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Thread: Hey Terence

  1. #1
    Forum Regular MindGoneHaywire's Avatar
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    Hey Terence

    You're the moderator on this board? That's how you respond to a thread as controversial as Barry's was, by locking it? Gee, what power you have. Congratulations. What, you were afraid of someone changing yr mind or something?

    For Pete's sakes, I think that people would have no problem respecting yr decision, in spite of Barry's POV, like it or hate it. But you had to LOCK THE THREAD? Are you KIDDING?

    I'm sorry, I don't see what would've been so difficult about--for instance--suggesting a cross-post with a link, to draw Rave Reccers over to the films board--you still with me? I can't imagine anyone would've had a problem with this. Troy could've put his post up & spent an additional 30 seconds putting a new post up here with a link, and that way Barry could've found the post himself--as could we all--and then perhaps found the Films board worthy of repeat visits. You still with me? Instead, we get yr narrow POV--okay, fine, whatever. I'm still with you. But you lock the thread?

    Check, please.

    Okay, fine, whatever. It's yr board, not mine, not anybody else's, either. But that's no way to attract new blood so far as I can see. In fact, it looks like some straight-up bullsh*t.

    Thoughts?

    I don't like others.

  2. #2
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    Just one more good reason to post at AA. Aye? I have only seen about 5-10 newbie posts in in recent weeks so it has nothing to do with them. Just someone abusing power as usuall.

  3. #3
    Musicaholic Forums Moderator ForeverAutumn's Avatar
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    I tried to reply to Dean Martin's post to thank him for the invite to the Film Forum and let him know that his point was well taken and that my post was not meant to be a criticism of his (and, BTW, the reply to post option was still there). Only to find out that we aren't allowed to carry on this discussion anymore!!!

    I feel like I'm being treated like a child here. Thank goodness Terrence wasn't around for our recent discussions about the US election. Imagine how quickly that would have been shut down. Not only off-topic, but allowing us to express our own controversial opinions. Oh my, two taboos in one thread!

    I understand and appreciate the concern about the OT threads now, if there's a different forum to post them on. I'm not sure that I agree, but I, at least, understand the issues. And we are provided with a link to get to the post easily. (Although I like the idea of being able to post on another forum and automatically link it here). But making a unilateral decision to close a thread is another story altogether. What's next? Is this thread about to be deleted?

    Looks to me like someone's abusing his authority.
    Last edited by ForeverAutumn; 11-20-2004 at 09:24 AM.

  4. #4
    Close 'n PlayŽ user Troy's Avatar
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    What really jerks my chain is he closed it before I could post to it. The whole thing was about one of MY posts, afterall!

    1. I posted the Incredibles thread here because many of the people that frequent this board don't go there.

    2. Yeah, you guys are my water cooler buddies. I was so jazzed about the movie I wanted to share it with you.

    3. The fact that the thread here got twice as many responses as the one at the movies board should tell you something about why I was right to post it here too.

    4. I DID mention the soundtrack to the film in my original post. It's one of my favorite things about the movie.

    This board is very amenable to OT discussion. I like that and don't see it changing. The fact that it was about a movie when there is a movie board for that though . . . I can see the rub there. I agree with Dino about the film forum drying up and blowing away if we start talking movies at rave recs. I won't do it again.

    Terence, combining the 2 threads and leaving links on both boards is fine with me. I don't really see why so many are so up in arms over that.

    Closing the discussion thread about it though . . . wrong-o! Perhaps you have problems with things blowing up in threads like that on other boards here, but it wouldn't happen on Rave Recs. We're a pretty easy going bunch. Closing the door to discussion is how things get screwed up in life.

  5. #5
    Forum Regular MindGoneHaywire's Avatar
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    It wasn't like it blew up! Looked like a mostly reasonable exchange of ideas to me. I didn't detect grave anger in that thread, just irritation. Locking that thread--which smacks of 'last resort' to me--what a move. Can't figure out if it's grounded more in immaturity or insecurity. Or perhaps a combination of both.

    Maybe I shouldn't be so harsh. Perhaps Terrence is only working off past experience elsewhere, or perhaps he doesn't have a lot of experience sitting in the mod's chair. Which I'm sure is not always an easy place to be, and this or that action is always going to irritate somebody. But I'm not dowloading any Alexa toolbars (as the all-powerful Moderators would have us do), and I'm not going to be shy about stating my opinion that this was a wrongheaded, insulting move.

    Nonsense like this affirms for me that I did the right thing in downloading a Firefox extension called "AdBlock" and have used it extensively on this site.

    I don't like others.

