Interesting development on AR.com today

[dmb_fan]

I'll put up some rules soon.

-Eric

Eric,

I've been a member here since 2000 with a long absence for most of 2003 due to the worst troll problem I've ever seen on an internet message board. I mention the troll problem to help explain that I am eager to see an active moderator keep some sort of order around here. I applaud your willingness to take an active roll.

I also want to suggest that you post your specific rules for a comment period--one week should suffice--before they go into effect. It's obvious that unanimous support does not exist for the elimination of scientific and rational viewpoints from this board. I don't know to what degree you plan to limit these viewpoints, and I'll reserve judgement for whenever I see the list of rules. But I hope you're willing to take into consideration the opinions of the folks who have made this their virtual home for many years.

I have no idea what transpired between you and skeptic, but every incoming authority figure to any situation--work, politics, classrooms, message boards, cub scouts--should expect to take a couple lumps in their initial days and weeks in power. Skeptic's resignation was your first lump. In my opinion, the lesson to learn is that each new authority figure should go slow and take careful measure of all competing interests before flexing his/her muscles.

I leave you with this thought. The most active period I've seen here at audioreview was between 2000 and 2001 when a good thread could generate two or three THOUSAND views before it fell off the end of the page in one or two days. (There was a 40 thread per page limit back then and new replies did not jump the thread to the top of the page--once forty more people started threads, yours was off the page.) Some of the folks around here probably still remember Norb, the moderator, storyteller, and spiritual leader of the rag tag bunch that used to gather at the P&B. He was able to generate that kind of traffic not by dictatorial regime, but by encouraging a love and enthusiasm for all things (and all viewpoints) audio.

Anyway, my $.02 is to take it slow and work with the population here to avoid a mass exodus of the few members that still hang around this dusty place.

-Adam

[brulaha]

Eric,

I've been a member here since 2000 with a long absence for most of 2003 due to the worst troll problem I've ever seen on an internet message board. I mention the troll problem to help explain that I am eager to see an active moderator keep some sort of order around here. I applaud your willingness to take an active roll.

I also want to suggest that you post your specific rules for a comment period--one week should suffice--before they go into effect. It's obvious that unanimous support does not exist for the elimination of scientific and rational viewpoints from this board. I don't know to what degree you plan to limit these viewpoints, and I'll reserve judgement for whenever I see the list of rules. But I hope you're willing to take into consideration the opinions of the folks who have made this their virtual home for many years.

I have no idea what transpired between you and skeptic, but every incoming authority figure to any situation--work, politics, classrooms, message boards, cub scouts--should expect to take a couple lumps in their initial days and weeks in power. Skeptic's resignation was your first lump. In my opinion, the lesson to learn is that each new authority figure should go slow and take careful measure of all competing interests before flexing his/her muscles.

I leave you with this thought. The most active period I've seen here at audioreview was between 2000 and 2001 when a good thread could generate two or three THOUSAND views before it fell off the end of the page in one or two days. (There was a 40 thread per page limit back then and new replies did not jump the thread to the top of the page--once forty more people started threads, yours was off the page.) Some of the folks around here probably still remember Norb, the moderator, storyteller, and spiritual leader of the rag tag bunch that used to gather at the P&B. He was able to generate that kind of traffic not by dictatorial regime, but by encouraging a love and enthusiasm for all things (and all viewpoints) audio.

Anyway, my $.02 is to take it slow and work with the population here to avoid a mass exodus of the few members that still hang around this dusty place.

-Adam

I couldn't agree more. I was dismayed to see Norb leave, and the deterioration that ensued. Things appear to be better than when I decided to call it quits, but this place is still a shell of it's former self. One of the things that made the board great was the community of regulars. Those who were new often stuck around because they picked up on the camaraderie. However, to have this board simply cater to those new to the discussion, and alienate those who have been here for years would be a travesty of travesties. There has to be a very careful balance maintained. I think some censorship is good, but error on the side of judicious use. Censorship can quickly cross over into steering and manipulation. I think that is why some are vehemently stating their opinions.

Just my 2 cents…

Out of curiosity, has anyone heard from pogue and bone?

[gonefishin]

Sorry guys,

I just don't see how name calling is pertinent to discussions about audio. In efforts to make this place a nicer and less unfriendly place to hang out, I won't allow it. Didn't your mothers ever tell you to "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all"?. So please cooperate and restrict discussions to audio, cut out the attacks and the name calling, and talk about your stereos, ok?

Thanks,
Eric

Hi Eric



You see...the thing is...is that this place was once just like you said above "nicer and less unfriendly place to hang out" But it wasn't accomplished by the will of individuals...no matter if they're simply members or the new administrator. This place was (and still is) made by the active members.

It also seems to me that this place has relatively few active members. You really need to let your membership grow. Not only in numbers but in ideals also. Give them reasons to come here and reason to discuss...but they should really be the ones dictating the direction taken. Not you and not I. If AR becomes exactly what you envision...then you got lucky. Enjoy it. If it becomes something else...then enjoy it also. But help the AR community grow into its own direction...not telling it where to go. It seems to me there are really very few people left from the older days and your not exactly having a mad rush of new people participating. Making it desirable for more people to leave may or may not be the answer...perhaps that is what you want to accomplish, I don't know.

