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  1. #1
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    "Honeymooners" Dilemma: Now I'm Pissed...

    Recently purchased the long awaited "Honeymooners Classic 39 Episodes" DVD box set from Paramount for 40 something bucks, which included five discs worth of episodes, but after watching them considerably for weeks now with my girlfriend, we came to the conclusion that there were definitely episodes missing....lo and behold, I go online today and there are in fact "Lost Episodes" DVDs---MANY to be honest---which contain all the episodes not sold in this box set...WHY did Paramount do this??? I thought I was getting ALL the episodes in this set, and thats what they make the consumer believe---but there are like 30 VOLUMES of additional episodes out there on DVD! Im not kidding, and Im pissed because I dont want to have to buy 30 some odd more DVDs now; thats how many "lost volumes" are out there that they claim "Jackie Gleason discovered in his basement"....are they kidding me?

    And GOOD episodes are on these "lost" volumes I dont have....like when Ralph and Ed open a hot dog stand in the country, and when Alice and Trixy beat Ralph and Ed in a talent contest....damn it!

  2. #2
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    John; I don't blame you for being pissed. This group of HONEYMOONERS was from an actual season of produced episodes which from amazon. com was 1955-56. In those days, a series was 39 episodes. There seems to be other HONEYMOONERS shows that may have come from the Jackie Gleason Variety Show. It is not made to clear at amazon.com which discs feature these shows. I also see another company MPI involved. They are asking a hefty price for what they have to offer. Again they do not make it clear where these shows came from although I believe these shows were edited from Gleason's variety shows. This series looks like a monstrosity to collect on the whole.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelsci
    John; I don't blame you for being pissed. This group of HONEYMOONERS was from an actual season of produced episodes which from amazon. com was 1955-56. In those days, a series was 39 episodes. There seems to be other HONEYMOONERS shows that may have come from the Jackie Gleason Variety Show. It is not made to clear at amazon.com which discs feature these shows. I also see another company MPI involved. They are asking a hefty price for what they have to offer. Again they do not make it clear where these shows came from although I believe these shows were edited from Gleason's variety shows. This series looks like a monstrosity to collect on the whole.
    Kel,

    I mean this is getting out of line now...every time you think you bought a bonafide "collection" something one-ups it; I too have seen the MPI collection of the lost episodes, and it seems there are nearly 30 VOLUMES of so-called lost or missing episodes not on this Paramount box set; Im not enough of a fan (although I love the show) to plunk down all the money needed to buy all of this...my DVD want list is ENORMOUS at the moment with movies alone----going into the TV shows I would want would be another collecting project altogether. But this just pisses me off; I feel like Im not getting the complete freakin' series now that I know KEY episodes are missing: including when Ralph and Alice adopt a baby, when Ralph and Ed spy on Alice in an Italian restaurant with a guy who wants to give them a free vacation, and more....

    I'll tell you what I'm waiting for: the whole original Star Trek TV show episodes collection in a massive set, or broken up by season; the episodes that are out now have two episodes per DVD, and this comes to roughly $800 to buy the whole friggin' series----NO WAY; I would rather stick with watching my taped VHS versions.

    I would also like to wait for Paramount to release the Trek movies in a box set with each DVD getting the 2-disc special edition treatment, which I hear is on the way....however, its only the first six original cast Trek films, not "Generations," "First Contact," "Insurrection" or the rest.

    Man, oh man, if I had time to think about what I would want in a box set...how about all the "Friday the 13ths", all the "Halloweens", all the "Jaws"...right now, TV show wise, I would like to wait for the aforementioned Star Trek original TV series collection (if it makes the price drop tremendously from buying them individually), and, believe it or not, I would like to get HBO's "Curb Your Enthusiasm" First Season box set; I think it's an hilarious show, and Im a fan.

  4. #4
    Forum Regular jack70's Avatar
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    Agree...

    If memory serves, The "official" TV show was only on TV for 2 years(?) (...hard to believe with the multitude of crappy shows (like Friends) that go on FOREVER today). Those are probably the shows that Paramount has "official" release rights to. I think the "other" honeymooners" // ("Jackie Gleason discovered in his basement") // were from the other (earlier) Gleason TV show, and it exists only in cinescopes (crude off-air recordings).