  6. #6
    Can a crooner get a gig? dean_martin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverAutumn
    I tried to reply to Dean Martin's post to thank him for the invite to the Film Forum and let him know that his point was well taken and that my post was not meant to be a criticism of his (and, BTW, the reply to post option was still there). Only to find out that we aren't allowed to carry on this discussion anymore!!!
    Thanks, FA. I didn't mean to sound critical of Troy posting in both places (what I meant in my original post was it should have been satisfactory to the moderator that Troy did post in fave films even if he posted again in rave recs). I'm glad we finally got to hear from Troy. I'm sure he never expected his welcomed comments on a movie to cause a big bruhaha.

    BTW, I'm going to try to increase my participation in Rave Recs because I'm so far behind on new music. I don't even know what a "Franz Ferdinand" is.

  7. #7
    very clever with maracas Davey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dean_martin
    BTW, I'm going to try to increase my participation in Rave Recs because I'm so far behind on new music. I don't even know what a "Franz Ferdinand" is.
    Hey, good idea! That Franz Ferdinand CD is a lot of fun - although you will find some around here that think it's just a bunch of mindless, derivative, fruity dribble. But not me! And I just saw that Tuesday they're releasing a special edition digipak with a bonus CD containg 5 extra songs. Mostly b-sides. So if you do wanna make the plunge, that's the one to get. Kind of mainstream, but a good entry point. Now if I can just find some way to finagle a copy of that second disc for myself....just kidding, I've actually been holding out for this since I've been listening for months to a copyright infringing CD-R
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    This special, limited edition package features a 5 panel digipak and contains a bonus disc featuring the newly recorded version of "This Fire" along with 4 B-sides and rare tracks. "Van Tango" and "Shopping for Blood," which have become fan favorites as staples in the band's live set, make this special edition with bonus disc a must have!

    This album will be available beginning November 23. Orders placed on this website by November 17 will be shipped for a scheduled delivery of on or around November 23.

    TRACKLISTING
    DISC 1:
    1. Jacqueline
    2. Tell Her Tonight
    3. Take Me Out
    4. The Dark of The Matinee
    5. Auf Achse
    6. Cheating On You
    7. This Fire
    8. Darts of Pleasure
    9. Michael
    10. Come On Home
    11. 40'

    DISC 2:
    1. This Fffire
    2. Van Tango
    3. Shopping For Blood
    4. All For You, Sophia
    5. Words So Leisured
    Last edited by Davey; 11-21-2004 at 01:17 PM.

  8. #8
    Global Village Idiot mad rhetorik's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Davey
    .... although you will find some around here that think it's just a bunch of mindless, derivative, fruity dribble.
    Wonder where you got that phrase from.... ; P
    "...and then at the end of the letter I like to write <i>'P.S. - this is what part of the alphabet would look like if Q and R were eliminated.'</i> "


    <b>_R.I.P. Mitch Hedburg 1968-2005_</b>

  9. #9
    very clever with maracas Davey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mad rhetorik
    Wonder where you got that phrase from.... ; P
    Hehehe, it is a good one, whether talking about something Fiery or something Franzy. Hey, notice they are both FF's? Not much gets by my keen eye

  10. #10
    Forum Regular BarryL's Avatar
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    Censored: Final Comments Missing

    Quote Originally Posted by MindGoneHaywire
    You're the moderator on this board? That's how you respond to a thread as controversial as Barry's was, by locking it? What, you were afraid of someone changing yr mind or something?

    In fact, it looks like some straight-up bullsh*t.

    Thoughts?

    Just for the record (Rush, 2112), my final post on the matter, which was labelled as such, now appears to be missing. I'm pretty sure I posted it on the Movie board, given the split conversation Terrance and I were having. I can assure you that there was no swearing or rudeness, and that it was in fact concilliatory. In Terrance's post there, he assures us that he wasn't going to get heavy handed with posters of off-topic posts. That's not his style, he said (I'm assuming here that Terrance is a he, although on the internet there is no assurance that that is the case).

    I recall that my final line was that this whole affair probably indicates that I have a problem with authority. I guess my problem has been confirmed. In the overall scheme of the big world, this is a mighty small affair. But I can't help but reflect that it is rather sad.

    I suppose this too will be removed or locked. My bet is for removed, and some kind of nasty e-mail to me. Or at least a note to my file.
    "A spirit with a vision is a dream with a mission" - Rush

  11. #11
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MindGoneHaywire
    You're the moderator on this board? That's how you respond to a thread as controversial as Barry's was, by locking it? Gee, what power you have. Congratulations. What, you were afraid of someone changing yr mind or something?
    I locked it because I think some of the comments were bordering on out of control. Tentoez response is the perfect example. Does anyone LIKED to be called names? I don't.

