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  1. #1
    Stainmaster Finch Platte's Avatar
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    Unhappy This place is like a closet now.

    Everything is really neat, but it's all in boxes with labels on them. They're all stacked on top of one another, and I know the gist of what's in the boxes, but it's a pain in the ass to get the box out and look at all the stuff inside. Makes me not want to look.

    I like it better when everything is all laid out in front of you and you don't have to pull stuff out to see what's in it. I used to enjoy clicking on RR and seeing what's up, but now it's almost a feeling of dread- like it's work to dig all the stuff up. And to find out whether or now someone has responded to a post I've made, Jesus. I know, I know, it gets emailed to me, along with every other post I have the slightest connection with. I click on 'em, only to find out it's someone responding to someone else's post in a thread I posted in 3 days ago.

    I dunno- am I being too critical? Any new thoughts from youse guys?

    fp

  2. #2
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    Well,

    It's different for sure.

    Is MTBR all up in arms too?

    I never look there anymore.

    I'll continue to post here regardless of the format, doesn't really bother me, but there are a zillion options, huh.

    And ya I did kind of like the way you could look at the whole thread in the days of old...

    Anyway, keep on rocking and collecting all that weird ass music.

    Dave

  3. #3
    Stainmaster Finch Platte's Avatar
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    Is MTBR up in arms?

    Naw, things are still the same there, but Francis (mtbr founder) asked me if I think folks in that forum would like the look we have here. I told him I didn't know, yet.

    I dread that day, I think. Oh, well. Maybe it'll get me off this damn computer and out to ride my bike, eh?

    fp

    Pic is of Mark, during a ride/trailwork session we did on Monday.
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  4. #4
    Forum Regular MindGoneHaywire's Avatar
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    At first I didn't mind it so much, but I see no appreciable difference in the load times & now it's starting to look like more of a hindrance in general than an improvement. If it doesn't improve I can't see being able to be dedicated to this board as I was to the old one.

    This board is still far & away--by more than half--the most popular board on this site. A lot of the reason for that, though, is that the General board has pretty much been cut in half. That board used to outdo this one, but a lot of it was bullsh*t, & there were unbelievable problems with trolls there over the past couple of years, so it's probably by design. But in a way I think they might've done some damage to the forum in general. It does seem like a lot of the General regulars haven't been as active, since the new General board is audio-only, and there's an 'outside'-style board for non-audio topics that just doesn't seem as popular as the General board was before (or as popular as the Outside board on the Asylum). I think it's great that this is the biggest board on this site; the numbers are there to show Chris & his guys that here we have the most dedicated group of regulars on the entire AR site.

    But in spite of Jackson's helpful tip, it's still a big pain in the butt, and checking the board just has a different feel to it now--more cumbersome. We'll see what happens.

    I don't like others.

  5. #5
    Forum Regular BarryL's Avatar
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    I'm With You

    I'm willing to give this a try for a bit, but I really don't like it. It was great before when you could log-on, look quickly to see if there was anything new worth reading, and then get out. Now you have to click in, wait about 45 seconds, not knowing what you'll find, then click out, wait another 45 seconds. I also don't like that the threads keep moving around based on what was posted last. Maybe it's different if you're on high-speed.

    Yeah, it has some nice features. I like that you can put your mouse over a new post and read the first 50 words or so without clicking in, but that only applies to the original post.

    My current opinion is that I've stuck with this board for about six years, but now I'm wondering if it's more trouble than its worth. Maybe I'm just too busy at work right now and don't have the time to play.

  6. #6
    Close 'n PlayŽ user Troy's Avatar
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    Yes, J, "cumbersome" is the right word.

    You could use the view threads feature which will help a little.

    But overall, this site suffers from too many options, just like so many things in todays world. The people that design these things that we use every day don't understand that less is more. They just trowel on more functions that ruin the functionality of the whole experience.

    Just because the technology exists to take pictures with your cellphone doesn't mean its a worthwhile thing. Ditto text messaging. Just because it can store 500 numbers means that I won't be able to find any of them. I just want a phone that i can make a call on.

    These new BBs have the same problem. Audio Asylum has had the same excruciatingly simple and fast loading board since 1998. It kicks this thing's butt in terms of usability. Heck man, we just want come in, read some stuff, type a message and split.

    The experience for us is all in the posts, NOT the board itself.

  7. #7
    Musicaholic Forums Moderator ForeverAutumn's Avatar
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    Being too busy isn't the problem

    Quote Originally Posted by BarryL
    Maybe I'm just too busy at work right now and don't have the time to play.
    I'm bored as heck at work and have all the time in the world to play right now. And while this forum does have some nice features, there is certainly room for improvement. I agree that the old format was much easier (and more fun re: subject lines) to use.

    It would be unfortunate if those who are "old-timers" around here left the community just because the house has been renovated.

  8. #8
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    like I suggested earier and...

    Since everyone at least agrees that it's the people that make this place what it is, why can't we just make AA a better place by all of us agreeing to migrate over there and just pick up where this place left off.

    I only relied to this and Js post since they were right on top, other than that, like you said it's way too much trouble.

    I will not be posting here often.

  9. #9
    Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HYFI
    Since everyone at least agrees that it's the people that make this place what it is, why can't we just make AA a better place by all of us agreeing to migrate over there and just pick up where this place left off.

    I only relied to this and Js post since they were right on top, other than that, like you said it's way too much trouble.

    I will not be posting here often.
    It would be extremely unfortunate for people to leave just because things look and work differently. I understand that many of you who are voicing your dislike for the new system are the same people who loved the way the old system worked, and aren't happy with the thought of changing the way you use our forums. But to try and organize a movement to get others to leave our site to use another is a little unfair.

    Though it might seem unfair that we've changed our system and are forcing you to get used to it, we were pretty much forced to find an answer to the troll problem that has plagued this community for such a long time. We also needed a system with a powerful registration system that we could tie to our reviews section. We took a chance on a change, hoping that we could count on many of the long-time veterans who we've served for so long, to help us in the transition. We know it's the people that make this place what it is, and we're doing everything we can to make our users happy. Instead of threatening to leave because you don't like the change, why not try and make this place better by giving suggestions and share tips with other members on how to use these new forums more efficiently?

    Most people who participate in online communities have probably already been introduced to this style of forum, as it's the most popular forums system around. Chances are there are a few people who can suggest easy ways of using these forums, and can make your experience more enjoyable. For as much time and effort we're investing in our commitment to make these forums a better place recently, we'd really appreciate some help from our long-time members in getting everyone on board with the change instead of persuading others to leave.

  10. #10
    Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Troy
    Yes, J, "cumbersome" is the right word.

    You could use the view threads feature which will help a little.

    But overall, this site suffers from too many options, just like so many things in todays world. The people that design these things that we use every day don't understand that less is more. They just trowel on more functions that ruin the functionality of the whole experience.

    Just because the technology exists to take pictures with your cellphone doesn't mean its a worthwhile thing. Ditto text messaging. Just because it can store 500 numbers means that I won't be able to find any of them. I just want a phone that i can make a call on.

    These new BBs have the same problem. Audio Asylum has had the same excruciatingly simple and fast loading board since 1998. It kicks this thing's butt in terms of usability. Heck man, we just want come in, read some stuff, type a message and split.

    The experience for us is all in the posts, NOT the board itself.
    You've made the most sense here Troy. And believe me, I've done a LOT in trying to tone down much of the "extra" features that probably will be used very little around here. I've even toned down the colors so that people aren't bombarded with too much visual clutter. I'll see what else I can do to help. But at the same time, this complaint also verifies the fact that many just don't like change. They'll fight any change because they get "comfortable" with the way things work. I'm hoping people will get past this, since this new system is the best available, and just give it a chance. Again, I'll keep doing what I can to tone things down so it's less complicated.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    Most people who participate in online communities have probably already been introduced to this style of forum, as it's the most popular forums system around. Chances are there are a few people who can suggest easy ways of using these forums, and can make your experience more enjoyable. For as much time and effort we're investing in our commitment to make these forums a better place recently, we'd really appreciate some help from our long-time members in getting everyone on board with the change instead of persuading others to leave.

    Yup, and I don't use those forums either. If I can't see the threads, I won't waste my time weeding thru them all. As far as leaving.....I was only addressing those of us who are unhappy and would still like to keep a dialog going.

    Why could you not have used a similar source code like AA? No bullcrap gimmicks...just a board that loads fast and you can see the posts.

    New is not better. I'm sure there were other ways to stop the trolls besides ruining this board.

  12. #12
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    Works OK for me, at least I'm getting pretty used to it now. It does run slower for me than the other board which was already very slow, but what's new? Most people have a high speed connection now so there isn't much pressure to please the cheap-ass dialup $6.95/month holdouts like me

    But I was already pretty used to vB type boards so it wasn't any big adjustment for me. I've said in the past that I like the threaded type better for the tight community type of discussions we have here, but what can a site owner do nowadays if there isn't any commercial software available to handle that kind of board? Audio Asylum is a highly modified older type of software that bears little resemblance, if any, to the original code and is maintained by the site owner. And it is a user supported site at that, unlike this one which depends on advertisements. But anyway, like I said, it works OK for me and as long as the people I like to talk to stay around, I'm fine with it. And if it speeds up I'll probably post more. And if they make a few adjustments to the display columns, I wouldn't mind that at all either. Like who needs a ratings column? I have to expand the window to the whole screen just to give the subject box enough room so that it doesn't take up 3 or 4 lines on my 1024x768 notebook screen! Make that column wider and the others narrower already! OK, that's my suggestion for the day although I understand they have to maintain the same look across all the sites and most changes are probably not feasible to make here unless it is agreed on by all the sites. But thanks for all the effort Chris and I hope things at this site work out for the better in the long run for everyone, owners, managers, advertisers and users alike

    EDIT: Guess I wasn't paying attention this morning because the ratings column IS gone now. Thanks Chris. MUCH better!

    EDIT AGAIN: Wow, it even seems to be running much faster now! Thanks again, Chris. Hey, what's the story on the number of views? It seems to only be updated on an occasional basis. Is that a timed thing? They don't seem to change very often, and then all of a sudden there is a big jump.
    Last edited by Davey.; 11-20-2003 at 12:17 PM.

  13. #13
    Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HYFI
    Why could you not have used a similar source code like AA? No bullcrap gimmicks...just a board that loads fast and you can see the posts.
    Simply put - reliability, security, adminstration features, user features, and availability. After doing a good amount of research, we found that there are very few forums scripts available that still utilize the old-style threaded functionality. Most of the major sites that have a forums system with decent amounts of traffic have all moved over to this type of system for a number of reasons - probably some of the same reasons we have. We've had to upgrade our forums system a few times in the past 4 years because we used simple technology that was unreliable at best. We used to use a system like AA, but found it to be difficult to keep up, had limited user options, and it had little potential to integrate with our other sections (like reviews).

    We chose to go with this current script because it is the most powerful, automates many tasks on the adminstration side, adds a good deal of security, gives the users more options, and was the absolute best/most widely used system on the market. A majority of the large community-based websites on the web (not only audio sites) use this script or one like it.

  14. #14
    Forum Regular FLZapped's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris
    Simply put - reliability, security, adminstration features, user features, and availability. After doing a good amount of research, we found that there are very few forums scripts available that still utilize the old-style threaded functionality. Most of the major sites that have a forums system with decent amounts of traffic have all moved over to this type of system for a number of reasons - probably some of the same reasons we have. We've had to upgrade our forums system a few times in the past 4 years because we used simple technology that was unreliable at best. We used to use a system like AA, but found it to be difficult to keep up, had limited user options, and it had little potential to integrate with our other sections (like reviews).

    We chose to go with this current script because it is the most powerful, automates many tasks on the adminstration side, adds a good deal of security, gives the users more options, and was the absolute best/most widely used system on the market. A majority of the large community-based websites on the web (not only audio sites) use this script or one like it.
    Then I would suggest that you write to the authors of the software and tell them that folks really don't like this format and they should consider other, more user friendly formats, in addition to the admin-friendly ones.


    -Bruce

  15. #15
    Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FLZapped
    Then I would suggest that you write to the authors of the software and tell them that folks really don't like this format and they should consider other, more user friendly formats, in addition to the admin-friendly ones.


    -Bruce
    Well you see, that's the problem - it seems most everyone who uses this format is actually happy with it. I've asked the authors of the software if there were any plans to change it to the threaded-style format similar to what you have all been used to, and they said that they have received very few requests for it and do not plan to change it. The general consensus is that this is a user friendly format. I would think that if everyone wanted a threaded-style forum, they would have been forced to design one long ago. In any case, as you suggested, I have actually put in my request to them anyway a while back. We'll see if it makes a difference with their newer versions.

  16. #16
    all around good guy Jim Clark's Avatar
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    There's no way to make everyone happy and with some folks there's just no pleasing them at all. That comment isn't directed to anyone in particular, just an obvious if not overstated fact.

    Chris I understand and appreciated your comments about hoping for a little support from the long time users. I guess the key word is USERS. I've not paid a cent for the entertainment this site has provided over the last seven years (wow, has it really been that long?). I don't buy the associated products advertised and nobody at AR has ever emailed me for a dime to help keep the site running, yet somehow this is a business. Not really sure how that works but I'm glad it does.

    I look at some of the other sites and the restrictions they place on content of discussions. I think it's safe to say that many of our discussions and "arrangements" couldn't take place in many forums on the net. The software didn't make the site, the people did and the people have been coming and going during the entire run of the site. Many of the same people, including myself also post on the other sites and have been for years but it not the same and it never will be.

    I plan on sticking around and enjoying some of the new features that are available and look forward to seeing where this road takes us. Not to brown nose but having Chris around is a great addition. Not since Norb has anyone acted like they actually gave a darn about what happens around here.

    jc
    "Ahh, cartoons! America's only native art form. I don't count jazz 'cuz it sucks"- Bartholomew J. Simpson

  17. #17
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    I hate this new format. Way too cumbersome..

    Where is the "view threads" located that Chris talks about? I'll be over at AA more. n.

  18. #18
    Chris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neontuna
    Where is the "view threads" located that Chris talks about? I'll be over at AA more. n.
    Here, click this link:
    This place is like a closet now.

    You'll notice up at the top right of this thread, and near the bottom right, there are 3 icons, one saying Linear, one saying Hybrid, and one saying Threaded. Click on each of them and you'll see the different options you have of viewing discussions on this site. You can have a threaded view, but it won't be what you were used to before. It's not too bad.

    Personally, I don't think it's too difficult to get used to. But then again, I guess I adapt to change better than some.

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