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  1. #1
    AR Newbie Registered Member
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    CD collection and Klipsch KG4

    Greetings,

    I would like to ask for recommendations on what to get to best take advantage of my Klipsch speakers. All my funds went into the speakers back in 1985 and I scrimped on the electronics at the time. Now I would like upgrade - but reading the reviews online have confused me, because I have seen everything recommended. Here are some excerpts;

    "Try the KG4 with a sweet low-powered tube amp, or a well-built smooth solid-state piece and see what you think then..." OK, so I tried the KG4 with a smooth tube piece (the wonderful Jolida Model 102B) and with a nice solid-state integrated (the reviewed Musical Fidelity A3.2), and you know what? I loved it!

    Best to mate them with low end heavy components like the mid 80's NAD stuff. e.g. NAD 2200.

    Yamaha M-50 main-amp and C-50 pre-amp the whole time and have been the envy of all my friends.

    I POWER THEM WITH A DENON 80WATT PER CHANEL INT. AMP THE SOUND IS VERY REALISTIC

    Also, I have a questions about this comment:

    If you own a valve amp you need to give these a try. Rewiring with solid core copper [eg Axon 2 or 4] also improves smoothness of sound and ALWAYS use solid core speaker cable.

    What's a valve amp? What is this "rewiring with solid core copper" and "always using solid core speaker cable" about?

    I should note, I do have a Technics SL-MC7 CD Changer that I bought about 8(?) yrs ago, IIRC. It has an optical output, if that means anything. I do not have a problem keeping it as it works fine, especially if keeping it in service would allow more funds to invest in the other component(s).

    Thank you very much.

    BTW, here's a pic of my current setup.
    Last edited by LTRDavid; 12-08-2006 at 07:23 AM.

  2. #2
    Color me gone... Resident Loser's Avatar
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    Are you...

    ...dissatisfied in some way? Simple rule-of-thumb: IF IT AIN'T BROKE, DON'T FIX IT...

    Speakers are what you really hear...any diff caused by the electronics will be subtle at best...and that's if there is any diff at all...

    Valves are the British term for vacuum tubes...ancient technology, best left to the anti-SS purists...

    Solid copper conductors vs. stranded copper...This involves skin-effect and all sorts of other audiopile hoo-ha...best ignored...see "valves" above...

    jimHJJ(...everybody says their stuff is the best...it's all anecdotal...)
    Hello, I'm a misanthrope...don't ask me why, just take a good look around.

    "Men would rather believe than know" -Sociobiology: The New Synthesis by Edward O. Wilson

    "The great masses of the people...will more easily fall victims to a great lie than to a small one" -Adolph Hitler

    "We are never deceived, we deceive ourselves" -Goethe

    If you repeat a lie often enough, some will believe it to be the truth...

  3. #3
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    well, welcome to the forums, i hope you find alot of answers here.
    here are some for your questions already,
    first, 'what is a valve amp' it's just another name for a tube amplifier, if you have no clue at all of what a tube amplifier is, then here are some examples

    http://www.vincent-tac.de/en/produkt/tac/tac88.php
    and
    http://www.unisonresearch.com/valve/...to.aspx?idp=17

    there are more of them,
    basic things about them is that a tube amp (or a tube preamp) will give you the smoothest, warmest sound you will EVER find with amps,
    they all operate in class A, which means that 50 watts (like the vincent one) or 40 watts (the unison research one) are actually loads and loads of power. If you have the money, the passion and you love a warm sound, go for them, they do require a little more time and care then your regular ss amp (with the transistors).

    then, the rewire part.
    solid core means 1 cable, not stranded, this is an example of a solid core cable,

    http://www.vandenhul.com/cable/cw-10.htm

    i think you're clear on what copper is, eh.
    rewiring speakers might do some good (with vintage ones) but i have no idea of how to do it, and i think it's best to let someone else (preferably a person who is specialized in such things) do it for you.

    i don't know for sure, (make a list of equipment you are using, with model names too) so we can look and suggest you some better ways of driving your speakers, because i think a nice pre + power amp will do your speakers good, or a nice integrated, maybe a tube one.

    Greetings,
    Basite.
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  4. #4
    Mutant from table 9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resident Loser
    Speakers are what you really hear...any diff caused by the electronics will be subtle at best...and that's if there is any diff at all...
    More importantly, even if there is any difference in electronics (which I think there are), the placement of your speakers is not ideal and will cancel out any benefit from improved electronics.

    If I recall correctly the KG4 had a passive radiator on its back. You have those puppies pushed flush against the wall. Not ideal, infact bad, for any speaker, but especially for one with rear mounted radiators.

    Your real question was "How do I make the most of my speakers?" Placement is the answer. Pull them out from the wall at least a couple feet and experiment with placement. This may be unfreindly to your decor, but these are the sacrifices we make.
    ______________________
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  5. #5
    Mutant from table 9
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    Oh yeah, one more thing. Solid core wire also goes by another name "Romex." It is what our houses electrical systems are comprised of. So it ain't as fancy as some people will have you believe.
    ______________________
    Joyce Summers: "You've got really great albums!"
    Rupert "Ripper" Giles: "Yeah... they're okay..."


    "Tha H-Dog listens easy, always has, always will." - Herbert Kornfeld (R.I.P.)

