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  1. #26
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wireworm5
    Sorry to disagree with you, but most of the time when listening to music I watch tv in closed caption. So No, I don't need the soundtrack to follow the story, just the words.
    Another example: I used to work at a casino where they had a bank of tvs on one wall for simalcast horse racing. There were varies sizes in tv's some big, some small, some good picture quality others bad and well you couldn't hear the sound well due to all the other noise. Regardless of the tv type, they all served the purpose of conveying the info of what's happining with any particular horse race.
    Visuals is all that is needed in conveying a message or story.
    I'm going to have to side with PS on this one. I think video is #1, but audio is a damn close second - it's a huge part of every little bit of the story telling - I'm going to qualify my opinion:

    I think it's Season 5 of the show "24" on DVD that has a special feature about the guy who does the music - they do a neat exercise where they run the exact same scene over and over again, only each time they dub in a different background music theme. It is absolutely incredible how much of a difference in terms of setting the mood the musical selection makes, and the impression you take from what you're just watching. Off the top of my head, in one particular shot there's a romantic theme for Jack Bauer and his lady - Jack sees her for the first time in months and you can feel the sense of emotion the scene is trying to portray - they switched it up from the love music to a dark, creep, almost serial killer ditty - the same scene was eerily menacing. Instead of a sense for longing you thought that Jack was going to murder her! Only thing that changed was the background music. They do a few other musical selections, each time the scene conveys a totally different message.

    I dare say the choice of audio in a lot of movies can make or break each shot. I've greatly underestimated it's importance.

    Anyway, it's a great bonus feature bit that's worth watching if any of you have the DVD. I'd love to see examples of this.

  2. #27
    Audiophile Wireworm5's Avatar
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    You missed my point. As I mentioned earlier, enhanced sound took my gaming experience to a whole different level of enjoyment, with realistic explosions, etc.
    So it's the same with movies, sound will take the movie experience to a whole different level of enjoyment.
    As for sound being essential for either gaming or movies, NO!
    On the other hand you have radio which can tell a story with just words. The scene or picture is filled with your imagination.

  3. #28
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by musicman1999
    In a movie watching experience what percentage do people think is video and what percentage audio?and why.
    Interesting question. Like others, listening to music provides more enjoyment to me than watching movies. On the other hand, I find that the video experience is definitely improved when the sound component is more convincing. There if far more to a good soundtrack than the dialogue - I find the trick to be providing the illusion of being in whatever space the scene calls for. On a busy street. In the forest. In an auditorium. On a spacecraft. By far, the most convincing example I've heard is from a reviewer friend's spectacular system. It is significantly better than anything else I've heard, certainly including commercial theatres. It simply disappears and allows you focus on the story.

    Because I am audio focused, I find that a poor system has a greater effect to detract from the experience. It is not unusual that I have to stuff some tissue in my ears at theatres because of the loud, harsh, mediocre quality sound. The same is true when I attend live plays. Recently, the wife and I attended a dinner theatre event at the local university. The sound reinforcement consisted of several Peavy PA horns. Whoever mounted the speakers did not understand the concept of dispersion. They had oriented the cabinets with the mouth of the HF horn aligned vertically - creating a narrowly focused, hard sounding beam aimed directly at our table! I was miserable until the break where I could pack my ears to prevent further misery. Didn't pay much attention to the play.

    I'm saying 50/50.

    rw

  4. #29
    Forum Regular pixelthis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    Interesting question. Like others, listening to music provides more enjoyment to me than watching movies. On the other hand, I find that the video experience is definitely improved when the sound component is more convincing. There if far more to a good soundtrack than the dialogue - I find the trick to be providing the illusion of being in whatever space the scene calls for. On a busy street. In the forest. In an auditorium. On a spacecraft. By far, the most convincing example I've heard is from a reviewer friend's spectacular system. It is significantly better than anything else I've heard, certainly including commercial theatres. It simply disappears and allows you focus on the story.

    Because I am audio focused, I find that a poor system has a greater effect to detract from the experience. It is not unusual that I have to stuff some tissue in my ears at theatres because of the loud, harsh, mediocre quality sound. The same is true when I attend live plays. Recently, the wife and I attended a dinner theatre event at the local university. The sound reinforcement consisted of several Peavy PA horns. Whoever mounted the speakers did not understand the concept of dispersion. They had oriented the cabinets with the mouth of the HF horn aligned vertically - creating a narrowly focused, hard sounding beam aimed directly at our table! I was miserable until the break where I could pack my ears to prevent further misery. Didn't pay much attention to the play.

