been that long.

    I can't speak for anyone else but this is by far the busiest time of the year for me. I simply don't have the time right now to read every thread and post to threads the way I'd like to. I imagine others are in the same boat.

    People have and will continue to join in, others will continue to lose interest and drop off, just as always. One big difference is now the lurkers get to look at all the posts complaining how bad this site is. I'm sure people are just clammoring to join a community when the members are calling it dead. Not expecting you or anyone else to sign on to become a AR cheerleader but you sure as heck aren't helping matters. Of course that remains my opinion and it's simply that, an opinion.

    I've never been what you would call a positive person. Others may see it as negative, I've always preferred to call it 'realistic'. This is what it is. Nothing less but it could always be more. It can be whatever we make it. I don't expect you or anyone else to hang around if it becomes a chore and is no longer enjoyable. I know for a fact that when I quit having fun here I'm going to be doing something else. Until that time comes I'm going to make the best of it. I hope that others do as well.

    Regards,
    jc
    "Ahh, cartoons! America's only native art form. I don't count jazz 'cuz it sucks"- Bartholomew J. Simpson

  9. #9
    Close 'n PlayŽ user Troy's Avatar
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    I'm in Jim Clark's camp on this.

    This board is not THAT dead. You forget how quiet the old board got sometimes. Ebb and flow. People come and people go. People get busy and can't post for a while. They come back or they don't. New blood comes, old blood goes. That's life on the BB scene.

    If you are using a dial up and think this board is slow, my question to you is "Aren't you USED to stuff loading slow"? I mean, the design of the www is quickly converting over to compatability for high speed users at an alarming rate so MOST sites must load horribly slow for you anyway. With a high speed connection, this site loads like, instantly. Plus the ignore feature is great. Not that I have anyone ignored, but I'm looking foreward to trying it when a certain someone comes around and gets obnoxious.

    Hate the pop ups? Use a pop up blocker.

    The lack of usable threading here is annoying, but so what. Deal. You can see if there's a new post on a thread and if it's a thread that you're following you open it and scroll down to see the new post. Why is that hard? Don't know who they are responding to? Well, maybe they could use the repy quote feature . . .

    Yes, it's different. Not worse or better, just . . . different.

    Some people just hate change.

  10. #10
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    Egad!

    6 years?

    Holy crud!

    I deal with change, it ain't no biggie to me.

    I'll post here regardless of the format, I don't really care.

    One thing tho I don't know how to post a reply to a specific segment of a thread, can you do that?

    YES, Jon Anderson is doing a solo gig here. Him and a bunch of midi synched instruments and all. Would'nt miss it!

    Should be very interesting. I'm bringing my pyramid, crystals, peace/love/cool items, and other etherial devices to insure that I get in the groove with Jon and his aura.

    Dave

  11. #11
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    If I am interpreting the numbers correctly, the last thirty days of the old format had 53 new topics. The past thirty days on the new format has 178 topics! Both had their share of topics surrounding the changeover. If you click around to sort the topics by the number of responses, you see that many have 20-40 posts. I don't recall many topics from the old format getting that many responses.

    Being a partial-lurker myself, I'm finding myself posting more since the changeover, which I think is as much related to me enjoying a "music-rich" mood lately as it is my being comfortable with the new format. This software is essentially what every other forum site is using (I'll bet AA is looking into it also). I am also seeing a lot of new names on the site. Perhaps the changeover was coincidental to a bunch of newbies finding this place, but I think that it means more lurkers are finding the new format easier to respond.

    This place almost died a year or so ago, and they know that they have to bring in a lot of hits to boost their ad revenue. It's business.

    It's ironic how this new software has challenged a community that prides itself for it's constant quest for new music.

  12. #12
    Close 'n PlayŽ user Troy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave_G
    One thing tho I don't know how to post a reply to a specific segment of a thread, can you do that?
    See, by hitting "Reply with Quote", it's easy for everyone to see what part of the thread you are replying to.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave_G
    Should be very interesting. I'm bringing my pyramid, crystals, peace/love/cool items, and other etherial devices to insure that I get in the groove with Jon and his aura.
    LOL. Kiss my aura, Dora.

