Investment + Insurance?

[nightflier]

Dean, Slump,

I have a lot of items that I have purchased second hand, traded, purchased at swap meets, etc. (art, antiques, and some of my gear). None of these have receipts and their value is hard to determine (some of my art has appreciated, and most of my gear has depreciated). I have photos of most of my valuable items and I suppose I can print blue book values for the gear. I know this will need to be reviewed on a per-item basis, but generally speaking, will this be enough documentation? If not, what else will I need or am I then not able to insure these items?

[SlumpBuster]

Yeah, I'd have to refer you to my original post: Talk to an insurance agent.

There are alot of devil's advocate problems with what you describe. Most of my concerns run along the idea that "one man's treasure is another man's trash." You have to remember that $3000 vintage tuner is worth precisely $0 to 99.99% of the population. Ours is an ever decreasing in popularity hobby. So imagine you have to sue your insurance company because your house burned down and they won't pay, and you have to convince a jury that "no my Appogees really were worth $20k and had $10k worth of upgrades." Nevermind the fact that your going to have to spend thousands on a valuation expert to corroborate your assertion. Yeah, I doubt a jury's gonna buy that. If you don't believe me ask around. While you at it ask anyone you know how much they would pay for a Klimt. However, its an entirely different story if you and the insurance company agreed to a value in advance of the loss.

But, California is a perfect example of differences between states. Cali is a "bad faith" state as far as I know (unless they've changed anything recently). That means that if you can demonstrate that the claim was denied in bad faith, the insurer may be responsible for your attorney fees.

All of this belies my most important point: Understand your coverage, get it in writing, ask lots of questions, if it sounds to good to be true it is, you get what you pay for, you are buying a product so kick the tires, and do this all BEFORE you have to make a claim, not after. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

Finally, to quote Back to School "Your wife was just showing me her Klimt."

[nightflier]

Finally, to quote Back to School "Your wife was just showing me her Klimt."

What exactly do you mean?

[SlumpBuster]

Sorry, my banal attempt at humor. Gustav Klimt was a painter. Until recently one of his paintings was the most expensive ever sold for like 120 million. My point in the post was that most people would not pay a $120 for a Klimt, let alone 120 million dollars. Similarly, many people would pay cash money to haul away some of our audio monstrosities, let alone compensate you tens of thousands of dollars for an insurance lose.

In the movie Back to School, starring Rodney Danderfield, there is a joke. Rodney, having just caught his wife cheating on him during a party they are throwing at his house, returns to the party. A man, standing below a painting by Klimt, remarks "Your wife was just showing me her Klimt." Rodney, having no idea what a Klimt is, states "You too? She's been showing everybody." "Yes, its a remarkable painting," says the man. "Oh yeah, the painting. Thanks," retorts Rodney.

My reference to Klimt made me think of the joke. By no means a reference to your wife, if you have one.

[Groundbeef]

One other thought to keep in mind w/insurance. I often obtain riders for expensive electronics (DVD Camcorder, Laptop, etc) even though my homeowners insurance would cover the loss if it is stolen or lost.

The main reason is that a rider does not require you to pay your deductable for your homeowners insurance. Also, the loss does not go against your insurance, so no raise in your rates. This is because you are actually paying for individual coverage of the item.

Riders are a bit expensive generally about $1 per $100 in coverage for yearly coverage. But, the lack of rate increases if you suffer a loss may negate the higher cost. Anyway, just my 2 cents worth.

[hermanv]

My house burned down last year. I listed all my 2 channel electronics, my home stereo, DVDs, CDs tapes and Laser Disks. All listed and itemized by brand age and cost (a lot of damn work, for which you will not be compensated) my insurance company insisted on detailed itemized lists not all of them do.

Some companies will look at your coverage limit and say it to you "this looks like 85% destruction how about 85% of the dollar amount of your coverage" and you negotiate from there. Other's like mine, want to negotiate every last item, teaspoon, paper back book and Martin Logan speaker.

They look at replacement cost and depreciation using "experts" to valuate each item and offer you some percentage of that (they are not required to use licensed experts, but you are). I challenged some audiophile item valuations by submitting actual used prices paid over the last 5 years (this is available from Audiogon for a small fee). So far they have come around. They don't allways, many companies assume you wont make as big an effort to collect as their permanent paid staff does to stop you. They might make you get appraisals.

If they can prove you are a "collector" then you probably need to have a seperate rider, just having expensive stereo equipment does not let them off the hook, after a long tussle (no courts or lawyers) they paid.

So far we are 15 months into the process, my house is just starting to get rebuilt and I have probably been paid for about 60% of my possesions that were listed. We didn't list them all. We lived there for 35 years and like many, had accumulated vast armies of stuff.

[Bernd]

Wow, what a nightmare to have your house turned into charcoal. That's one of my biggest fears.
I have, as you, amassed large amounts of stuff and have a couple of large music collections.
I wish you a speedy rebuild and may that be the worst thing that will happen to you.

Peace

Bernd