    I'm saying 50/50.

    rw
    WRONG, but I do agree with you that audio is important, even with dialog getting the right timber in the voices really adds to the experience.
    And now let me settle this with a little experiment.

    Think audio is near as important as video to humans?
    Well, plug up your ears and walk around the house for awhile, how does that impair you?
    NOW do the same with a blindfold on, you will quickly learn what the most important sense is to the average human.
    Some old farts refuse to wear their hearing aids, but they ALL wear their glasses
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  5. #30
    Suspended PeruvianSkies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    WRONG, but I do agree with you that audio is important, even with dialog getting the right timber in the voices really adds to the experience.
    And now let me settle this with a little experiment.

    Think audio is near as important as video to humans?
    Well, plug up your ears and walk around the house for awhile, how does that impair you?
    NOW do the same with a blindfold on, you will quickly learn what the most important sense is to the average human.
    Some old farts refuse to wear their hearing aids, but they ALL wear their glasses
    Again, you can't see the forest through the trees. We are not talking about how important hearing and seeing is when walking around our house, we are talking about it's importance when watching (and hearing) a film. Also, how this relates to us in high-end video and high-end audio terms.

    You tried to say that I am comparing apples and oranges...you aren't even comparing food, you're about as far off as apples and laundry detergent.

  6. #31
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    Think audio is near as important as video to humans?
    What does that have to do with the question advanced?

    In a movie watching experience what percentage do people think is video and what percentage audio?and why.

    rw

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeruvianSkies
    Again, you can't see the forest through the trees.
    No, but he is ("getting the right timber in the voices" ) thinking about lumber.

    rw

  8. #33
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    I'd like to answer this questions two ways:

    1) Average Joe probably cares more about the video quality. Maybe not as much as some of use do, but more so than the sound. As proof, I present the growing HD movement as well as the popularity of Bose cubes and HTIB systems.

    2) From my perspective? Let's see, I paid about 4 times as much on my audio than my video. I'd say I care more about the sound. But I need to have both to be happy.

    May I have both please? A 106 inch HD screen AND good sound with heart pounding base. Yeah, both is best. Mark me down for both.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  9. #34
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    Great responses,keep em coming.It is good to see most people know how much the music and foley effects mean to the movie watching experience.I saw a film a while back,don't remember what it was,but it had an option to watch the film with only the music track.It really shows what music can do.If you have any films with this option,give it a try.

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  10. #35
    Suspended PeruvianSkies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    No, but he is ("getting the right timber in the voices" ) thinking about lumber.

    rw
    In my best Larry the Cable Guy....

    Now that's funny right there...I don't care who you are...that's funny!

  11. #36
    Forum Regular pixelthis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeruvianSkies
    Again, you can't see the forest through the trees. We are not talking about how important hearing and seeing is when walking around our house, we are talking about it's importance when watching (and hearing) a film. Also, how this relates to us in high-end video and high-end audio terms.