    For Pete's sakes, I think that people would have no problem respecting yr decision, in spite of Barry's POV, like it or hate it. But you had to LOCK THE THREAD? Are you KIDDING?
    Locking threads is something that I don't like to do. I didn't mind the opposition(something I still don't understand to this day), but what I saw there was some very open hostility to my moving the thread to its proper place. The kinds of comments that were being levied at me were bordering on pretty hostile. Unnecessary! In an organized environment everything has its place, and every place has it thing. I do not see why everyone was so angry at moving a topic to its proper place.

    I'm sorry, I don't see what would've been so difficult about--for instance--suggesting a cross-post with a link, to draw Rave Reccers over to the films board--you still with me? I can't imagine anyone would've had a problem with this. Troy could've put his post up & spent an additional 30 seconds putting a new post up here with a link, and that way Barry could've found the post himself--as could we all--and then perhaps found the Films board worthy of repeat visits. You still with me? Instead, we get yr narrow POV--okay, fine, whatever. I'm still with you. But you lock the thread?
    I am sorry, I cannot see why the post has to be done it two places. Why post a movie review in the rav rec forum, when there is a proper place for it in the fav movie forum? Why is it so difficult to take a couple of clicks and visit the favorite film forum for a review? Why does someone have to spend all that time cross linking and making things complicated, when all anyone has to do is post in the proper foum, and folks visit that forum? If a troll was interferring with the function of the board, you guys would want me to deal with it. Its my job, but when a topic is out of its place, and I deal with it, you guys are angry. But that is also my job. All I am trying to do is the job assigned to me.

    Check, please.

    Okay, fine, whatever. It's yr board, not mine, not anybody else's, either. But that's no way to attract new blood so far as I can see. In fact, it looks like some straight-up bullsh*t.

    Thoughts?
    I am at a loss as to why everyone is so angry over moving a topic to its proper place. I wasn't trying to hurt anyone, not trying to censor anyone, and not trying to be a dictator, just do what is assigned to me. It takes two clicks to get from this forum to another, why is this so difficult to do? This smacks of laziness, and I think it is unfair to be critisized for this. Everyone thinks that being a moderator makes you a dictator. But that is far from truth. A good moderator remains transparent until something needs to be fixed. I have done that in this forum until a off topic post appeared. I do not censor opinions, threaten people, push my opinion on anyone, or use my responsibilities to control what is said. So I do not know why I am taking so much heat for just plain doing my job. I had no negative intent at all, I am just doing what is asked of me. I moved the OT post, and left instruction where to find it, what more can you ask? If I did something controversial, I could understand the heat, but I am doing what is right and asked of me, and I do not think I deserve the comments I am getting for doing that.
    I am openly invititng everyone to visit the other forums. It takes just two clicks(so I do not understant why someone would say they don't have time to do it) and about 3 seconds(depending on your connection) to get there. Open up your sense of community, there is much information to be found everywhere. And please try and temper your hostile comments, this is a difficult and thankless job(as illustrated here) and I didn't see anyone breaking the doors down to take this position. Remember what it was like when there were no moderators.

    I suppose this too will be removed or locked. My bet is for removed, and some kind of nasty e-mail to me. Or at least a note to my file.
    There is no chance of this happening. If it did, I would complain and howl like a wolf. I didn't take your comments negatively, and sense no problem with authority. Its all good!
    Sir Terrence

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  12. #12
    Forum Regular MindGoneHaywire's Avatar
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    I think what you're not getting here is that we are adults, I think, most of us anyway, and locking a thread is akin to treating people like children. I'm sorry, I didn't think that anything that Tentoze said came close to reaching the level of hostility you're apparently assigning it. And I would also point out that if you take a look at his posts, I believe that you'll find that he's as reasoned & polite a poster, in a general sense, as you'll find on this or any other board. If you're offended because he called you a hall monitor, then yr skin is definitely not thick enough for this job. Unless there was some other thread that I'm missing...but somehow I doubt it.

    I really don't have to tell you that a lot of people post from work or are otherwise busy & don't take the time to go to another forum they might find interesting, do I? I don't have to tell you that people become conditioned to visiting one part of a site & not the entire site, do I? I'm sure I'm not alone in bookmarking this page & only infrequently visiting the other boards on this site. I've spent some time on the films board in the past. It's not my primary area of interest. Troy thought that what he had to say about this picture was worth sharing with this community. You don't even like the idea that he should put up a post here with a link to his post on the other board? That's nuts. Is it 'lazy' to not visit the other boards of our own volition? Perhaps. But it's not unethical or illegal or anything. And I tell you what, it was one thing two boards ago when the software was nice & quick. Some people are still on dialup, and this is easily the slowest-loading site I still visit on a regular basis. And that's even with Adblock, broadband, and pop-ups blocked. So it's all fine & well to suggest that someone's being lazy if they don't just automatically visit the films board, but some people like to discuss music more than films & it's a bit odd to chastise them for trying to bring a new topic--and perhaps a new board--to their attention.

