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  1. #26
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by O'Shag
    High Joe SP9. Sorry no offence meant.
    None taken. I fully realize that a lot of the cost of high end gear is in the cosmetics. However, I don't change gear like underwear. Looking at something that is as aesthetically pleasing as a farm tractor for 10 to 15 years won't work for me. My apologies to any that consider farm tractors the height of design.
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  2. #27
    Sure, sure... Auricauricle's Avatar
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    Oh, Deere!

  3. #28
    Ajani
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    High End audio components are luxury items... that's something we too often forget when debating audio.... Too often I've seen persons with $15K to $20K setups complaining that $150K setups are destroying the credibility of this hobby and making us a joke... without even realizing the irony that to the average man, $15K for a 2 channel setup is a freaking joke and severe extravagance... heck, even $2K is too much for many non-audiophiles...

    It's really just a matter of how much luxury you are willing to treat yourself to...

    And as for the Car versus Audio debate: It's not always as simple as reading specs to determine why one car costs more than another... There are cars that offer you the exact same or better features and specs for less money than the big boys.. and when it comes to sports cars, you'd be dead wrong if you just assumed that the fastest (or even best handling) ones are the most expensive... Much like in Audio, not everything is great value for money...

  4. #29
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    I don't believe $150k systems are ruining anything. All companies have their flagship, which most are built in limited number per year, the technology eventually trickles down to the lower priced units. It's a matter of opinion but I feel some of the ultra high end equipment is worth their price tag. I believe a debate of the worth of high end gear went on with Emaidel some time back. There's no rule that says equipment has to be cheap enough for every one to own one. As in autos, audio or any product there's more profit built into the higher end than the entry level. So "Average Joe" gets his and those who can afford it buy better and the company makes enough profit to stay in business, after all isn't that their purpose. Sure, some one can be happy with a more modest system but don't be a hater because there's better.

    What kind of audio system you own does depend on ones means but more importantly it depends on that person's passion, how bad they want it. Are you willing to eat out less or cut corners in other places to get that better piece. Are you willing to use credit. Hmmm... a bit of expendable income, should I buy a piece of audio gear or this or that.... not all put the audio first. I don't accept that anyone hear if they really wanted couldn't afford to upgrade something in their system. You could be buying used or a demo. I've been dirt poor and still managed to have a receiver, speakers and sources. You guys know if you want something you find a way to make it happen. It's a matter of what you are willing to settle for. And, let's keep this within reason, I'm not saying we all can have a $100k system, we have to keep a house to put our systems in. I'm just saying if you really wanted a level or so better you could make it happen if you wanted to, if the desire and passion was there.

  5. #30
    Retro Modernist 02audionoob's Avatar
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    The fox and the audio system

    Perhaps those audiophiles who say $150k systems are ruining something are the perfect example of sour grapes.

  6. #31
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    I don't believe $150k systems are ruining anything. All companies have their flagship, which most are built in limited number per year, the technology eventually trickles down to the lower priced units. It's a matter of opinion but I feel some of the ultra high end equipment is worth their price tag. I believe a debate of the worth of high end gear went on with Emaidel some time back. There's no rule that says equipment has to be cheap enough for every one to own one. As in autos, audio or any product there's more profit built into the higher end than the entry level. So "Average Joe" gets his and those who can afford it buy better and the company makes enough profit to stay in business, after all isn't that their purpose. Sure, some one can be happy with a more modest system but don't be a hater because there's better.

    What kind of audio system you own does depend on ones means but more importantly it depends on that person's passion, how bad they want it. Are you willing to eat out less or cut corners in other places to get that better piece. Are you willing to use credit. Hmmm... a bit of expendable income, should I buy a piece of audio gear or this or that.... not all put the audio first. I don't accept that anyone hear if they really wanted couldn't afford to upgrade something in their system. You could be buying used or a demo. I've been dirt poor and still managed to have a receiver, speakers and sources. You guys know if you want something you find a way to make it happen. It's a matter of what you are willing to settle for. And, let's keep this within reason, I'm not saying we all can have a $100k system, we have to keep a house to put our systems in. I'm just saying if you really wanted a level or so better you could make it happen if you wanted to, if the desire and passion was there.
    Yep... we're in agreement on this...