    You tried to say that I am comparing apples and oranges...you aren't even comparing food, you're about as far off as apples and laundry detergent.
    More gobbledegook that signifies nothing.
    You have tenk worth of audio gear so obviously good sound in important to you.
    What I cant seem to get through that rather thick skull of yours is that
    IS NOT NORMAL.
    Why open a debate if you are not going to entertain what people tell you?
    What I was pointing out in my little demo was that the visual sense is so overwhelmingly
    important to the human animal that anything visual is going to outweigh
    anything audio by a far margin.
    I live in a college town with a population of 50 to 150 thousand , depening on when school is in.
    And when I buy audio equipment I had better LOVE it because unless I want to give it away or put it in the attic I'm pretty much stuck with it.
    My TV sets usually go fast and at a good price however.
    In another thread you didnt beleive that I auditioned a pair of speakers for two hours, well, thats the minimum, because they are the key ingredient to your system,
    and if I decide I cant live with em tough, I'm usually stuck with em.
    Does this give you some impression of the importance of video vs audio to most?
    EVERYBODY wants a HT hese days, but audiophile systems are rarer and rarer these days.
    And that is a HT with crap speakers usually, most cant beleive that my center cost 300 bucks by itself. I dont bother to tell them that my front speaker cables were 200 bucks,
    and I have over six hundred bucks worth of cables in my dvd/sacd player.
    Most dont spend that much on their entire set of speakers these days
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  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    More gobbledegook that signifies nothing.
    You have tenk worth of audio gear so obviously good sound in important to you.
    What I cant seem to get through that rather thick skull of yours is that
    IS NOT NORMAL.
    Why open a debate if you are not going to entertain what people tell you?
    What I was pointing out in my little demo was that the visual sense is so overwhelmingly
    important to the human animal that anything visual is going to outweigh
    anything audio by a far margin.
    I live in a college town with a population of 50 to 150 thousand , depening on when school is in.
    And when I buy audio equipment I had better LOVE it because unless I want to give it away or put it in the attic I'm pretty much stuck with it.
    My TV sets usually go fast and at a good price however.
    In another thread you didnt beleive that I auditioned a pair of speakers for two hours, well, thats the minimum, because they are the key ingredient to your system,
    and if I decide I cant live with em tough, I'm usually stuck with em.
    Does this give you some impression of the importance of video vs audio to most?
    EVERYBODY wants a HT hese days, but audiophile systems are rarer and rarer these days.
    And that is a HT with crap speakers usually, most cant beleive that my center cost 300 bucks by itself. I dont bother to tell them that my front speaker cables were 200 bucks,
    and I have over six hundred bucks worth of cables in my dvd/sacd player.
    Most dont spend that much on their entire set of speakers these days
    But what i wanted to know is,what is more important to YOU,not to people in general.And please stop quoting the price of your speakers,you must understand that many,many people on this forum would consider a $300 center a "crap speaker",but you don't hear them coming out with numbers.


    bill
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  13. #38
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeruvianSkies
    In my best Larry the Cable Guy...
    LTCG is hilarious. I catch him on XM comedy from time to time.

    Why is this guy debating our preferences? There is no one answer here, right or wrong. D'ya think that those who post on audioreview.com might share a teeny weeny bias in the audio direction?

    I think Pix would be happier if he chills out a bit.

    rw

  14. #39
    Forum Regular pixelthis's Avatar
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    LTCG is hilarious. I catch him on XM comedy from time to time.

    Why is this guy debating our preferences? There is no one answer here, right or wrong. D'ya think that those who post on audioreview.com might share a teeny weeny bias in the audio direction?

    I think Pix would be happier if he chills out a bit.

    rw
    Its five in the morning, I'm about as "chilled" as you can get.
    If there is no "right or wrong" answer then why post the question?
    And why is it important what I (or anybody) on this site perfers?
    They are all a bunch of sticklers that are way outta the norm.
    NOBODY I KNOW PAYS as much for speakers as I do, except a friend, sometimes we trade them back and forth.
    And 300 bucks is a good average price for a center channel on a lower to midline system,
    which is what I have. I dont have "ten k" to spend on an audio system alone,
    I work for a living, but I will part with video before audio, if that answers your question,
    which you dont seem to WANT answered
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  15. #40
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    I dont bother to tell them that my front speaker cables were 200 bucks,
    and I have over six hundred bucks worth of cables in my dvd/sacd player.
    Yeah, I'd probably keep that on the down-low too, if I were you.

  16. #41
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    Its five in the morning, I'm about as "chilled" as you can get.
    It's all about attitude.

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    If there is no "right or wrong" answer then why post the question?
    Frequently posters ask for opinions to better understand each other.

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    ... but I will part with video before audio, if that answers your question,
    which you dont seem to WANT answered:
    Actually, you just made my point. Those who post here tend to favor the audio side.

    rw

  17. #42
    His and Her Room! westcott's Avatar
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    I think audio is equally as important as video. But, from most of the entertainment centers\home theaters I have seen, audio definately takes a back seat to video in most cases. Improper speaker placement, poor seating distance, htib speaker approach in large rooms, improper room orientation, no calibration or bass management, etc. all in the name of good looks.

    I am afraid we are the lucky few that know what quality sound is and have an equal appreciation for its reproduction.

  18. #43
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    Well said.

