Results 1 to 15 of 15
  1. #1
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    6,307

    OMG what happened...

    ...my stereo sounds like crap.

    I have been very pleased with my stereo with the addition of the JBL Studio 530's. This morning I was playing my favorite recording of Beethoven's "9th Symphony" by the LSO. This morning it was not sounding good.

    I began to question the speakers or maybe I need to switch IC's. I even thought maybe I was developing some sinus congestion. I thought of anything that could cause such a change.

    The problem was I was playing a hybrid sacd and I did not set the SA8001 for sacd and had been listening to the cd layer. I am glad I figured it out and switched to sacd. All was right again.

    I had never played the cd layer of a hybrid sacd before. I always appreciated sacd's before and well recorded cd's but what happened with this cd layer? It was bad enough to cause me to question if my stereo or I were operating properly. Has anyone else noticed such a quality change between sacd and cd?
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
    Int. Amp Krell S-300i
    Speaker
    Monitor Audio RS6
    Cables
    AQ SPKR and AQ XLR and IC

  2. #2
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    6,826
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnMichael View Post
    ...my stereo sounds like crap.

    I have been very pleased with my stereo with the addition of the JBL Studio 530's. This morning I was playing my favorite recording of Beethoven's "9th Symphony" by the LSO. This morning it was not sounding good.

    I began to question the speakers or maybe I need to switch IC's. I even thought maybe I was developing some sinus congestion. I thought of anything that could cause such a change.

    The problem was I was playing a hybrid sacd and I did not set the SA8001 for sacd and had been listening to the cd layer. I am glad I figured it out and switched to sacd. All was right again.

    I had never played the cd layer of a hybrid sacd before. I always appreciated sacd's before and well recorded cd's but what happened with this cd layer? It was bad enough to cause me to question if my stereo or I were operating properly. Has anyone else noticed such a quality change between sacd and cd?
    Maybe the CD layer wasn't so bad, but your hearing set the SACD layer as the reference.

    I have noticed this difference as well, but only when the master came from DXD, and transferred to SACD. The SACD layer sounded so much better than the CD layer, it was quite noticeable.
    Sir Terrence

    Titan Reference 3D 1080p projector
    200" SI Black Diamond II screen
    Oppo BDP-103D
    Datastat RS20I audio/video processor 12.4 audio setup
    9 Onkyo M-5099 power amp
    9 Onkyo M-510 power amp
    9 Onkyo M-508 power amp
    6 custom CAL amps for subs
    3 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid monitors
    18 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid surround/ceiling speakers
    2 custom 15" sealed FFEC servo subs
    4 custom 15" H-PAS FFEC servo subs
    THX Style Baffle wall

  3. #3
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    St. Paul, Minnesota
    Posts
    5,421
    I have always found the Cd layer of a hybrid SACD to sound fantastic. The Cd layer is usually Mastered very well.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  4. #4
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    6,307
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible View Post
    Maybe the CD layer wasn't so bad, but your hearing set the SACD layer as the reference.

    I have noticed this difference as well, but only when the master came from DXD, and transferred to SACD. The SACD layer sounded so much better than the CD layer, it was quite noticeable.

    Thanks for the information. I had no idea there could be that much difference. The SA8001 plays cd's nicely so I was surprised over the lack of focus and detail.
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
    Int. Amp Krell S-300i
    Speaker
    Monitor Audio RS6
    Cables
    AQ SPKR and AQ XLR and IC

  5. #5
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    6,307
    Quote Originally Posted by blackraven View Post
    I have always found the Cd layer of a hybrid SACD to sound fantastic. The Cd layer is usually Mastered very well.


    I would think they were both from the same DSD master with one SACD and then converted for CD
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
    Int. Amp Krell S-300i
    Speaker
    Monitor Audio RS6
    Cables
    AQ SPKR and AQ XLR and IC

  6. #6
    Aging Smartass
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Moore, SC
    Posts
    1,003
    As an owner of the same SACD player you have (the Marantz SA-8001), I find your post a bit curious: the player automatically switches to SACD playback whenver a hybid disc is inserted. You have to purposely choose the CD layer if you wish to listen to it.

    That being said, whenever I've compared the two layers of any hybrid disc I own, the SACD layer always wins out with the CD layer, in comparison, sounding thin, dry and a bit lifeless. I would imagine that if I had somehow selected the CD layer of a particular hybrid disc I listen to often I too would wonder what had gone wrong. Still, I've never found the CD layer to be downright lousy, since it comes from the DSD master of the hybid recoding, though I would never choose to listen to the CD layer other than for comparison purposes, and then, only for a short time.

  7. #7
    Suspended markw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Noo Joisey. Youse got a problem wit dat?
    Posts
    4,659
    I've heard slight differences myself but never such a gross difference that ruins a fine piece of music.

    Is it possible to try the cd in another player of known quality? Perhaps it's actually a software issue.

