To Plasma or not to plasma... Questions.

[topspeed]

I've heard there are serious problems with plasma's as to their longevity. There are others here such as Woodman who will be able to qualify that far better than I. The rumor is that they will fry in about 5 years, tops. Before I unload a bunch of dead presidents on anything just because it is hip and cool, I'd consider how long it will last. Yes, plasma's native pixel rate is better than most crt and lcd sets. However, dlp's are right there and don't have the burn-in problem of plasmas. Also, the new LCOS sets are supposed to offer the best of all worlds. Right now, it seems that the best picture for the money is still good 'ol crt. They may not hang on the wall but their black level is still the best and they don't suffer the bleeding problems of first gen dlp's.

BTW, as far as getting a "cheap" plasma, buyer beware: you get what you pay for. There a good chance the picture will unlikely be better than a crt that you could have purchased for half the price. Just a thought...

Good luck

[yamdsp-a1]

I knew there was an issue with the longevity of the displays, although I didn't realize there life span was as low as 5 years. It is a lot of $$ to drop on something that only last five years...

I am hoping Woodman will drop in and give me his opinion on these things.

I am still pretty much set on getting one, unless I can find something about the same size, with about the same foot print. Most CRT's of the size I want, 42" widescreen, are just too big for the space I have, projection isn't an option because I can't get the room dark enough, and I don't know much about the other options available as the selection is very limited where I live.

I am hoping to get some research in before I go on my buying trip in March, so thanks very much for your input.

Yam

[Jetsons]

Plasma life of a quality screen is stated by manufacurers in the range of 50K-60K hours. At that point, the brightness of the screen reportedly decreases by 50% and you can adjust the contrast settings to compensate. Burn in is the main issue with these screens so one has to be careful in this regard.

As to models, I would suggest looking at something along the lines of the Panny commercial models (same as consumer w/o speakers and tuner) which have a far better picture than the models you mentioned. Price of the commercial 42" Panny is easily in line with any of the above mentioned panels.

Check out avsforum.com, plasma display forum and read for a couple of weeks. There is a wealth of info there on this subject.

Jet

[woodman]

Yam:
I highly urge you to unconsider buying a plasma display ... they're just not worth the pricetag. Especially, the cheaper ones that you say you're considering. About the only thing they have going for them is the "coolness" ... the "wow factor". To pay around $3K for such a limited payoff is not very cool IMO.

You say that you have space limitations that would eliminate an RPTV from contention. Give me the specifics please.

You also say that you cannot consider front projection because you cannot control the ambient light in the room. Again, give me the specifics for that "problem".

Let me try to help you avoid a costly buying "mistake" ... please. I flatly don't accept Jetson's statement that the mfgs. of plasma displays claim a life expectancy of 50,000 to 60,000 hours of operation before the brightness level drops to 50%. I think maybe he mistakenly saw one too many zeros. I would expect 5,000 to 6,000 hours would likely be more accurate, but they haven't been around long enough for anyone to know for sure.

[jeskibuff]

I would expect 5,000 to 6,000 hours would likely be more accurate, but they haven't been around long enough for anyone to know for sure.

And just where are you pulling these numbers from, Woodman? Do a quick websearch for "plasma lifespan" and you'll see a consistent 20K to 30,000 hours before that 50% mark is reached. Well, 30,000 hours works out to be 3.4 years if on 24 hours per day. Plasmas certainly have been around long enough for manufacturers to make those tests. As one site says, if you watch about 4 hours per day, you'll get about 21 years of life out of it before it hits that point where you have to adjust for the brightness factor.

[yamdsp-a1]

Thanks very much for the comments Jeff and woodman.

I'll let you guys duke it out over the lifespan issue - somewhere between 5,000 and 30,000 hours, that is a pretty broad range.

However, on to my issue. My space. My living room is about 15' by 25' and has a 10 ft screen door at the far back wall, directly behind the TV - from the viewing position - one smaller window and another 8 ft screen door to the left, and an open kitchen with windows behind. I don't own the place and thus don't particularly want to incur costs to re do all the blinds and drapery to get the room dark enough for a projection system - also very limited as to wiring things as the ceiling is open beam and vaulted. And the room is northwest facing so gets sun all afternoon and into the evening.

I have about 3 ft from the rear wall ( which is basically a screen door) to where the TV and stereo can be placed, given the room limitations and all the stereo equipment and about 10 ft between the two main speakers.

A projection TV won't work - mostly because I don't like them (I assume an RPTV is the same thing). A Plasma would fit nicely in the space, would sit well on top of my stereo cabinet and could be suspended from the beams in the ceiling if necessary.