  7. #32
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    ...
    What kind of audio system you own does depend on ones means but more importantly it depends on that person's passion, how bad they want it. Are you willing to eat out less or cut corners in other places to get that better piece. Are you willing to use credit.[?] Hmmm... a bit of expendable income, should I buy a piece of audio gear or this or that.... not all put the audio first. I don't accept that anyone hear [here] if they really wanted couldn't afford to upgrade something in their system. You could be buying used or a demo. I've been dirt poor and still managed to have a receiver, speakers and sources. You guys know if you want something you find a way to make it happen. It's a matter of what you are willing to settle for. And, let's keep this within reason, I'm not saying we all can have a $100k system, we have to keep a house to put our systems in. I'm just saying if you really wanted a level or so better you could make it happen if you wanted to, if the desire and passion was there.
    Well, what if your wife has a passion for something different?

    I agree that a lot can be done by prioritization but it has its limits. Certainly my wife & I have done without a lot of stuff in order to eat and help the kid with their educations: our top priorities. We haven't have a real vactions in years; we don't have an HDTV; we have one, 7 year-old car -- and I don't have the Maggie 3.6's or the Pass Labs amplification I'd really like. Could I raid my modest retirement fund? Cound I borrow more on credit? I suppose so, but it would be reckless and selfish to do for hifi equipment.

    I don' have much problem with $150k systems. My minor issue doesn't have to do with the makers or buyers of this stuff; its with the TAS and 'Phile reviewers who review it to the virtual exclusion of equipment people like me might actually afford.

  8. #33
    Sure, sure... Auricauricle's Avatar
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    And that is why I think places like this fill in the gap, Feanor. While many of the members of this site are owners of very nice equipment, they generally are articulate enough to state their positions clearly and without all the lingo. I suspect most folks here are informed and intelligent, but this passion does not need to exclude others because they don't know a transformer from a rectifier. I think that, in a sense, the audio industry shot itself in the foot in the promotion of such (heavy handed) magazines that, while appealing to a certain clientele, failed to address the needs of those looking for great sound and less
    arcana.

    I would like to propose that much that is outlandish and extreme are useful not only for promoting a manufacturer's ability but as benchmarks to aspire to in the development of less proposterous, and more affordable, equipment.

  9. #34
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    I have to admit I really don't read that much audio media. Don't some of them review lesser expensive gear? I thought Stereophile did. Although I've heard gear that received a Class A rating that I didn't understand. But maybe it's one of those synergy things. CNET seems to review entry to mid level gear but I've heard complaints of bias about them as well. And, again, they've given good reviews to things I know isn't that great, like the Samsung BD-P1500 but maybe they are considering the price. What about Sound & Vision?

    Feanor, you talk as if audio is not a necessity, what's wrong with you I am lucky though my wife understands. A friend of mine, who is now divorced I might add, had to wage battle just to buy hi fi gear and he wasn't one to be on the upgrade path, he kept his gear for years. You've got valid reasons and only you can weigh them as with all of us with our own situation. I saw a CT-6 preamp for 3/5 of retail new and have been really tempted but I like what I hear now and if I sold my preamp to afford that one I am commited without much recourse if not happy. I wouldn't have any way to audition before buying. This is one instance if money was no object I would just snap it up. Even if I did buy it and was happy I'd still need to sell mine and gear don't seem to be moving that fast off Audiogon. So even I have a limit. Now if anyone wants to buy the CT-6 for me I won't be too proud to take it or if you just want to buy my current preamp to further my temptation.

  10. #35
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    ...
    I saw a CT-6 preamp for 3/5 of retail new and have been really tempted but I like what I hear now and if I sold my preamp to afford that one I am commited without much recourse if not happy. I wouldn't have any way to audition before buying. This is one instance if money was no object I would just snap it up. Even if I did buy it and was happy I'd still need to sell mine and gear don't seem to be moving that fast off Audiogon. So even I have a limit. Now if anyone wants to buy the CT-6 for me I won't be too proud to take it or if you just want to buy my current preamp to further my temptation.
    Well, Mr. P, I really would like to hear the C-J sound and the PV-14 would be just the ticket no doubt, but I don't think I can swing it.

    Let me assure you that my Sonic Frontiers Line 1 was bought second hand (or third, whatever). Because this $3500 unit is from a company no longer in business I was able to snag it for a reasonably reasonable $900.

  11. #36
    abNORMal IBSTORMIN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajani
    High End audio components are luxury items... that's something we too often forget when debating audio.... Too often I've seen persons with $15K to $20K setups complaining that $150K setups are destroying the credibility of this hobby and making us a joke... without even realizing the irony that to the average man, $15K for a 2 channel setup is a freaking joke and severe extravagance... heck, even $2K is too much for many non-audiophiles...

