An interesting article about the "naturalness" of homosexuality

[Worf101]

Curious article sent to me from the NY Times. I quite litterally don't know what to make of it. Talk to me folks let me know what you think?

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/07/ar...l?pagewanted=1

Worf

[ForeverAutumn]

That's one of the things that I love about animals. They do what they do and they don't get judged for doing it.

I know a few people who could learn a thing or two from Roy and Silo.

[GMichael]

I don't know a whole lot about cause and affect, but it sure does seem to be normal. I have known many from both sides of the fence and haven't noticed that they are all that different. Everyone I know is different than I am, but I don't see any trends to speak of. I've known some guys who are rough and tough, but are just attracted to men. Others are more feminine like you would see from Hollywood. I also know some straight guys who are just as feminine. It seems to me that you just can't judge a book by it's cover. People is people.

[ForeverAutumn]

People is people.

And, apparently, Penguins is Penguins.

[dean_martin]

That's one of the things that I love about animals. They do what they do and they don't get judged for doing it.

Great observation, FA. My boys sometimes have trouble understanding why I'm so patient with our dogs while not so much with their tom-foolery. But that comparison says more about my own expectations than anything else. (I have no idea how or whether my little anecdote relates to the subject matter of the article.)

[ForeverAutumn]

Great observation, FA. My boys sometimes have trouble understanding why I'm so patient with our dogs while not so much with their tom-foolery. But that comparison says more about my own expectations than anything else. (I have know idea how or whether my little anecdote relates to the subject matter of the article.)

That makes perfect sense. When we got our cats last year, my husband (who doesn't have as much experience with animals as I do) would get mad at them when they were "bad". It took a while for me to get through to him that they don't know that they're being bad. They're just being cats. We're the ones who are judging them as "bad".

As humans, we have the ability to reason and communicate. Our social behavour is much more complicated than the rest of the animal kingdom. Morality is an important part of that society and it should be. If we acted on instinct alone, our world would be chaotic. But there are times when, I believe, morality is misplaced. And judging people for who they are sexually attracted to is one of those times.

Is it natural to be gay because penguins are? No. It's natural to be gay because that's just the way it is.

[GMichael]

And, apparently, Penguins is Penguins.

Penguins is people (in little tuxes & with webbed feet)

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

I have always felt that homosexuality was natural to those who are homosexual, and heterosexuality was natural to those who are heterosexual. I never let my Christianity affect that belief, because I know that Christianity involves the less than perfect creatures called humanity. People are people no matter who they sleep with at night.

I personally do not understand what the big issue is with homosexuality. It seems to me the people that have the biggest issue with it probably have something to hide, or are not comfortable enough in their own skin to respect the differences of others. In my neck of the woods I see gay men and women doing the same lawn mowing, dog walking, and work going that I do every day. I have four very close friends of which two are gay, and I have just as much fun with them as I have with my straight friends. Sexuality does not come into play when we all get together, we just have a good time. We tease each other on occasion, but it is all in good fun, and they get as many digs at us as we get with them. I just never understood what the hubub is all about concerning gay men and women. I just do not get it.

[JohnMichael]

I have always felt that homosexuality was natural to those who are homosexual, and heterosexuality was natural to those who are heterosexual. I never let my Christianity affect that belief, because I know that Christianity involves the less than perfect creatures called humanity. People are people no matter who they sleep with at night.

I personally do not understand what the big issue is with homosexuality. It seems to me the people that have the biggest issue with it probably have something to hide, or are not comfortable enough in their own skin to respect the differences of others. In my neck of the woods I see gay men and women doing the same lawn mowing, dog walking, and work going that I do every day. I have four very close friends of which two are gay, and I have just as much fun with them as I have with my straight friends. Sexuality does not come into play when we all get together, we just have a good time. We tease each other on occasion, but it is all in good fun, and they get as many digs at us as we get with them. I just never understood what the hubub is all about concerning gay men and women. I just do not get it.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[nightflier]

Then there are some frogs who can change their sex.