    "I lick the mothra moniters because they pump up the base!!" - Dusty Beiber

  6. #6
    AR Newbie Registered Member
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    Thanks for the replies folks. Let me see if I can respond to all points:

    RL said, "IF IT AIN'T BROKE..."
    That's my problem. The Yamaha R50, that I purchased with the speakers in '85, left speaker output has quit working. That's why I am looking for a new source to drive the speakers.

    basite said, "(make a list of equipment you are using, with model names too) "
    Thanks for the welcome. I mentioned in my reply to Loser the malfunctioning R50. The CD changer is a Technics SL-MC7. That's all I have for the 2-channel side.
    The HT system, FWTW is a Yamaha YSP-800 and YST-100 SW. Also, most of my CD's are female vocalists from Joni Mitchell to Tracy Chapman and classical symphony CD's. Hopefully that will help provide some guidance for some recommendations. Oh yeah, I would like to not exceed $1k.

    SlumpBuster said, "Your real question was, "How do I make the most of my speakers?"" You are right.

    SlumpBuster also advised, "...the placement of your speakers is not ideal and will cancel out any benefit from improved electronics."
    OK, I'm cool with that and I will experiment with pulling them from the wall. I had heard that too somewhere along the way, but I also read the following in a review about the KG4's, "This speaker is at its best when positioned close to walls, even better, close to corners of a room." In another part of the review it was stated, "Coolest thing is, when you move these speakers close to the wall, they actually get better! Quite the opposite of other speakers, when you place this puppy close to walls, its performance became more authoritative, without becoming irritating or annoying." I read this at About:Stereos, Speaker Review: Klipsch KG4

    That review is where I read about, "sweet low-powered tube amp, or a well-built smooth solid-state piece that I quoted in my initial post. I just need some suggestions (a recipe actually) on what specific brand-models to consider. I'm really looking forward to your all suggestions.

    Thanks again for the replies. I am learning a lot.

  7. #7
    Do What? jrhymeammo's Avatar
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    People place their speakers in corners or closer to walls because that helps them produce more bass in your room. That's is usually the case, especially withj speakers that have ports in the back. But I really dont prefer that kind of setup. When I place my speakers back towards the wall, it really kills my overall sonic. I've always found that when I pull out my speakers at least 2 feet from the wall, I hear my music with MUCH more clarity. I havent read any of those reviews, but if I were you I would stop reading those because they go again just about everything I believe in.

    JRA

  8. #8
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    I'm sure I don't need to tell you how enjoyable the Kg4s are. I've had mine as long as you've had yoursand can honestly say they're the only speakers I'll never part with. I'm always on the lookout for the K8K 8" drivers since they're no longer in production.

    I have mine in a Home Theater system mated with a KV3 center, two pairs of RS-3 surrounds (front and rear) an SW8 sub for upper bass and an ACI Saturn sub for lower bass. The system sounds great. I also have a KLF-C7 center I use occasionally. The Kg4s image so well sometimes I'll fool friends and have them in two-channel mode and have them guess which center channel I'm using. Fools them every time unless they put their ear up to othe centers.

    I drive the system with a Yamaha RX-V2095 for the five speakres and a Marantz M700 for the ACI sub. I think the Yamaha is a good match, but if I were looking for a new receiver I'd go with either the Yamaha RX-V2600 or RX-V2700.

    The reason you see so many recommendations for tube/valve amps are because the efficiency of the speakers is so good they can be driven by a low power amp. Also it's rumored horns sound harsh so they benefit from the warmer sound of the tubes. I've had my KG4s connected to many systems and although they may sounds different, I can't really say if tubes or SS sound better. I also have a M-65 Yamaha power amp (I saw the M-50 recommended above) and it is a very musical combination. Enjoy.

  9. #9
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    your speakers are very efficient, which means they don't require alot of power to go loud. so don't start looking for those 500 watt amps, they will literally blow you and your speakers.

    maybe a low powered tube amp, but i don't know one direcly now, or if your budget allows it, a tube pre + ss power amp. i'll look for some things.
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  10. #10
    AR Newbie Registered Member
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    Thx basite!

    re: 500 watt amps
    Actually I am looking quite strongly at the following;

    1. The Jolida JD 102B - A Fully Integrated Stereo Tube Amplifier: Input 900mV driving 20 watts, maximum 25 watts output.

    2. A JVC, Phillips, or Music Hall single CD player

    3. TerraLabs or Audio Request solid core cable

    This should keep me within my "not to exceed $1k" range.

    I'm still looking and researching on this end and open to suggestions.

    Thx again to all, pls keep the input coming.

  11. #11
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    ... or the jolida jd 202a

    and a marantz cd5001 cd player, or a cambridge audio one,
    or the music hall, when it fits your budget,

    why do you need the solid core cables?
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  12. #12
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    The best thing about the Jolida is that if you don't like it you can easily sell it for damn near what you paid if not more than. Try that with a Denon or other Japanese gear and you'll soon find out what depreciation is all about.
    ARC SP9 MKIII, VPI HW19, Rega RB300
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    Behringer UCA222, Emotiva XDA-2, HiFimeDIY
    Accuphase T101, Teac V-7010, Nak ZX-7. LX-5, Behringer DSP1124P
    Front: Magnepan 1.7, DBX 223SX, 2 modified Dynaco MK3's, 2, 12" DIY TL subs (Pass El-Pipe-O) 2 bridged Crown XLS-402
    Rear/HT: Emotiva UMC200, Acoustat Model 1/SPW-1, Behringer CX2310, 2 Adcom GFA-545

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