    It's really just a matter of how much luxury you are willing to treat yourself to...
    Or can afford.....
    I just did a little adding. The gear I have was built in the late 80's (AMP), 90's (Speakers) up through 2001 (DVD/CD & PRE/PRO). Adding up list price each piece sold for new is $13,900 not considering the 80's and 90's gear would cost more today. With this equipment I finally know what you guys are referring to when you say the speakers disappear! I bought it all used and have less that $2,000 in the whole thing. What does that make me? Only an audiophile if I spent the $13,900? I wouldn't spend that much because of my priorities, which is why I buy used. BUT, I love the sound and it took alot of upgrades and switching out, testing different things to get where I am. I still want MORE!

    I remember when I first started to post here there was a discussion that the definition of an audiophile was someone who is always striving to get better sound, regardless of the price paid. I still believe that is true. An audiophile is always looking to improve their system, even in some small way, which is why we talk so much about cables! Sound quality is an obsession!!!! As Ajani said, some people think I am crazy for spending $2000 on JUST stereo. They didn't spend that much on their H/T. It's all about Priorities. Some people have to have only the newest. I just want good sound.

  12. #37
    RGA
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    A couple of points - we really needs to stop this notion of "percentage points better" in audio because it's largely non-sensical. I paid 10 times the price but it's not 10 times better. Well yeah so is Honda Accord twice as good as a Honda Civic - does it get twice the duel mileage? Is it going to last twice as long? Have half the failure rates? Does it go twice as fast and twice the handling? Is it twice as safe? Okay staying away from cars and going to the more artistic side is a painting that sells for 1 million twice as good as one for $500k? Subjective preference but when I left the Louvre my favorite painting was not the Mona Lisa but the Young Marter - there is nothing to me twice as good about the Mona Lisa.

    When judging Audio Equipment price performance it helps to look at from a company line-up perspective first before comparing it to "other companies" and here's why:

    As many of you know I like Audio Note (I like many other companies as well and I'm interested in buying a second completely non Audio Note system) but I'm using them as an example because they make entry level all the way to an above $500,000US system. And they have "levels"

    Now assuming you like the sound of the company's gear (I do) then you start at the bottom and say okay here is an entire Audio System for $5k - transport/Dac a preamp and 2 monoblock amps and a pair of speakers - level Zero and you say after hearing a lot of $5k systems that it's worth the money. You like what some other $5k systems are doing better in some areas but all in all this is good $5k sound.

    Then you go up to level 1 which is $12k and you say wow that is one hell of an inprovement - 7k more money may not be more than twice as good but it's certainly a lot better than the lower system - then you go to level 2 and drop $20k and again big improvement - go up and up and up and each time you say at each level that the improvement was a "hell of a lot better" - pretty soon you're at jaw dropping prices but each time it progressively and consistently got better than the previous system.

    I have not compared out of brand because the comparisons are harder. I prefer the AN E/LX or Tannoy Westminster or Kensington to the B&W Model Nautilus or Dynaudio Evidence Master despite both of them costing far far far more money. This does not mean those are poor values at all it simply means that one must try to compare apples to apples and realise a preference for a sonic aesthetic or type - similar to what Panel guys have - they often prefer inexpensive panels to very expensive boxes because they like the signature that panels embue.

    But even here if you stay within the line you will understand why you are paying more for a Quad or Sound labs than you pay for a Magnepan or a better example why you pay more for a 1.6 over an MMG.

    Car analogy across types - maybe with half a million I opt for luxury with a Bentley while someone else may choose to sacrific comfort for more speed handling and aesthetics and go for a Lamborghini.

    Feaner et al - I agree I would like the magazines to review lower priced stuff - but put yourself in the reviewer's shoes - you get to have gear for a few months and the company is willing to send you a 20.1 or you can have the MMG - assuming you have the front end and the space most reviewers are going to want to play with the 20.1. Most reviewers don't get paid or get paid very little (it's not a full time job) so the "perk" is to get to listen to the best stuff.

    Personally I prefer reviewing more entry level equipment because I get more readers - as soon as you read the speaker costs $192,000 like one of my fellow reviewers recently reviewed then a lot of people tune out. At $192k the market is very small and no one spending that needs a review because the build and quality is likely there at an elite level - it comes down to sound preference entirely

  13. #38
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RGA
    ...