    You say it's yr 'job' to relocate off-topic posts, but in applying this heavy-handed manner, I believe you lose sight of the big picture, which says that without traffic there's no board to moderate. I can't imagine that you could possibly agree that locking a thread, which I'm gently suggesting to you was unnecessary in this case, is going to contribute towards the growth of the community of posters on this board, and, it would follow, this site in general. You ask us to remember what it was like when there was no moderator, and I do; perhaps you don't. That troll problem that existed on the General board was not a problem here. Some people did have a problem with a particular poster who was banned, but that situation doesn't exactly apply if you're trying to get us to 'remember' how bad it was. This board somehow flew under the radar of that much larger troll problem that existed. Which some on this board may not have even known about if they didn't visit the General board. I did, occasionally. It was HORRIBLE. Not so here, aside from the people who felt personally attacked by the now-banned poster.

    Enough has been said about this nonsense. If you choose to disagree with my points, that is yr right. But I'll tell you right now that to suggest that there shouldn't even be a post with a link to a post on another board sounds absolutely crazy to me. People are ingrained in their habits & you're not going to break them; pulling garbage like this will only drive them away.

    I don't like others.

  13. #13
    Toon Robber tentoze's Avatar
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    "I locked it because I think some of the comments were bordering on out of control. Tentoez response is the perfect example."

    Sir Terrence:

    If you insist on repeatedly holding me up as the most egregious participant in this heinous mutiny, this dire threat to global order and harmony, please be advised that my moniker is spelled Tentoze. I certainly wouldn't want anyone reading your comments to confuse me with any other conspirator.

    (NP: A really good ceedee by Ray Lamontagne called Trouble)
    ----Never Off Topic, Never Rude-----

  14. #14
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Troy
    What really jerks my chain is he closed it before I could post to it. The whole thing was about one of MY posts, afterall!
    Troy, I had no idea you wanted to respond again. But I sensed based on the comments I was getting, that this was going to spiral out of control really fast, I didn't want to see that happen.

    1. I posted the Incredibles thread here because many of the people that frequent this board don't go there.
    But they should go there, because that is where movie reviews belong.

    2. Yeah, you guys are my water cooler buddies. I was so jazzed about the movie I wanted to share it with you.
    I think that is cool, but there is another way to handle this. Tell them you are going to see the movie, and you will post the review in the Favorite films section.

    3. The fact that the thread here got twice as many responses as the one at the movies board should tell you something about why I was right to post it here too.
    It just tells that everyone within the rav rec community stays in that community only. I am openly inviting them to visit the other sections as well.

    4. I DID mention the soundtrack to the film in my original post. It's one of my favorite things about the movie.

    This board is very amenable to OT discussion. I like that and don't see it changing. The fact that it was about a movie when there is a movie board for that though . . . I can see the rub there. I agree with Dino about the film forum drying up and blowing away if we start talking movies at rave recs. I won't do it again.
    Troy, I thank you very much for this bit of rational thinking.

    Terence, combining the 2 threads and leaving links on both boards is fine with me. I don't really see why so many are so up in arms over that.
    I don't either, but these are your pals, and this kind of loyalty amoung friends is very commendable indeed!

    Closing the discussion thread about it though . . . wrong-o! Perhaps you have problems with things blowing up in threads like that on other boards here, but it wouldn't happen on Rave Recs. We're a pretty easy going bunch. Closing the door to discussion is how things get screwed up in life.
    Well, that is one way of looking at it. However, we had one poster calling me anal, another saying "In case I haven't made my position clear, this action was nothing more than meddling by a hall monitor". Being called a meddling hall monitor is extremely insulting as calling a security guard a "rent a cop". I do not think I deserved that, nor do I think it is relevant to the issue. So whether it was wrong, has to be balanced by what was taking place at the time. It is not always WRONG to close a thread. Especially when it was definately taking a turn for the worst. I do not think any of you would take this kind of abused, each one of you need to just put yourself in my position for one moment before you strike out so negatively. This job is not always easy.
    Sir Terrence

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  15. #15
    Stainmaster Finch Platte's Avatar
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    Imho

    I don't look at the movie forum, and probably never will.

    But I do like reading about other things on RR besides music. These folks in here are my friends (until I send them one of my comps), and I enjoy hearing what they have to say about different subjects.

    I check out other boards more these days because they are more diverse. If you choke this one, I guarantee you won't be needed to moderate this place, simply 'cause it won't be here.

    Fynhc Plate

  16. #16
    Forum Regular BarryL's Avatar
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    Stop, Or I'll Lock It. I Mean It...

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    I locked it because I think some of the comments were bordering on out of control. Tentoez response is the perfect example. Does anyone LIKED to be called names? I don't.