So biggest limitations are:

1) It must sit on top of my stereo cabinet
2) It can't weigh too much
3) Must be at least 40" widescreen - otherwise I just keep my 27" Toshiba CRT
4) It will be used almost exclusively for DVD and video - I want a movie theater experience
5) Must have a future resale value

Thanks for the suggestions...

Yam

[jeskibuff]

5) Must have a future resale value

To me, THAT's the biggest argument against the plasma, for as the technology takes hold and more people buy them, the quicker their prices will drop. Mine has already dropped by a good chunk since I bought it (I'm not referring to the resale value, but the RETAIL price!) and other attractive options are out there (mine is EDTV, the newer ones are HDTV), including DLP and LCD. The DLPs look real good, but I don't know if I'd like the wheel noise. I LOVE the compact size and weight of the plasma, plus the display options. Sony's 70" DLP looked GREAT when I saw it though, making my 42" display look puny. But I'm happy with my plasma and will probably keep it for a while!

You should also factor into the cost the mounting method. Sitting a plasma on top of your cabinet may require an OPTIONAL stand, and they're NOT cheap. I hung mine on the wall with a DIY bracket for a total of less than $10.

[woodman]

And just where are you pulling these numbers from, Woodman? Do a quick websearch for "plasma lifespan" and you'll see a consistent 20K to 30,000 hours before that 50% mark is reached. Well, 30,000 hours works out to be 3.4 years if on 24 hours per day. Plasmas certainly have been around long enough for manufacturers to make those tests. As one site says, if you watch about 4 hours per day, you'll get about 21 years of life out of it before it hits that point where you have to adjust for the brightness factor.

FYI jeski, I got those numbers from Dick Cheney who told me that he invented the technology, and that "his" company (Halliburton, of course) makes ALL of the plasma displays for ALL of the other mfgs. Since we all know how that useless POS of a human lies, I should've known to take the info with more than a grain of salt - perhaps a pound of salt would've been sufficient, I don't know.

Furthermore, where did YOU come up with the idea that you can watch a plasma display for 20,000 or 30,000 hours - then suddenly, the brightness drops in half? The brightness will deteriorate slightly every day until that 50% level is reached ... NOT operate at full brightness - then suddenly drop as your post seemed to intimate.

[jeskibuff]

FYI jeski, I got those numbers from Dick Cheney who told me that he invented the technology, and that "his" company (Halliburton, of course) makes ALL of the plasma displays for ALL of the other mfgs. Since we all know how that useless POS of a human lies, I should've known to take the info with more than a grain of salt - perhaps a pound of salt would've been sufficient, I don't know.

First of all, Cheney is NO Al Gore, claiming to invent everything in the world. It's apparent that YOU are on some kind of hallucinogen. And no...we ALL don't believe that Cheney lies....just the conspiracy nut cases do. Care to provide specific examples? If so...do so in the "off-topic" forum, NOT HERE! You still haven't answered the question HONESTLY...where did you get YOUR numbers from?? Incidentally...a little closer look at those lifespans indicate that some newer plasmas hit the 60,000 hours expectancy figure.

Now, we DO have to take into account that these are MANUFACTURER'S claims and therefore are subject to the possibility of exaggeration, but HOW MUCH do you think they're going to "push" their claims and risk their credibility? Maybe a little, but NOT a lot, if they intend to maintain or enhance their market share.

And seeing's how plasma is a relatively new technology, I would expect that these manufacturers have on hand SCIENTISTS who are there to advance the technology in the interest of staying ahead of the competition. I would think it reasonable to believe that these scientists probably thoroughly understand the technology and its deficiencies and are working to overcome those problems to ensure their company remains competitive and successful and they therefore hang on to their well-paying employment. While there may not have been enough time to VERIFY one of the new displays out to 60,000 hours, they CAN interpolate data. In other words, if they know that an older display lasted 20,000 hours before hitting that 50% mark, they can most likely compare the RATE of decay from the new manufacturing process to the rate from the old process and therefore extrapolate the prediction of 60,000 hours WITHOUT ACTUALLY MEASURING IT for 60,000 hours. Is that an unreasonable assumption, in your opinion?

Furthermore, where did YOU come up with the idea that you can watch a plasma display for 20,000 or 30,000 hours - then suddenly, the brightness drops in half? The brightness will deteriorate slightly every day until that 50% level is reached ... NOT operate at full brightness - then suddenly drop as your post seemed to intimate.

Agreed. I thought about that a couple hours after I had posted it, but didn't feel it was important enough to correct.

So...once again....where are you getting 5,000 to 6,000 hours from? Is this some factual benchmark that you can point us to, or is it just a set of numbers you use to conveniently promote your biased opinion?