    Feaner et al - I agree I would like the magazines to review lower priced stuff - but put yourself in the reviewer's shoes - you get to have gear for a few months and the company is willing to send you a 20.1 or you can have the MMG - assuming you have the front end and the space most reviewers are going to want to play with the 20.1. Most reviewers don't get paid or get paid very little (it's not a full time job) so the "perk" is to get to listen to the best stuff.

    ...
    Rich,

    Well and find. But tell me why the friggin hell I ought to put myself in the reviewers' shoes? Much less why I should pay C$6 or $9 an issue so they can have fun?

    Reviewers ... Humm ... I notice you're one them these days. Have fun!!

  14. #39
    Forum Regular Jack in Wilmington's Avatar
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    RGA I understand where you're coming from. I'm not sure what Feanor's problem is with audio reviewers. They have a job to do and on the whole they do a good job as far as I'm concerned. I subscribe to three audio mags, and though I don't read all the articles, I use the articles as a tool when buying equipment. I listen to my salesguy make his pitch, read what the reviews say and try and make an informed purchase.

    When I'm done with the magazine, I take it into the lunchroom at work and put it on the reading material table. I really get a kick, when I see someone eating their breakfast or lunch and reading one of the mags that I've left. They sometimes stop me and ask a question about a upcoming purchase. In a company of 300 employees, you are not always aware of people hobbies. I've met people from other departments, who are into audio like I am and it's neat to exchange ideas. That's one of the hidden benefits of audio magazines.

  15. #40
    RGA
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    As a reviewer now I can only say that it is in one's best interest to treat reviews as an entertainment and in some respects to make people feel good about what they already purchased. In the movie DAVE the president wants to cut a program by car manufacturers who spend piles of money making owners feel secure or good about the car they already have or will soon buy.

    Reviews don't really serve a lot of other purposes in my view. People tend to have their "favorites" and a review merely reafirrms their opinion.

    Granted reviews can also help put out names of gear new to the public. I was happy to be the first or (second) reviewer to review Grant Fidelity gear. Even as a reviewer it is nice to see my liking for a relative unknown company get a few awards from competing magazines because it "reaffirms" what I felt about the product when I auditioned them. It also pleases me that for years I have been on about Audio Note and for Wes Philips of Stereophile to say that the system was the best he had ever hear and for two other writers there to buy AN E loudspeakers also makes me feel good that I am not completely a lone wolf auditioner.

    If you must go by reviewers and reviews I would try to either choose a reviewer who has a similar ear - has liked a lot of the same things you like and is luke warm or dislikes a lot of the same things you do - while no gaurantee that the next item is something you will agree with the reviewer on - certainly a correlation helps increase the odds that if he raves you will like it too.

    The other less good approach is the consensus view where is lots of reviewers like it chances are you will too. The problem there though is consensus is usually weighted to bigger companies who can send more review items out. I'd want to know which of the reviewers spent their own money on the item or would have if they could have kind of thing. There are different levels of praise in reviews and reading between the lines to separate the good equipment from the great equipment is not always clear.

    Feaner - Don't pay for the reviews - that is why there is dagogo, enjoythemusic, positive feback, soundstage, 6 moons, TNT and others.

  16. #41
    Man of the People Forums Moderator bobsticks's Avatar
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    Out of curiousity RGA, have you ever been pressured to write a certain product review in a more positive light than originally intended because of business imperatives?
    So, I broke into the palace
    With a sponge and a rusty spanner
    She said : "Eh, I know you, and you cannot sing"
    I said : "That's nothing - you should hear me play piano"

  17. #42
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Thanks, RGA, good advice

    Quote Originally Posted by RGA
    ...

    Feaner - Don't pay for the reviews - that is why there is dagogo, enjoythemusic, positive feback, soundstage, 6 moons, TNT and others.
    Good advice that I'll take.

    By and large the reviewers at these sites write relatively succinct reviews, (6 Moons is somewhat of an exception). I don't mind lots discussion of the equipment itself, the technology, the sound, but what I can't be bothered with are the seemingly endless personal history and anecdotes you get from so many reviewers notably at The Absolute Sound and Stereophile. I don't give a crap about what they did in there teenage years; what their wifes, kids, and neigbours do, what they drive, what they eat for breakfest, etc.