    I'm dyin to hear about this show.

  13. #13
    Forum Regular JDaniel's Avatar
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    Puleaase - What's the big deal?

    I don't get the flap. My only annoyance is that I can't see the threaded (or is that dreaded) replies on the main page. But with the modified view I can see them.

    Satisfying everyone around here is like wishing for peace in the Middle East - NEWSFLASH - IT AIN'T GOING TO HAPPEN.

    Let's see - it takes me the same amount of time to type a post as before. The pages load in the same amount of time as before (and I have dial-up at home, fast access at work). Reading a post takes the same time as before, and now even quicker sometimes because I can just place the cursor over the topic line and read the first paragraph. I've never had pop-ups because I use pop-up blocker. I personally like the PM and email options.

    I've said it before - what makes this place fun is you guys/gals, and your comments. Change is good. Imagine if music never changed - if all you had to listen to was Hotel California over and over and over.

    We had horribly slow times before at the old board. And then we'd have complaints because their was too much activity because of all the responses to one of Yech's posts. Before we had complaints that their aren't enough new people. I've seen more new people post in the past month than in a long while, and now what do we have - more complaining.

    If you don't like it - leave (that's not what I want to see mind you, but complaining isn't helping anybody). I think it is (or could be) as good as the old board. It's the people that matter, not the format.

    My rant for the day.

    JD

  14. #14
    Toon Robber tentoze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDaniel
    I don't get the flap. My only annoyance is that I can't see the threaded (or is that dreaded) replies on the main page. But with the modified view I can see them.

    Satisfying everyone around here is like wishing for peace in the Middle East - NEWSFLASH - IT AIN'T GOING TO HAPPEN.

    Let's see - it takes me the same amount of time to type a post as before. The pages load in the same amount of time as before (and I have dial-up at home, fast access at work). Reading a post takes the same time as before, and now even quicker sometimes because I can just place the cursor over the topic line and read the first paragraph. I've never had pop-ups because I use pop-up blocker. I personally like the PM and email options.

    I've said it before - what makes this place fun is you guys/gals, and your comments. Change is good. Imagine if music never changed - if all you had to listen to was Hotel California over and over and over.

    We had horribly slow times before at the old board. And then we'd have complaints because their was too much activity because of all the responses to one of Yech's posts. Before we had complaints that their aren't enough new people. I've seen more new people post in the past month than in a long while, and now what do we have - more complaining.

    If you don't like it - leave (that's not what I want to see mind you, but complaining isn't helping anybody). I think it is (or could be) as good as the old board. It's the people that matter, not the format.

    My rant for the day.

    JD
    I'm in the "Quit Whining" camp on this issue. Not that I'm an old-timer here or anything, but the current venue can be anything the participants want to make of it. The past is not coming back around.
    ----Never Off Topic, Never Rude-----

  15. #15
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    "I'm in the "Quit Whining" camp on this issue. Not that I'm an old-timer here or anything, but the current venue can be anything the participants want to make of it. The past is not coming back around."


    Right!

    That's also why we won't see a Genesis reunion or Pink Floyd reunion.


    Dave

  16. #16
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    I enjoyed reading this thread - it was very tell-tale of how people have reacted to this system change. A few started posting complaints and stated how "dead" things looked, and then, all the sudden, more people chimed in with more positive comments.

    For those who think the board is less active, one user above has pointed out that it isn't the case. Do a comparison and you'll see for yourself. Maybe you're just used to the old layout, which may have made it look busier in your opinion. Less troll posts might have something to do with it too.

    I particularly find a comment made by Hyfi pretty frustrating. We've explained in great detail (on a few occasions) what went into our decision to buy this software - and no it wasn't the cheapest. In fact, it was probably among the most expensive choices. But if you were to research as much as we did, you would have found that out too. If anyone can show me a better, more widely used forums system, I'd be happy to see it. Show me a system that is used more than vBulletin, and I'll tell you why we didn't choose it.