    There is no chance of this happening. If it did, I would complain and howl like a wolf. I didn't take your comments negatively, and sense no problem with authority. Its all good!

    The thread was locked only because it was critical of you. There have been lots of heated discussions on this board and no threads were locked. And now cognitive dissonance has crept in and you're defending the irrational. You have to maintain law and order, or the whole place will go to hell? Oh, please. Spare us.

    And what happened to my post? Are you saying that you didn't remove it? It was very conciliatory and I kept my sarcasm to the absolute minimal.

    I know that you think you know best about how everybody should act, but here's my advice to you: let people post and enjoy themselves. Is it so bad if one or two threads get posted "in the wrong place"? (Like this is the Library of Congress or something.) I think there's a little button that allows us to register complaints. Until the bell rings, why not assume that everything is going to plan. There's nothing wrong with a little bit of heat and discussion about right and wrong, good and bad, prudent and imprudent. At least not amongst the regular posters on this board.

    Given excellent explanations of why people are peeved of with your actions by a number of posters, perhaps you should re-read them, and then stop assuming that everyone else is so irrational and your view of how things will be after you have your way with everybody is the only right way to go. This isn't that difficult. Re-Imagine, as Tom Peters implores in his latest book. The world is messy. Learn to live with it. Your customers/users don't seem to have a problem with it, so why are you arguing with them that they are wrong and you are right.
    "A spirit with a vision is a dream with a mission" - Rush

  17. #17
    Forum Regular BarryL's Avatar
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    Troy, Thanks For Posting...

    Quote Originally Posted by BarryL
    Troy Sure Knows His Movies!

    Thanks for that Incredibles post, Troy. I really look forward to seeing that movie. I think my kids would also love it. They like heros and despise villians as much as I do (I guess they take after their ol' dad, huh?).

    Who'd've'ever thought that you could find out such neat stuff on a bulletin board about music? Man, the Internet is a wonderful thing isn't it? I'll bet you when the dust settles, it'll actually be life changing for a lot of people.

    You can't stop progress! It's almost like chaos to some, but, embrace it, I say. Keep up the good work, Troy. The time you take to enlighten your Rave Rec buddies is appreciated.

    How's the soundtrack? Is it original music? Orchestra or keyboards? Vocals or instrumental? With topping or not?
    "A spirit with a vision is a dream with a mission" - Rush

  18. #18
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MindGoneHaywire
    I think what you're not getting here is that we are adults, I think, most of us anyway, and locking a thread is akin to treating people like children. I'm sorry, I didn't think that anything that Tentoze said came close to reaching the level of hostility you're apparently assigning it. And I would also point out that if you take a look at his posts, I believe that you'll find that he's as reasoned & polite a poster, in a general sense, as you'll find on this or any other board. If you're offended because he called you a hall monitor, then yr skin is definitely not thick enough for this job. Unless there was some other thread that I'm missing...but somehow I doubt it.
    I am sorry, but calling somebody a hall monitor is a personal attack regardless of how thick my skin is. I do not mind that he said this, what I was bothered by the personal attack period. This is not allowed on this forum , or we will be back to where we started from. If I called you a ______, I am sure that you would not like it at all. So to say that I should just stand here and take it just because I an a moderator is patently unfair. If we are adults like you suggest, then it should be no problem following the rules like adults do. Adults do not name call, and attack people with personal insults when they are inconvienced, or asked to follow some simple rules.

    I really don't have to tell you that a lot of people post from work or are otherwise busy & don't take the time to go to another forum they might find interesting, do I?
    I moderate from work, so I do not see where your time usage is more important than mine. If I take my time to keep these forums free of trolls and disorganization, then you guys can be responsible enough to post reviews in their proper place. I think that is fair.


    I don't have to tell you that people become conditioned to visiting one part of a site & not the entire site, do I?
    So just because you are conditioned to do this, does it make it right?. Is it fair to ALL of audioreview if this forum has its own set of rules, does what it wants to do, and does not like moderators to meddle in their own personal community. Remember, this forum is part of a larger community with rules governing this large community. This forum is not free from the rules that govern this larger community, or each community will have anarchy. That is why rules apply to all forums equally. The hometheater forum doesn't have reviews in it, even though many watched nothing but movies, so why should this forum have it?

    I'm sure I'm not alone in bookmarking this page & only infrequently visiting the other boards on this site. I've spent some time on the films board in the past. It's not my primary area of interest. Troy thought that what he had to say about this picture was worth sharing with this community. You don't even like the idea that he should put up a post here with a link to his post on the other board? That's nuts.
    It is called double posting, and no site administrator likes to see this. Go to hometheaterforum and see if you can do this, it won't be allow there. Go to any other site and see if it is allow. You will find it is not. For anyone who has visited any other forum on the internet, you will find it is a common and widespread practice to combine double postings, and if they are off topic, moved to the proper area.