    Why are we burdened with this stuff? Is it literary pretension? What arrogance on the part of these reviewers to suppose we read them for literary content! RGA, don't make that mistake in your own reviews.

  18. #43
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feanor
    Good advice that I'll take.

    By and large the reviewers at these sites write relatively succinct reviews, (6 Moons is somewhat of an exception). I don't mind lots discussion of the equipment itself, the technology, the sound, but what I can't be bothered with are the seemingly endless personal history and anecdotes you get from so many reviewers notably at The Absolute Sound and Stereophile. I don't give a crap about what they did in there teenage years; what their wifes, kids, and neigbours do, what they drive, what they eat for breakfest, etc.

    Why are we burdened with this stuff? Is it literary pretension? What arrogance on the part of these reviewers to suppose we read them for literary content! RGA, don't make that mistake in your own reviews.
    As much as I understand your point (and to some extent agree), you need to realize the TAS and Stereophile have regular readers who keep the mags going... Many of those regulars loving reading all that crap about what their favourite reviewer had for breakfast... they also enjoy reading about ultra-expensive audio porn... that's what keeps these mags in business... so they are unlikely to change their model...

    As RGA pointed out there are many free review sites (actually Stereophile and to some extent TAS are also free on the web)... and a whole lot of good sites that deal specifically with affordable gear...

  19. #44
    Forum Regular audio amateur's Avatar
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    I've never actually ever read a Stereophile review in a magazine, only on their website.

  20. #45
    RGA
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobsticks
    Out of curiousity RGA, have you ever been pressured to write a certain product review in a more positive light than originally intended because of business imperatives?
    Personally I have not had any issue because I've only written 4 reviews so far and two of the products I bought which tells you that I like them a whole lot.

    But there have been issues in the press where a reviewer gave a negative review and the magazine pulled the review and had a different reviewer write something glowing. I believe Woochifer on this site knows about TAS doing this with a Wilson Audio Loudspeaker.

    My belief is not to go after a product in a review. For instance if I wrote a Paradigm 100V3 review it would be pretty negative as would a review of the Magnepan 20.1. Since I'm not a fan of certain kinds of gear I don't want them and I see no purpose to rain on people's parade (That's what forums are for )

    Seriously some of it is a taste issue and my taste leads to SE amplifiers and higher efficiency speaker systems - and I believe in reviwing entire audio systems rather than individual components which have completely different characteristics across systems. Plus I aviod the issue that my amp can't drive X speaker or Y amp prefers a LE speaker with long throw woofers.

    Plus I can tell the reader more accurately about the sound of the company rather than the sound of a company's cd player's interaction with my gear - which if you do not own will be completely useless to you. Even the Grant Fidelity review was minus their speakers (they did not have speakers at the time) but it would have probably been a more helpful review.

    Edit: Not sure I have answered the question directly but no Constantine does not put pressure on us - for the most part the reviewers choose stuff they are relatively familiar with and like. Grant Fidelity was a bit of a risk because I had no prior dealings with them and I am often skeptical of big heavy amnplifiers that look pretty because it often indicates they're covering for something sonically. But for the price (which went down a grand to $4200) the Rita is a beast of an amplifier with a light enough touch to not become edgy or sterile.

    Reviewing is not so easy because there is a valid argument to be made that if brand A's cd player sounds poor in my system it may be true but it could work well in the next 10 systems. Ultimately though I felt I needed to be able to say pretty much what I wanted without getting it chopped and it came down to Dagogo and another magazine and it was an issue with one of the reviewers revolving around Rega's cd player that made me think that Constantine would stand behind the reviewer and let it go to print despite whatever fallout might occur.

    And to defend Stereophile a bit ( I used to get on them a lot) but they pointed out to me that 40% of their reviews come from non advertisors. The aforementioned Audio Note has never advertised with them and the writers feel free to say and buy stuff they like. But if you notice - just like reviewers at Dagogo they kind of review a select bunch of stuff they like or are just interested in. You don't see Art Dudley reviewing Paradigm anbd B&W because his taste is more like mine. While other writers there who like those speakers tend to review several models of them.

    If you want the lower priced reviews often listened to with a panel of reviewers and a chief reviewer blind level matched then Hi-Fi Choice (not What Hi Fi) is the one to explore. No personal history stuff.

    Feaner that would be the best magazine I could recommend to you - Affordable stuff - blind compared, level matched - several listeners (including manufacturers sitting in). It's not perfect getting a pooled answer sometimes, but there is some merit to it. You can request the magazine be shipped in from Chapters which is wha I had to do - kind of pricey at $12 or so but lots of colour print (unfortunately) drives the price up.

    They used to put their older issues online for free but stopped.
    Last edited by RGA; 05-31-2009 at 10:47 PM.

  21. #46
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RGA
    ....
    If you want the lower priced reviews often listened to with a panel of reviewers and a chief reviewer blind level matched then Hi-Fi Choice (not What Hi Fi) is the one to explore. No personal history stuff.

    Feaner that would be the best magazine I could recommend to you - Affordable stuff - blind compared, level matched - several listeners (including manufacturers sitting in). It's not perfect getting a pooled answer sometimes, but there is some merit to it. You can request the magazine be shipped in from Chapters which is wha I had to do - kind of pricey at $12 or so but lots of colour print (unfortunately) drives the price up.

    They used to put their older issues online for free but stopped.
    Hi-Fi Choice is pretty good and I can usually get it locally. It's a big bonus that their testing is blind although I'm their sure testing methods would fail scientific DBT criterion.

    The Brit mags, including 'Choice', What Hi-Fi, and Hi-Fi World all cover more lower-cost equipment. On the other hand a lot of it isn't available in Canada (certainly not around me). Compared to Stereophile (or say, 6 Moons) their reviews seem rather superficial, or at least the reporting is.

    By the way, I think you'll agree that Hi-fi+ is a handsome, glossy if pricey Brit mag with more in-depth reviews. I like the writing style better than TAS or 'Phile because it's articulate but more to-the-point. In fact '+' has probably more low & medium cost equipment than the Big Two U.S. mags, though again, a lot of it isn't locally available.

  22. #47
    RGA
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    I think, after thinking it about it some, that generally lower cost equipment is not reviewed as much because the differences between low cost gear is not that great. A $500 integrated is pretty much the same as any other $500 integrated - especially SS. Speakers pretty much fall in line with this as well. I'd add Hi-Fi Critic to your list because there is a subjective element along with one of, if not the best, technical guys in the business writing for them - Martin Colloms.

    Then there is the site hifi-tunes.de out of Denmark - new to me. I think they're working on converting to English?? This kind of story approach to review I don't mind - (don't read if AN bothers you though http://www.audionote.co.uk/articles/..._Note_engl.pdf) I was there looking up a cartridge information and noticed this review magazine outfit. Quite a lot of them we've probably never heard of in the west.

  23. #48
    Ajani
    Guest
    Good Points by RGA...

    Reviewers generally review what they feel like... This is often what leads to all kinds of claims of bias based on advertising...etc etc etc...

    The usefulness of reviews depends on whether you have similar tastes to the specific reviewer... In Stereophile, JA clearly loves items that measure well... KR loves gear with proper dynamic range (big solid state amps and big cone speakers)... AD could care less about measurements or dynamic range, he just cares about how it sounds to him (generally sweet, tubey, etc)... So if you have tastes similar to AD, then buying products based on glowing reviews from KR is a really bad idea...

    Also, HiFi Choice reviews are available for free online at:

    http://www.techradar.com/

    and What HiFi? reviews are available for free online at:

    http://www.whathifi.com/

  24. #49
    Forum Regular O'Shag's Avatar
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    My post previously probably rubbed some people the wrong way, and I do understand.
    but hopefully, you got my drift, which was not to slam people for investing in expensive gear - I have a top class system myself.

    Perhaps I was having a rough day. There's been a lot of those lately. I have a company, and over the past several months, I've had to let very-valued employees go - sometimes with tears from them (and from me too). The latest and last layoff we had last week was devastating, where all but a skeleton crew of employees remain. The economy, such as it is, has had a dramatic effect on our customers - and we are fortunate that some of our customers are top marquis companies. But the giants are also falling - the majority of our customers are laying off people in droves and backing out of contracts, being concerned enough or in dire straits themselves.

    The devastation that's happening in the small business sector - trickle-down effect you might call it, is a factor in the economy that is being ovelooked.

    So, I am a little sensitive to promotion of excess at the moment.
    'Lets See what the day brings forth'.... Reginald Iolanthe Perrin

  25. #50
    Sure, sure... Auricauricle's Avatar
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    Jun 2008
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    And I'll add Grammophone Mag to the pile....

    www.gramophone.co.uk

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