    We're not trying to fool anyone. You all have access to the internet like we do, and can quickly see what the most widely used forums system is - when you realize we weren't lying, maybe then you'll see we didn't make this change for our own reasons - we made it for the users. It's a difficult change for some, but evidently easier for others. Public moaning and groaning isn't going to help anything. There is pretty much no chance of going back to the old system, so please make the best of things and try to get used to this new system. Make any suggestions or complaints in the Feedback forum so we can stay on top of any issues.

    Thanks to those who made an effort to see the positive side of this issue. We do appreciate it.

  17. #17
    Dubgazer -Jar-'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    Thanks to those who made an effort to see the positive side of this issue. We do appreciate it.
    Sorry if I came off sounding like a grump. I love this group of people (mostly). Things are just different now.. not worse.. it will take a while for things to gel. Even though I've used this format for over a year at Head-fi, its different when it's a place you consider your home on the web. This is it. It's like moving into a new house. It will never have the exact charm of the old house, we just have to make our home here.

    btw, Chris, ever you ever seen the message board system at the Motley Fool? Whoa.. that's the Cadillac of boards.. Though it's actually more like this (all responses are 'in-line'), there's a lot of pretty cool things you can do.. it was free for a while, but now they charge admission..

    -jar-
    If being afraid is a crime we'll hang side-by-side,
    at the swingin' party down the line..


    The Replacements

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Jar-
    btw, Chris, ever you ever seen the message board system at the Motley Fool? Whoa.. that's the Cadillac of boards.. Though it's actually more like this (all responses are 'in-line'), there's a lot of pretty cool things you can do.. it was free for a while, but now they charge admission..

    -jar-
    Yeah, they use custom code. It is pretty cool. We weren't in a position to build anything like that. We needed to find an "off the shelf" product. Something that is upgradable and that we could get support for. Custom code is something we can't do much of anymore.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    I particularly find a comment made by Hyfi pretty frustrating.

    Yes I may have shot from the hip with out all your facts.Thats not unusual. It still sucks, but I stayed and have tried to keep up some of the conversation if you noticed that. There are plenty of folks that no longer post like they used to. Yes there are new people and thats a great thing. And yes the posts appear to be large in numbers but most of them are from the same handfull of people.

    I will never like this layout no matter what the expanation is but because I do like the people and the content I will hang on for a while. I still miss out on half of what I would have read in the past since the headers are useless now and without the quote you have a hard time figuring out who is talking to who. I also hate all the wasted bandwith used for all the gimmicks that don't make this place any better.

    And for all the comments about "Those still using dialup" excuse me for having other priorities with my cash.

    Chris- just ignore me. I am the people you just can't make happy.

  20. #20
    Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyfi
    And for all the comments about "Those still using dialup" excuse me for having other priorities with my cash.

    Chris- just ignore me. I am the people you just can't make happy.
    No problem - a quick suggestion if you are on dialup - Go into your Profile and click Options. You can choose not to "see" all of the cute little icons (the avatars, smilies, image attachments, and signature files). Just turn those off and it should help speed things up for you. Maybe I'll write up a suggestion post for those who want to set up their viewing preferences for bare bones speed and no fluff. I think there's a few more things you can do.

  21. #21
    Crackhead Extraordinaire Dusty Chalk's Avatar
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    Chris -- if there is any way to configure the system so that it displays how many responses there have been to a thread for that user, I think that would help, too. Even if it's color-coded -- 5 or more responses since the last time you visited a thread == red, etc.

    Finally, I think it'll also help once you fix the time bug. Sometimes it gets stuck on a certain response, even though others have posted since then.

    There's a patch for vBulletin for the time bug, I think.