  8. #8
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    6,307
    Quote Originally Posted by emaidel View Post
    As an owner of the same SACD player you have (the Marantz SA-8001), I find your post a bit curious: the player automatically switches to SACD playback whenver a hybid disc is inserted. You have to purposely choose the CD layer if you wish to listen to it.
    No my player remains at CD unless I select SACD. It works perfectly and sounds great but SACD is manually selected.
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
    Int. Amp Krell S-300i
    Speaker
    Monitor Audio RS6
    Cables
    AQ SPKR and AQ XLR and IC

  9. #9
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    6,307
    Quote Originally Posted by markw View Post
    I've heard slight differences myself but never such a gross difference that ruins a fine piece of music.

    Is it possible to try the cd in another player of known quality? Perhaps it's actually a software issue.

    I think part of the issue is I had always heard the SACD layer. I may be overstating the difference between the Sacd layer and the CD layer but much of the magic was gone.
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
    Int. Amp Krell S-300i
    Speaker
    Monitor Audio RS6
    Cables
    AQ SPKR and AQ XLR and IC

  10. #10
    Forum Regular filecat13's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    492
    One time when I was attempting to show off my little Two Jims Theatre to some guests, I just got the sinking feeling that the whole system wasn't up to par. It looked and sounded good to them, but I just thought, "This looks and sounds like crap." Finally, I couldn't take it anymore and just stopped everything while I fussed around with the gear to see what was wrong. They probably thought I was nuts.

    The problem?

    In the darkness, I'd put in the DVD rather than the Bluray. No amount of tweaking was going to cure that. Once they saw and heard the Bluray, they understood my nutty behavior.

    I've got the multichannel Hybrid SACD of the 9th by the LSO, and I can hardly listen to the stereo recording after hearing the multichannel. The stereo is good enough on its own I suppose, but it seems flat and lifeless when you've heard the other. If that's the one you have, then I don't doubt it's very noticeable (even in stereo).
    I like sulung tang.

  11. #11
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    6,307
    Quote Originally Posted by filecat13 View Post
    One time when I was attempting to show off my little Two Jims Theatre to some guests, I just got the sinking feeling that the whole system wasn't up to par. It looked and sounded good to them, but I just thought, "This looks and sounds like crap." Finally, I couldn't take it anymore and just stopped everything while I fussed around with the gear to see what was wrong. They probably thought I was nuts.

    The problem?

    In the darkness, I'd put in the DVD rather than the Bluray. No amount of tweaking was going to cure that. Once they saw and heard the Bluray, they understood my nutty behavior.

    I've got the multichannel Hybrid SACD of the 9th by the LSO, and I can hardly listen to the stereo recording after hearing the multichannel. The stereo is good enough on its own I suppose, but it seems flat and lifeless when you've heard the other. If that's the one you have, then I don't doubt it's very noticeable (even in stereo).


    Yes I do have the multi channel sacd and even in stereo the sacd playback is far superior.
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
    Int. Amp Krell S-300i
    Speaker
    Monitor Audio RS6
    Cables
    AQ SPKR and AQ XLR and IC

  12. #12
    Forum Regular
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Home Of The Fighting Gamecocks
    Posts
    1,701
    With my SA8004 it's not selectable as far as I can tell. It automatically plays the SACD layer if there's one present and spells out SACD across the view screen.

  13. #13
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    6,307
    Quote Originally Posted by Poultrygeist View Post
    With my SA8004 it's not selectable as far as I can tell. It automatically plays the SACD layer if there's one present and spells out SACD across the view screen.


    My SA8001 has a row of rectangular silver buttons immediately under the display. The far left button is for dimming or turning off the display and the one on the far right is for selecting between SACD or CD. They look more like silver trim than buttons.

    When I first received the player I thought it odd that I had to select the SACD layer. I had also read about people having problems with the player not reading certain discs and a noisy transport. My player seemed to not have those problems and the sound was very good so I could easily overlook having to choose the layer I wanted to hear.
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
    Int. Amp Krell S-300i
    Speaker
    Monitor Audio RS6
    Cables
    AQ SPKR and AQ XLR and IC

  14. #14
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    St. Paul, Minnesota
    Posts
    5,421
    Clearly SACD layers sound better than the CD layer but when I have bought a hybrid SACD and compared the CD layer to a non hybrid SACD version of the same album, the CD layer of the hybrid SACD wins out every time.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  15. #15
    Aging Smartass
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Moore, SC
    Posts
    1,003
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnMichael View Post
    No my player remains at CD unless I select SACD. It works perfectly and sounds great but SACD is manually selected.
    I find that strange, but don't doubt you. Perhaps you bought yours before I bought mine, and Marantz made a change in design. The only flaw I've found in the player - and it really irritates me - is the ridiculously slow fast forward and reverse times - only twice the normal playing speed. I've owned many older CD players, and none acted this way. If I want to listen to the last 10 minutes of a 30 minute track, it takes fully 10 minutes of scanning to get there! One would hope that Marantz improved this silly deisgn flaw in their 8003 and 8004 models.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •