Subwoofers and Music Listening

[dirtyharry]

Anybody knows what the signal level is for the subwoofer output in A/V Receivers ?
I've been trying to use a standard audio amplifier to power passive subwoofer speakers unsuccessfuly.

I'm not happy with the way home theater active subwoofers treat bass sounds when it comes to listening to music (for movies are fine).

That's why I would prefer to use car subwoofers in my home, with an external amplifier.

Regards,
Daniel.

[N. Abstentia]

Unless your room is no bigger than 4' x 6' with a trunk for horn loading, I can think of no good reason to use a car subwoofer in a house.

Exactly which home subwoofers have you tried in your house that sounded so bad?

[toenail]

I can think of a great reason to use car audio gear in the home, you may already have it laying around from an old install. I'm using a pair of JL Audio 12's in a clamshell isobaric configuration with a ported box. After taming some room issues with a Behringer Feedback Destroyer Pro I'm definitely +/-3db down to at least 18hz and it sounds amazing.

I can't see why the signal from the sub out on the AV receiver isn't acceptable for your application. On board or off board amp shouldn't matter.

[vr6ofpain]

I have a old velodyne sub for my dedicated music system... but for my surround system I am using a used NHT MA-1 90watt monoblock amp powering a leftover JL Audio 10W0 (10" single voice coil, decent magnet) in a ~$40 carpeted car audio store enclosure. Sounds very good. Honestly I think most acoustic suspension subs sound reasonable. It is not the most accurate, but it is definately powerful and sounds great with movies.

[toenail]

Something to take note of regarding car-fi subs and the JL Audio W-0 series specifically. The following was pointed out to me by a memeber of this board, and later verified by me through computer modeling and SPL measurements. Many car-fi manufacturers design subs with roll off that is quite high and steep to account for cabin gain caused by the size of the vehicles used for the application. The JL Audio W-0 series is no exception and doesn't offer much below 40hz depending on size of driver (8" vs 15" etc). I own two JL Audio 12 W-0's and struggled for quite while trying to figure out just where the sub 40hz bass was. I resorted to a complex isobaric ported design and was able to achieve excellent output to below 20hz. This makes a HUGE difference in perceived sound quality when listening to HT with LFE tracks. I point this out without the intent of knocking your system, just trying to make you aware of a much better opportunity. One caveat, with a single driver your options may be more limited.

[Richard Greene]

My home subwoofer is a DIY 15" Adire Audio Tempest driver in a sealed 0.5 QTC enclosure

For parties I use a "car subwoofer" (DIY 15" Kove Audio M15Z driver in a sealed 0.707 QTC enclosure) located in the corner about eight feet behind my home subwoofer.
I also prefer this sub for rap music because it has less output under 50Hz.
and rap often seems to have too much output under 50Hz. to my ears.

The main difference between these subwoofers other than the location is that my car subwoofer rolls off the bass 12dB/octave under about 50Hz.when used in a large living room rather than in a car ... while my home subwoofer does not (The Adire driver's FS spec is about one octave lower than the Kove driver).

When used in a mid-sized car, my car sub's bass roll off starts about one octave lower than when it is used in my large living room (bass roll off is 12dB/octave below about 25Hz. rather than starting at 50Hz.) due to the cabin gain (bass SPL ramp-up) in the sealed car.

[vr6ofpain]

Something to take note of regarding car-fi subs and the JL Audio W-0 series specifically. The following was pointed out to me by a memeber of this board, and later verified by me through computer modeling and SPL measurements. Many car-fi manufacturers design subs with roll off that is quite high and steep to account for cabin gain caused by the size of the vehicles used for the application. The JL Audio W-0 series is no exception and doesn't offer much below 40hz depending on size of driver (8" vs 15" etc). I own two JL Audio 12 W-0's and struggled for quite while trying to figure out just where the sub 40hz bass was. I resorted to a complex isobaric ported design and was able to achieve excellent output to below 20hz. This makes a HUGE difference in perceived sound quality when listening to HT with LFE tracks. I point this out without the intent of knocking your system, just trying to make you aware of a much better opportunity. One caveat, with a single driver your options may be more limited.

Well this is my "$hit" system anyway. Obviously I have not measured the response, but for the movies and music I have listened to, it sounds decent. More to the point, I had two spare 10W0's sitting around, I picked up the sealed enclosure for $40, and the NHT amp was ~$110 shipped off ebay. So it was a pretty cheap setup. I am not so sure about the roll off comment, but if you have actually measured this, then you would be right.

Maybe I should use of the the 10W3's I have. I have actually been watching higher powered mono block amps on ebay, because I have a dual chambered sealed box with two 10W3's in it. Though I was driving them with a high quality 600 watt amp when I had them in my car....so I would probably have to shell out some big money for a decent 600 watt home amp.

*note, if the above is confusing, I blame it on the wine and scotch I have consumed prior to replying to this post!

[Rock789]

my sub is an old fosgate punch 18" 4ohm sub...
it is in a ~24"x24"x18" sealed box and fires directly into a reverb chamber (I don't know the technical term) which is about ~24"x24"x6" with one of the sides open as the port (~24"x6")

I made this many years ago and have used it for a sub in my prologic system for many years...
now that I have a denon 2805, the sub seems much more controlled, and very nice for movies!

I am planning on making a home sub out of my old fosgate punch power 12" subs (2, 8ohm subs) so when I do this, I will need a bigger amp...

Hope this helps,
Mike

[A-Audiophile]

my sub is an old fosgate punch 18" 4ohm sub...
it is in a ~24"x24"x18" sealed box and fires directly into a reverb chamber (I don't know the technical term) which is about ~24"x24"x6" with one of the sides open as the port (~24"x6")

I made this many years ago and have used it for a sub in my prologic system for many years...
now that I have a denon 2805, the sub seems much more controlled, and very nice for movies!

I am planning on making a home sub out of my old fosgate punch power 12" subs (2, 8ohm subs) so when I do this, I will need a bigger amp...

Hope this helps,
Mike

I have a Klipsch 12" powered sub for HT....after the woofer blew I replaced it with a Fosgate Punch sub....big emprovement. I know of many MANY MANY car audio subs that can kick that pants off of 90% of the home subs on the market.