    Is it 'lazy' to not visit the other boards of our own volition? Perhaps. But it's not unethical or illegal or anything.
    No one said it is illegal, but it does not lend itself to organization(and easier for newbies) if you have people posting topics all over the place. If this was YOUR board to run, would you want it that way?


    And I tell you what, it was one thing two boards ago when the software was nice & quick. Some people are still on dialup, and this is easily the slowest-loading site I still visit on a regular basis. And that's even with Adblock, broadband, and pop-ups blocked. So it's all fine & well to suggest that someone's being lazy if they don't just automatically visit the films board, but some people like to discuss music more than films & it's a bit odd to chastise them for trying to bring a new topic--and perhaps a new board--to their attention.
    If you like to discuss music more than films, fine. But if you are going to discuss films, why is it so difficult to make two clicks and go to the appropriate forum? I must admit I do not understand the plight of dial ups, I use broadband, and even with pop ups(I never see) I am on this site extremely fast. But this is not an excuse for anarchy, and to cancel all rules regarding posting in the proper place.

    You say it's yr 'job' to relocate off-topic posts, but in applying this heavy-handed manner, I believe you lose sight of the big picture, which says that without traffic there's no board to moderate
    Can someone explain to me how moving a post to its proper place heavy handed??????
    I think because you stay in this forum only, you could be losing sight of the bigger picture yourself. So you have forums labeled hometheater, fav films, rave rec, digital, analog etc, but you have post from these forums all over the board. No one can find anything, or follow a thread, its disorganized and confusing, and people leave because everything is too hard to follow. That is the result of anarchy, and why I do not understand why you have lost sight of this, and why it is not beneficial to EVERYONE.

    . I can't imagine that you could possibly agree that locking a thread, which I'm gently suggesting to you was unnecessary in this case, is going to contribute towards the growth of the community of posters on this board, and, it would follow, this site in general.
    It is easy for you to overlook the tone that the thread was taking. You were'nt under attack, or called any names. But when the tone takes that negative of a direction, no one is satisfied. I lock that topic because it was irrelevant to the subject at hand, and could have easily spiralled into a name calling, finger pointing situation. It could have EASILY gone there. I don't like to do that, but when the situation calls for it, I will not flinch one bit doing so. I find it ironic that you can so easily overlook the negative tone of the thread. Remember, I am human just like you, and do not appreciate name calling. Thick skin or not.

    You ask us to remember what it was like when there was no moderator, and I do; perhaps you don't.
    I have been posting to this site since two months after it opened. So it is a faulty assumption to make this kind of comment in light of that. I remember when there was no moderator, this board was a mess, disorganized, polarized, ineffecient, too many trolls, threads of incredible lengths of name calling(that started so innocently and spiralled) persistant personal attacks, and the list goes on.

    That troll problem that existed on the General board was not a problem here. Some people did have a problem with a particular poster who was banned, but that situation doesn't exactly apply if you're trying to get us to 'remember' how bad it was.
    Any problem on any forum is a problem for everyone that visits audioreview. Unfortunately the moderators do not have the luxury of thinking in a compartmentilzed fashion as you do. Fires spread, and the problem that exist on the general board, also existed in the cable forum, hometheater forums, the digital forum, and the analog forum. As I state again, this forum is part of a group of forums that make up audioreview. One bad apple CAN spoil the whole bunch.


    This board somehow flew under the radar of that much larger troll problem that existed. Which some on this board may not have even known about if they didn't visit the General board. I did, occasionally. It was HORRIBLE. Not so here, aside from the people who felt personally attacked by the now-banned poster.
    Well, the hometheater forum had a problem, it was miserable for them as I was there. The cable forum had a problem with persitant attacks on certain individuals who eventially left. That was not good for audioreview. The digital forum also had a HUGE problem(that started as innocently as the personal attacks I have had to endure for this thread), and several poster were banned, and several more left. Not good for audioreview. Because one problem was allowed to exist in the general forum, it spread to some of the other forums. Since I visit all of those forums, I saw it all first hand. Had a moderator just closed the offending threads, and delt with the problem when it first cropped up, it would not have gone out of control to the lengths it did. Once again, all of this came as innocently as the comments I have had to endure here, hence why the thread was closed. I do not believe in putting out forest fires, when I can prevent them in the first place.

