line seperating mid range and high end?

[E-Stat]

I bet if we sat Melvin in front of a couple Martin Logan's..

Or other superb speakers from:

Apogee
Sonus Faber
Nola
Kharma
Avalon
Wilson
Magnepan
Quad
Innersound
Legacy Audio
Focal
Dali
Revel
Thiel
Bower & Wilkins
MBL
Rockport
King
and dozens of others far too many to list. There are so many good products on the market today!

rw

[melvin walker]

Or other superb speakers from:

Apogee
Sonus Faber
Nola
Kharma
Avalon
Wilson
Magnepan
Quad
Innersound
Legacy Audio
Focal
Dali
Revel
Thiel
Bower & Wilkins
MBL
Rockport
King
and dozens of others far too many to list. There are so many good products on the market today!

rw

Quad and Thiel I have heard , I would lean more toward the Quad's. The speakers you listed leans more toward mid base and mid range. I will also add that sub woofers do a poor job of reproducing clean base.

One think to remember is that musical taste has changed. Most singers today are untrained , few sing with orchestras. Few singers today would dare sing standards , as they would be compared to earlier singers. I shutter when listening to singers today , most have poor breathing , very little range and phasing is completely lost.

I remember listening to Linda Ronstadt's trying to sing standards , Nelson Riddle did all he could using featured instruments and mass strings to cover up her vocal limitations.
Natalie Cole just did not have the range or ability to sing with Nat King Cole some of the standards he did earlier.

Since most of today's recording artist avoid standards , knowing that if compared to pre-1970 popular singers , Cole Sinatra , Como , Day . Wilson , etc, They would come off sounding terrible. An example when a concert pianist plays Chopin he is compared because those listening has heard Chopin played by others. Most of today's popular singers would make a fool of themselves trying to sing Cole Porters " Night and Day" or
Rogers and Hart's " My funny valentine " .
I hope you get my point.

[E-Stat]

The speakers you listed leans more toward mid base and mid range.

That is simply not the case for many of those. Wilson Alexandrias or Nola Grand References lacking bass or top end? Surely you jest!

Since most of today's recording artist avoid standards...

Who said anything about Linda Ronstadt or current pop singers? I'm thinking large scale symphonic on labels like Classic, RR, Telarc, etc. No, I really don't get your point.

rw

[melvin walker]

That is simply not the case for many of those. Wilson Alexandrias or Nola Grand References lacking bass or top end? Surely you jest!


Who said anything about Linda Ronstadt or current pop singers? I'm thinking large scale symphonic on labels like Classic, RR, Telarc, etc. No, I really don't get your point.

rw

There are several ways one can test one's audio equipment. A vocal , small jazz trio ,
and an orchestra. The labels you referred to are they records or CO's ?
Records generally have more definition than CD's. The European record labels generally do a much better job of pressing LP's.

Linda Ronstadt recorded an LP with Nelson Riddle one of America's finest arrangers.
Mr. Riddle did his finest work with Frank Sinatra and Nat King Cole. He also had several hit recording himself.
The singer front and center with an orchestra accompaning him. Most of today's singers would have a problem with that. You should be able to hear Sinatra's voice tremble.

A jazz trio playing a ballad , where you can hear the strings of the bass fiddle and the mellow tones of the grand piano in addition to the brush of the drums.
Ie, Oscar Peterson Trio.

Classical recordings of Beethoven's 9th Symphony , Rachmanoff Piano Concertos are
Tchaikovsky symphonies. All done on an LP Pressed in Europe.
We are not just looking for dynamics but also definition. There are no sounds more wonderful than the cords of a Steinway concert Grand.

That is what audio equipment is all about. As close to being there as possible. One should first visit a concert hall , such as Powell Symphony Hall in St.Louis , Avery Fisher Hall in D.C. or Carnegie Hall in New York or any great symphony hall in America.
One needs a reference to really know what outstanding sound is.

[snodog]

Hey PEABODY,
If I did decide to wait a while and go with the Outlaw 7075 and 970 combo would that work out for audio and video? The dvi can be remedied via a dvi to hdmi cable which I used on my old mits tv when I had it. Is that not the best one to get for theatre and music? What do you think? I am probably not going to spend over $1000 so I want to make sure I take my time and get the right piece. Or do you think the Onkyo 705 for around $700 would be better suited for a multipurpose piece?

[E-Stat]

There are several ways one can test one's audio equipment. A vocal , small jazz trio ,
and an orchestra. The labels you referred to are they records or CO's ?

Both, but Telarc has always recorded digitally either in Redbook or SACD. What they do especially well is record using a minimal miking technique that provides great perspective. Reference Recordings has done both analog and digital. I have an analog recording of Symphony Fantastique on 45 RPM vinyl. Classic reissues all sorts of recordings on vinyl. I've heard quite a few 50s era recordings that still shine today.

That is what audio equipment is all about. As close to being there as possible. One should first visit a concert hall , such as Powell Symphony Hall in St.Louis , Avery Fisher Hall in D.C. or Carnegie Hall in New York or any great symphony hall in America. One needs a reference to really know what outstanding sound is.

Agreed, although I listen to a lot of music because of the content and not the production. I confess a particular bias toward that concept Harry Pearson advanced years ago with The Absolute Sound since I met him through his long term friend Dr. Cooledge twenty five years ago.

I have a great live music reference in my home with the wife's baby grand. Since we moved to a small college town where she teaches, we also have many opportunities to hear a variety of concerts at the university.

rw

[snodog]

That would be greatly appreciated Mr. Peabody if you ever have a few extra minutes to look on their site. I am beginning to understand some things but it takes a while and a lot of reading.

[basite]

That is what audio equipment is all about. As close to being there as possible. One should first visit a concert hall , such as Powell Symphony Hall in St.Louis , Avery Fisher Hall in D.C. or Carnegie Hall in New York or any great symphony hall in America.
One needs a reference to really know what outstanding sound is.

yes, and that is what today's gear can get closer to.


you said the speakers E-stat listed were more 'mid bas and midrange' or what was it? I can assure you they will provide cleaner bass, mids, highs and ultrasonics than any vintage speaker ever built.

[melvin walker]

yes, and that is what today's gear can get closer to.


you said the speakers E-stat listed were more 'mid bas and midrange' or what was it? I can assure you they will provide cleaner bass, mids, highs and ultrasonics than any vintage speaker ever built.

We have had an interesting debate , comparing audio equipment of different generations.
We have agreed to disagree . I would suggest that the only way to arrive at a conclusion
is an A-B test.

Remember humans have difficulty remembering sound. The A-B test is the answer .The correct way to have an A-B test is to sit down in a symphony hall with a curtain and
audition two different systems.
They did that in St.Louis at Powell Symphony Hall , prepared by Bob Shaw of Gordon Sound , an audio engineer and Bozak rep. There were several displays of this type done in the late 50's , 60's and early 70's.

Since we all hear different there still was debates Bozak vs Lansing , Marantz vs McIntosh , Thorens vs Fairchild , Shure vs Ortofon , Revox vs Ampex etc.
Now the differences are also generational. Tubes vs transistors , digital vs analog etc.
We had lots of fun and met many different people.

If I remember there was a chevy man and a Ford man. Today there is a BMW man and a Mercedes man , only the names has changed.
It's a pleasure debating with many members of the Audio Review Forum.