Worf, don't be surprised if you see someone holding up a big poster of Roy and Silo at your next Amsterdam gay pride vacation. Maybe someone will even make t-shirts, lol.

[JohnMichael]

Nature loves variety. Unfortunately, society hates it.


Thank you Worf for posting the link to the article. I wish humans could let other humans be happy the way penguins let other penguins be happy.

[poppachubby]

...the way penguins let other penguins be happy.

Gay penguins?

[dean_martin]

Nature loves variety. Unfortunately, society hates it.


Thank you Worf for posting the link to the article. I wish humans could let other humans be happy the way penguins let other penguins be happy.

Notwithstanding your poignant statement on variety, you could even put it this way, JM: I wish humans could let other humans be happy the way humans let penguins be happy.

(Of course this assumes there is no penguin abuse going on out there.)

[Auricauricle]

Kinda inneresting, when you think about it....Psychology and psychiatry, which have been in good positions to legitimize or stigmatize homosexuality, have cloaked themselves up in the garb of being honest to goodness sciences. In doing so, practitioners and researchers have striven to ensure that the objects of their study were apprehendable in terms that were empirically based, quanitifiable in nature and describable in terms that do not invoke the name of the Creator in doing so.

Somehow or another, the same-sex-preference behavior of some creatures has escaped the attention of many, who would write the whole thing off as fluctuation of a hormone or based on bad parenting. Regardless of its origins, the fact remains that some same-sexed singles and pairs are perfectly content. God alone knows how much suffering has been caused by persuading homosexuals to do otherwise, whether by surgery, psychotherapy or religion.

I don't think that this article or the literature supporting it will convert many of the hard core throng who is dead-set in their antipathy towards homosexuality. At the same time, perhaps it will open the eyes of many scientific folk, whose blinders have caused them to see human couples as bonded only by pocreative impulses--and not by something as messy as affection or love.

[Worf101]

I gave up on "organized" religion at the age of 12. Like my friend Laura Nyro wrote, "I was raised on the good book Jesus, till I read between the lines...." Most of my morals and the tenets I live by are universal truths, "live and let live", "treat others as you'd like to be treated" and more importantly "do no harm". Far as I'm concerned, love is love. Take it where you find it, give it when you can.

Worf

[JohnMichael]

I gave up on "organized" religion at the age of 12. Like my friend Laura Nyro wrote, "I was raised on the good book Jesus, till I read between the lines...." Most of my morals and the tenets I live by are universal truths, "live and let live", "treat others as you'd like to be treated" and more importantly "do no harm". Far as I'm concerned, love is love. Take it where you find it, give it when you can.

Worf

Words to live by, thank you.

[ForeverAutumn]

...love is love. Take it where you find it, give it when you can.

Worf

Probably the best statement I've read in years. Thanks.

[bobsticks]

Maybe we should send some penguins to Uganda...they could put some bones in their beaks, do a lil' bit of A Chorus Line ad invite the Pope over...it might work wonders...

[JohnMichael]

Maybe we should send some penguins to Uganda...they could put some bones in their beaks, do a lil' bit of A Chorus Line ad invite the Pope over...it might work wonders...

Uganda is not on my list of vacation spots. No matter how much I want to hear "What I Did For Love" performed by penguins.

[GMichael]

Uganda is not on my list of vacation spots. No matter how much I want to hear "What I Did For Love" performed by The Penguins.

I must have missed that single.

[bobsticks]

I must have missed that single.

Then you, my friend, are missing out. Some of those penguins can really throw down...

[ForeverAutumn]

Not to mention that they are great dancers!

[Auricauricle]

Big shots! Think they're so special with them tuxedos! Bah! Sissies!

[nightflier]

And here I thought we were talking about this penguin:



He gets along with everyone.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Maybe we should send some penguins to Uganda...they could put some bones in their beaks, do a lil' bit of A Chorus Line ad invite the Pope over...it might work wonders...

No you dent LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!