    Enough has been said about this nonsense. If you choose to disagree with my points, that is yr right. But I'll tell you right now that to suggest that there shouldn't even be a post with a link to a post on another board sounds absolutely crazy to me. People are ingrained in their habits & you're not going to break them; pulling garbage like this will only drive them away.
    I think it is irresponsible to suggest that ingrained habits(which are wrong in this case) are okay, and if we(the moderators) try and deal with them, we will just chase people away. If peoples ingrained habits make them break the rules, then they should change the ingrained habit, not leave. Movie reviews are not allowed, and are not posted in any other forum. Why does this forum suggest preferential treatment? I have moved off topic items from the other boards, and none of them have complained to this degree at all. They all recognized it was off topic, and there was a proper place for it. It is unfair to the other forums(which people call their home, and bookmark like you do) to have their off topic posts moved(with little or no complaint I might add) and this one is allowed to operate autonomously and without moderation. Isn't the rave recording forum a part of a larger website?. We are not asked to moderate all forums EXCEPT the rave recording forum. We were asked to moderate all forums period. The only thing that I am asking is that the rules regarding posting be followed. Is that too much to ask?
    Sir Terrence

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  19. #19
    Musicaholic Forums Moderator ForeverAutumn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    Well, that is one way of looking at it. However, we had one poster calling me anal, another saying "In case I haven't made my position clear, this action was nothing more than meddling by a hall monitor". Being called a meddling hall monitor is extremely insulting as calling a security guard a "rent a cop". I do not think I deserved that, nor do I think it is relevant to the issue. So whether it was wrong, has to be balanced by what was taking place at the time. It is not always WRONG to close a thread. Especially when it was definately taking a turn for the worst. I do not think any of you would take this kind of abused, each one of you need to just put yourself in my position for one moment before you strike out so negatively. This job is not always easy.
    Mr. Terrible,
    I don't doubt that your job is not always easy. And I think that most of us now understand your point and why you moved the threads. We may not like it, but an explanation was given and that's fine. You have a job to do and a board to run. I appreciate the existence of this board and being able to come here to discuss many subjects, not just music.

    Perhaps some people here did get out of line and some things were said in anger, that should not have been said. You're right. No-one likes to be called names. If I am one of those people who offended you, I apologize. In the past, when I was the victim of comments that I felt unappropriate, I reported the post and it was removed. You too, have the same right. Absolutely!

    However, as the Moderator, you may find yourself in a conflict of interest. Removing (or closing) a post that you feel is offensive to you also shuts the door on a discussion that the rest of us felt needed to be had (and given the discussion in this thread didn't solve a thing, did it?). You did what you had to do, but in the process you upset a lot of people. An explanation of why the post was closed, prior to closing it would have avoided this whole issue. Simply saying, that's the end of this discussion, only makes us feel like children being reprimanded. You ask us to put ourselves in your shoes, well I ask you to do the same for us.

    I don't know how long you've been around this Forum. But you'll find that we are a pretty easy-going bunch. Many friendships have been formed here and we always welcome new people. We like it here. There are good reasons that we come here. You would do well to not mess with that. I don't mean that as a threat, just some good-natured advice along the lines of "don't fix what ain't broke".

    I do appreciate the job that the moderators here do. But I think that it's equally important, no...make that more important that the moderators appreciate the customer too.
    Last edited by ForeverAutumn; 11-22-2004 at 01:32 PM.

  20. #20
    Forum Regular MindGoneHaywire's Avatar
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    Looks to me like you have issues that need to be dealt with, sir. I can say, without hesitation, that you are the least qualified moderator I have seen. Most of us have dealt with far worse attacks in what I would consider to be a far more reasonable or sensible manner. If you actually object to someone posting in one forum, then putting up a post in another that simply says 'I put up a post in this other forum, why not take a look, that's a good forum, too, here's a link,' as you have indicated here...and that's NOT a 'double posting'...then my days coming to this board are over. Goodbye.

    I don't like others.

  21. #21
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    What about the book review?

    After all this bru-ha-ha, why hasn't the book review just a few threads down, been moved? Not that I want to see it moved, just wondering. I laughed out loud the other night when I clicked on that post for the first time(after searching for it) only to find it was a book review. I had just purchased the disk Pink Floyd - A Saucerful of Keys and was anxious to post about it.

    Oh, and about us few unemployed losers using dialup, I only come to this forum and occasionally the PC forum, since it's about 30-45 seconds a click.I also still only read about one third of the posts ever since the code change hit a perfectly fine board.

    Please lock this thread so we can move on to our next awaiting dilema!

    Hyfi

  22. #22
    Musicaholic Forums Moderator ForeverAutumn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    I moderate from work, so I do not see where your time usage is more important than mine. If I take my time to keep these forums free of trolls and disorganization, then you guys can be responsible enough to post reviews in their proper place. I think that is fair.

    Yadda, yadda, yadda.....
    Alright, I tried to be nice but the discussions continued on as I was preparing my previous post.

    When did it become part of the moderator's job to argue with the customers? If you were my employee you'd be fired.

    If you were my paid employee I would fire you for moderating a web site on my dime.

