Blind listening comparisons

[tube fan]

This line however I do take issue with. I think that there's a very strong correlation in the lower price points. When you move up from $20 speakers to $100 speakers, there is definitely a marked improvement. And likewise when you move from $100 to $500.

I agree though that there is a point of diminishing returns, and that's where you get into the stickiness of whether any perceived improvement in performance is worth the often exorbitant price increases.

I am NOT talking about $20 speakers. I AM talking about under $10,000 speakers compared to $150,000 ones. I AM talking about something like my system: AR SP8, AR D-70, Fosgate Phono, VPI Scoutmaster, Benz Ruby 3, and Fulton J or Dunlavy SC-IV speakers compared to ones costing $400,000 (like ones I heard at the California Audio Show).

Bias is an all too human trait. When we KNOW we are tasting a Screaming Eagle $1,500 bottle of wine, we tend to look for positives. When we are comparing a Benzinger $15 bottle to the Screaming Eagle BLIND, the resulting evaluation will often be quite different. I recall a series of wine tastings conducted by the NYT. All were Pinot Noir based, from France, Oregon, and California. Tasted and rated knowing the bottle name, the French wines were rated first, then Oregon's, followed by California's. Tasting EXACTLY the same wines blind, California wines came in first, followed by Oregon's and French wines. I've seen it hundreds of times in blind tastings. I bet a similar thing would occur in blind listening tests, short or longterm.

[02audionoob]

I am NOT talking about $20 speakers. I AM talking about under $10,000 speakers compared to $150,000 ones. I AM talking about something like my system: AR SP8, AR D-70, Fosgate Phono, VPI Scoutmaster, Benz Ruby 3, and Fulton J or Dunlavy SC-IV speakers compared to ones costing $400,000 (like ones I heard at the California Audio Show).

Anyone would have a line where they no longer perceive a difference or claim that no difference could be perceived...and the line would often be right about at their own system. I would bet there are people in this hobby who would claim their own $3,000 can perform up to the level of $10,000 speakers. And then there would be people who claim those $3,000 speakers can't be distinguished from their own $1,000 speakers. We all make our own decisions about this stuff and we quite often base our comments on the subject on our own choices.

[Ajani]

Anyone would have a line where they no longer perceive a difference or claim that no difference could be perceived...and the line would often be right about at their own system. I would bet there are people in this hobby who would claim their own $3,000 can perform up to the level of $10,000 speakers. And then there would be people who claim those $3,000 speakers can't be distinguished from their own $1,000 speakers. We all make our own decisions about this stuff and we quite often base our comments on the subject on our own choices.

I made that point on diminishing returns in another thread a short while ago... IMO, diminishing returns in HiFi is virtually worthless as it is 100% subjective... Further, it seems to just come down to the question of how much someone is willing to spend on gear...

Joe A will say that he gets 95% of high end performance with his $1K amp.
Joe B will claim 95% is achieved at his $5K, and $1K amps are midfi (whatever that means).
Joe C will claim 95% with his $25K monoblocks and claim that it sounds better than $250K monos (which he believes are for persons who just want to spend money, blah blah blah)...

However check back on any of these Joes 5 years later and you maybe 'surprised' to find they've moved up the chain to a much higher priced amp, and are now claiming that it lifts a veil off the music and presents the musical information with new dimensionality, emotional complexity and transient existential harmonality or whatever...

IMO, the only thing you should focus on is getting the system that gives you the most satisfaction for your budget... As nice as it is to feed my ego, by claiming my system sounds as good as, or better than, setups costing 5 - 10 times as much, it is just meaningless boasting....