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  19. #44
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Worthwhile music versus ...

    Quote Originally Posted by musicman1999
    Peruvianskies proposed a question in another thread:What do people want high end audio or video?I think its a great question.
    In a movie watching experience what percentage do people think is video and what percentage audio?and why.

    thanks
    bill
    Worthwhile music vs. worthwhile video??? It might be a difficult question for some, but for me there's a lot more worthwhile music, (and 98% of it is classical ; it's my current project to ensure that I have a decent recording of everything on my Core Classical Compositions list). You can tell from my rare participation in the Favorite Films forum that I'm not big into cinema much less other video forms.

    I find when I do happen to be engrossed in a good movie that the sound experience becomes subliminal. And so it's hard for me to decide how important sound quality really is. Sure, I definitely prefer 5.1 to stereo, however for pure HT, that is, movies, I would never spend the kind of cash I'm willing to to listen to music. Chances are I'd settle for Bose, (or a cheaper as-good alternative).

  20. #45
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    Is stickler another way of saying "elitest jerk"?

  21. #46
    Suspended PeruvianSkies's Avatar
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    an interesting article...


  22. #47
    Forum Regular pixelthis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    Is stickler another way of saying "elitest jerk"?
    I hope not because I am a stickler, which is just another way of saying perfectionist.
    Peruvian skier is obsessed with this "audio vs video " question, and its a totally rediculous
    thing, even those who love audio, when faced with going deaf or blind will choose
    deaf, since a human who is deaf is still very functional.
    Which one do I LIKE more? Well, watching a movie video is key, listening to a C.D
    audio is king, which Do I like better?
    Why do I have to like one over the other?
    I like music but really like music videos, so do I favor video over audio? Who knows?
    And who cares? I like enjoyable experiences, no matter what they are composed of,
    go over to see your lady friend, does it matter what kind of car you drive?
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  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    I hope not because I am a stickler, which is just another way of saying perfectionist.
    Peruvian skier is obsessed with this "audio vs video " question, and its a totally rediculous
    thing, even those who love audio, when faced with going deaf or blind will choose
    deaf, since a human who is deaf is still very functional.

    > Are you saying blind folks aren't functional? Watch out now. I personally would rather be blind. I couldn't imagine what it would be like without being able to listen to music.

    Which one do I LIKE more? Well, watching a movie video is key, listening to a C.D
    audio is king, which Do I like better?
    Why do I have to like one over the other?

    > Don't over analyze the question. It's not a trick question.

    I like music but really like music videos, so do I favor video over audio? Who knows?
    And who cares? I like enjoyable experiences, no matter what they are composed of,

    Well pardon the analogy. Jerking off may be an enjoyable experience but would you rather do that or have a night of lustful passion with a 25 year old nimpho swim suit model?
    go over to see your lady friend, does it matter what kind of car you drive?
    > That probably depends on your lady friend. They would probably rather you drive them around in a BMW than a Hyundai missing a fender. And which would make them brag more? Well.... the answer to that question is if you were able to satisfy the nimpho

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    I hope not because I am a stickler, which is just another way of saying perfectionist.
    Peruvian skier is obsessed with this "audio vs video " question, and its a totally rediculous
    thing, even those who love audio, when faced with going deaf or blind will choose
    deaf, since a human who is deaf is still very functional.
    Which one do I LIKE more? Well, watching a movie video is key, listening to a C.D
    audio is king, which Do I like better?
    Why do I have to like one over the other?
    I like music but really like music videos, so do I favor video over audio? Who knows?
    And who cares? I like enjoyable experiences, no matter what they are composed of,
    go over to see your lady friend, does it matter what kind of car you drive?
    I am hardly obsessed with this question, but I do feel that it is an interesting one as it stirs debate and quite frankly the question is not posed in such a way that you need to choose one over the other. Both are equally important. However, my sense is that most people attribute a good home theater based on what they see (as in the size of the screen etc etc) and not the quality of the sound. That doesn't mean that sound is not critical, but typically people don't think about good and bad sound until they hear truly awful sound....then they notice it.

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    I feel you are right, that the word "theater" in most minds is synonomous with a large screen. If you told a friend to come over and see your home theater set up, they would be disappointed to walk in and see a 27" TV, even if surrounded by a killer sound system.

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