    If you were my volunteer moderator I would fire you for chasing away my customers.

  23. #23
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BarryL
    The thread was locked only because it was critical of you. There have been lots of heated discussions on this board and no threads were locked. And now cognitive dissonance has crept in and you're defending the irrational. You have to maintain law and order, or the whole place will go to hell? Oh, please. Spare us.
    As you can see Barry, I am taking alot heat on here, I have neither locked, nor closed this thread. It is okay to be critical with me, but it doesn't really change the fact that movie reviews belong in the favorite movie section. It is just that simple, and not irrational at all. Maybe there was alot of heated discussions on this board, if there were no personal attacks, or off topic stuff, it would have been left alone. Remember, you have only had moderators for about three months. Barry, at one time this place was hell.

    And what happened to my post? Are you saying that you didn't remove it? It was very conciliatory and I kept my sarcasm to the absolute minimal.
    I haven't removed any posts, a neither has any other moderator. They are all there, and there is no record of any post removed.

    I know that you think you know best about how everybody should act, but here's my advice to you: let people post and enjoy themselves. Is it so bad if one or two threads get posted "in the wrong place"? (Like this is the Library of Congress or something.) I think there's a little button that allows us to register complaints.
    I have stated my position as moderator in the other posts. This board is not free from moderation. It is part of a website at large, that is moderated by several moderators. I am at a loss at understand why all of the other boards don't complain about moderation, but this one does. The same things happen there that happen here.


    Until the bell rings, why not assume that everything is going to plan. There's nothing wrong with a little bit of heat and discussion about right and wrong, good and bad, prudent and imprudent. At least not amongst the regular posters on this board.
    Yes, but do you have any idea how a newbie would feel walking into all of these flying bullets. When someone posts off topic, everything is not going to plan amoung site administrators. He would like the place organized and orderly, or I wouldn't have moved the post. This website has rules, and they apply to ALL of the forums in it.

    Given excellent explanations of why people are peeved of with your actions by a number of posters, perhaps you should re-read them, and then stop assuming that everyone else is so irrational and your view of how things will be after you have your way with everybody is the only right way to go.
    I have read all of them. However, the rules as explain to me by the site administrator are clear. No personal attacks(that has already been violated with no response by me), keep things clean, organized(as I tried to do here), and don't be hackled by dissent(as I am not)

    This isn't that difficult. Re-Imagine, as Tom Peters implores in his latest book. The world is messy. Learn to live with it. Your customers/users don't seem to have a problem with it, so why are you arguing with them that they are wrong and you are right.
    Tom Peters book is irrelevant in this issue, because the site administrators want different things than Tom Peters does. I am at a loss as to why you were so cool earlier, and so angry now. I didn't, and no other moderator has moved, deleted, or closed anything. I did not delete the thread where you guys basically barbeque'd me, I haven't closed or deleted a thing here(where you guys are hammering me again). Why the 180 degree turn?
    Sir Terrence

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  24. #24
    Forum Regular nobody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    Adults do not name call, and attack people with personal insults when they are inconvienced, or asked to follow some simple rules.
    Don't know many adults do you?

    Contrary to popular belief, and what you get told by your parents, adults basically act the same as little kids, except they get tired faster and are more likely to carry weapons and have a bit more money.

    Oh yeah, both sides need to lighten up. Troy's post was no big deal. Terrence, sorry but it kinda sounds like Breakfast Club to me ...If he gets up...we'll all get up...it'll be anarchy! Sometimes anal isn't an insult, it's just a description.

    Moving the thread was no big deal either. You could still find it from the forum anyway. And, he may *****, but I don't see anyone getting banned from here just for posting off topic anyway, so it's not like anything really changes in the end.

    ...scratching my head right now, trying to figure out why I even entered this thread rather than just enjoying the read...

  25. #25
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ForeverAutumn
    Alright, I tried to be nice but the discussions continued on as I was preparing my previous post.
    I appreciated that.

    When did it become part of the moderator's job to argue with the customers? If you were my employee you'd be fired.
    I am sorry you feel that way. Can a customer come into any store and violate store policy. I do not think they can. If I didn't follow the rules my employer gave me, I would be fired.

    If you were my paid employee I would fire you for moderating a web site on my dime.
    In this case it would be pretty difficult to fire yourself.

    If you were my volunteer moderator I would fire you for chasing away my customers.
    If I were a moderator who couldn't enforced the rules given to me, I would be fired. If the customers come to my store, move the inventory around, disrupted my business, and do exactly what they please in my store, I would sell no goods, and the store would close. Rules are everywhere, and without them, there is no order.
    Sir Terrence

    Titan Reference 3D 1080p projector
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    Datastat RS20I audio/video processor 12.4 audio setup
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    6 custom CAL amps for subs
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