But you need to ask yourself...what is AR to you? But also ask yourself what is AR to the active members who participate. There are a bunch of audio sites out there...some having a very high range of traffic and others barely slugging thru with double digit visitors a day. A lot of us started off at AR some years back and something (as RL stated) "this place get's into your blood" , and something keeps bringing many of us back. if not for anything else...just to check in to make sure all our beer ain't gone *swipe* The reason many people kept coming back is because you did have differing opinions. Ask yourself...why would I continue to talk with mtry when he's obvious wrong on nearly everything he says? because I respect him, his opinion and he's actually made me (and others) question our own beliefs. Again...if your looking to start over with AR and give it a face lift that looks just like any average newcomer audio site out there...I think you can certainly accomplish this. But why would they come here for something they can get everywhere else?

While Norb was a nice guy and things went well under his watch...he really didn't do anything extraordinary. Besides letting his membership grow...we still had to pester him to try and get anything done. Which his solution was to give everyone a box of t-shirts and he thought all would be well and well>>>>>>>


anyways, welcome



dan


edit add:


and now...the number one reson why someone would not visit AR boards in the past couple of years?

Trolls!


*in my best David Letterman voice*

[TinHere]

Sorry guys,

I just don't see how name calling is pertinent to discussions about audio. In efforts to make this place a nicer and less unfriendly place to hang out, I won't allow it. Didn't your mothers ever tell you to "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all"?. So please cooperate and restrict discussions to audio, cut out the attacks and the name calling, and talk about your stereos, ok?

Thanks,
Eric

Ignore these people they're idiots.

On the other hand who else cares what goes on here?

[F1]

Skeptic was number four the most active member in this forum after Mtrycrafts, RGA and Woochifer. He's a good technical source. It's not good to see him gone! Wish him all the best.
Oh btw, the page still indicates that he's Online.....

[FLZapped]

Sorry guys,

I just don't see how name calling is pertinent to discussions about audio. In efforts to make this place a nicer and less unfriendly place to hang out, I won't allow it. Didn't your mothers ever tell you to "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all"?. So please cooperate and restrict discussions to audio, cut out the attacks and the name calling, and talk about your stereos, ok?

Thanks,
Eric

That's why I am asking that people stop behaving like kiddies!

cheers,
eric

You know, you're not making any points here. First the "Naysayer" forum, ohhh I know, it's been renamed - and the barn door was closed after the horse was out making that okay too - then the appointment of a moderator to the Cable forum who clearly isn't unbiased, or knows how to behave in a civilized manner based on his past history as pointed out by someone else. (Yet that is what is being asked for)

Now I see comments about not making personal attacks, yet why the original "naysayer" title to the forum?

Why the "kiddie" comment? And the "didn't you mother...." line?

I smell hypocrisy here. Someone needs to practice what they preach.

-Bruce
(And in case you didn't notice, the discussions over the framing of our Consitution weren't always pleasant either.)

[MindGoneHaywire]

The problem with Skeptic wasn't that he had opinions, it's that he put language in his posts that strongly implied that his opinions were facts & anyone else's that deviated slightly were not. At least when it comes to music, which is something where he knows a good deal about one very specific category & seems to know next to nothing about any other category. So all this stuff I'm reading about how everybody respects him as a man of principle or something like that rings just a bit hollow with me.

In a discussion of classical music vs. everything else, he illustrated that he didn't know what a fake book was. In another, he stated that the greatest musical minds didn't waste their thoughts on jazz. In discussions on the relative merits of musical instruments...well, I think many of you have seen what he had to say. You want to express an opinion? Fine! However, do not presume to speak through posts to someone as though what you have to say is the end-all and be-all truth, unless you have some evidence to back it up beyond yr own likes & dislikes. And do yrself & me both a favor by refraining from lecturing me on why the talents of people who perform classical music are inherently superior to folks like Bing Crosby & Cole Porter, let alone someone who would deign to actually pick up such a primitive instrument as a guitar--when you don't even know what a fake book is. Putting up a post that exclaims that John Coltrane 'sucks' when he later admitted he was completely unfamiliar with any of his music is more of the sort of behavior that I don't think benefits a message board--at least not one about music. If he had something constructive to offer on the topic of audio, that's a different story. But knowing how little he knows about music yet how loudly he likes to put uninformed opinions up on message boards, I can't see how anyone would miss someone like that.

If this were a public gathering area, and he left for some interpretation of 'free speech' rhetoric, that would be one thing. But while I've seen moderators overstep their bounds, including on this site, if the owners of the site want these boards moderated, live with it. 4 years ago, I remember that someone calling himself SPL had a lot to say...say, come to think of it, he wasn't all that far off from Skeptic, now, was he? But when Norb booted him, I don't recall people stepping up about what a man of principle he was. He was just a troll.

Speaking of Norb & how different this place was a few years ago, I would disagree that the troll problem last year was the biggest deterrent...the move from the old board to the last one, & then to this one, couldn't have helped. I never understood why they had to go with something that was as slow as the past two boards have been. I think a lot of people gave up on this site because of slow load times.