    But just so that you don't think I have nothing but positive to say about this board, I do have one negative -- just because it's what everyone else uses, doesn't mean it's the best choice. I know the reason a lot of us like this place and AA, and not, for example, Audiogon -- as far as forums and community and posting is concerned -- was because of the threaded responses -- that's just a lot easier to read than the vBulletin style "columnar" viewing. I will miss that.
    Eschew fascism.
    Truth Will Out.
    Quote Originally Posted by stevef22
    you guys are crackheads.
    I remain,
    Peter aka Dusty Chalk

  22. #22
    Indifferentist Slosh's Avatar
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    I'm starting to change my tune

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    I enjoyed reading this thread - it was very tell-tale of how people have reacted to this system change. A few started posting complaints and stated how "dead" things looked, and then, all the sudden, more people chimed in with more positive comments.

    ...snip-snip...

    Thanks to those who made an effort to see the positive side of this issue. We do appreciate it.

    Chris, just wanted to thank you. It's nice to have an administrator who cares around here again It's been a long while.

    I also miss the threaded view. Not only for being able to quickly see if you wanted to read the thread in the first place; but also because you could have a bit of fun with the subject lines.

    But...I've really come to appreciate some things about the new software. First and foremost being it can resurect an old thread since a new reply puts it back on top of the page. Take my "Best of '03" thread from Saturday, for example. I bet if I had posted it on the old board it might have gotten 50 or so views and a handful of responses before being knocked off of the current page. With this software it has received more than a couple of dozen replies and has led to some new discussions. I also really like the private message option and being able to edit typos, etc. and not having to cut and paste to reply with a quote.

    All that being said I'd still prefer having a threaded view for the whole main page rather than the (basically) useless threaded/hybrid option we have now (you still must open a thread to see who replied so it doesn't save any time), but those who say Consumer Reviews doesn't care about its users just aren't paying attention.

  23. #23
    Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dusty Chalk
    Chris -- if there is any way to configure the system so that it displays how many responses there have been to a thread for that user, I think that would help, too. Even if it's color-coded -- 5 or more responses since the last time you visited a thread == red, etc.

    Finally, I think it'll also help once you fix the time bug. Sometimes it gets stuck on a certain response, even though others have posted since then.

    There's a patch for vBulletin for the time bug, I think.

    But just so that you don't think I have nothing but positive to say about this board, I do have one negative -- just because it's what everyone else uses, doesn't mean it's the best choice. I know the reason a lot of us like this place and AA, and not, for example, Audiogon -- as far as forums and community and posting is concerned -- was because of the threaded responses -- that's just a lot easier to read than the vBulletin style "columnar" viewing. I will miss that.
    I don't think that's possible, but I'll check.

    As for the threaded issue - I know many people will miss it. It really was cool for some uses. But the fact that all of the internet communities who use this software have very few requests for a threaded board tell me that the percentage of people who want that style forum is pretty small in comparison to the number who like this vBulletin style. Not to say that the percentage of people on this site necessarily reflects that, but it probably means that the majority here will end up liking this new system as well. Our hopes is that all the other great features will help outweight the things you miss either way.

  24. #24
    Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slosh
    Chris, just wanted to thank you. It's nice to have an administrator who cares around here again It's been a long while.

    I also miss the threaded view. Not only for being able to quickly see if you wanted to read the thread in the first place; but also because you could have a bit of fun with the subject lines.

    But...I've really come to appreciate some things about the new software. First and foremost being it can resurect an old thread since a new reply puts it back on top of the page. Take my "Best of '03" thread from Saturday, for example. I bet if I had posted it on the old board it might have gotten 50 or so views and a handful of responses before being knocked off of the current page. With this software it has received more than a couple of dozen replies and has led to some new discussions. I also really like the private message option and being able to edit typos, etc. and not having to cut and paste to reply with a quote.

    All that being said I'd still prefer having a threaded view for the whole main page rather than the (basically) useless threaded/hybrid option we have now (you still must open a thread to see who replied so it doesn't save any time), but those who say Consumer Reviews doesn't care about its users just aren't paying attention.
    Appreciate the kind words.

  25. #25
    Chris's Avatar
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    Moving this to the Site Feedback forum...

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