    You'd think someone would take those old private shows and digitally clean em up and re-issue them. I'm guessing it's another "rights" thing, with hundreds of lawyers all trying to get their share of the pie. In the meantime (last 20+years), millions of (bad) copies of em have circulated around... and Hollywood (& the music industry too) wonders why it has a "pirate" problem!! Just get rid of the stinkin lawyers... put a professional cleaned up (& annotated... oops, Art Carney's dead... ya idiots) version out post-haste, with a fair price- tag. They'd make a fortune! Idiots!

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by jack70
    If memory serves, The "official" TV show was only on TV for 2 years(?) (...hard to believe with the multitude of crappy shows (like Friends) that go on FOREVER today). Those are probably the shows that Paramount has "official" release rights to. I think the "other" honeymooners" // ("Jackie Gleason discovered in his basement") // were from the other (earlier) Gleason TV show, and it exists only in cinescopes (crude off-air recordings).

    You'd think someone would take those old private shows and digitally clean em up and re-issue them. I'm guessing it's another "rights" thing, with hundreds of lawyers all trying to get their share of the pie. In the meantime (last 20+years), millions of (bad) copies of em have circulated around... and Hollywood (& the music industry too) wonders why it has a "pirate" problem!! Just get rid of the stinkin lawyers... put a professional cleaned up (& annotated... oops, Art Carney's dead... ya idiots) version out post-haste, with a fair price- tag. They'd make a fortune! Idiots!
    Jack,

    I TOTALLY hear you on this....you are right....it probably IS a matter of rights....and you share the exact same theory as my G/F (who isnt going to be my G/F for much longer, I dont think, coincidentially, because I just dont think she is right for me---for many reasons; she seems to be more into being there for her friend she lives with and could care less that she made plans to go to Florida to visit her family for Christmas without me---knowing I had to work. Sorry, just venting) regarding the fact that these 39 episodes are probably just the ones Paramount has rights to...this is what it probably is. The problem is that there are SO many good episodes on that "lost list" its a shame theyre not included in these 39....I feel totally ripped off from this.

  6. #6
    Forum Regular jack70's Avatar
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    After some digging...

    I got out my old Harry & Wally TV book (600 pages of 2000+ TV shows). Here's the deal:

    In '52 CBS broadcast The Jackie Gleason Show (1 hr-LIVE)... the "Honeymooners" (skits) ran for a few minutes... or a good chunk of the show, depends. They were never seen again, but were preserved on low-q kinescopes only. In the mid 50's he got tired of the grind of a 1-hr live weekly show and filmed a series of 39 Honeymooners episodes, each 1/2 hr, and they ran during the 55-56 season. Fearing a burn out of the material (guess he never heard of 10-yr series runs, LOL) Gleason went back to his 1-hr show for the next 2 years, during which they did some more occasional Honeymooners skits. He left TV for a while, and returned in 62 with a new 1-hr variety show, of which a few new "Honeymooners" skits were done. In 66 they did 11 hr-long color Honeymooners episodes, but they were more a "Broadway" type thing than the old B&W comedies. In 76-78 there were 4 more hr-long specials ("2'nd Honeymoon").

    The original 39 episodes were re-run on CBS (often) and released on video tape early on. Gleason had rights to the (earlier) 52-55 & (later) 55-56 kinescopes, and finally chose to release them in 85 before he died of cancer in 87. They were all shown "as is" on Showtime in 85-86... then trimmed down, repackaged, and re-issued as 68 -30min shows. So there's 39 (classic) + 68 (var other mixed) shows out there.

    The book was published in 89, so I have no idea who/what the status of the DVD issue thinking is. With the newer high-density discs & such, you'd think they would put all 68 of those "other" shows (34 hrs) on a set of DVDs, but they probably released em as individual discs because of the higher cost of such a set. Of course, I don't know if they were "cleaned up" digitally, but if not, expect a new re-issue down the road when/if that happens...and you can buy em all over again...LOL. I've only recently gotten into DVD's so I don't know what company has the rights, and if other companies have also re-issued them (for a fee). If so, it's possible there is an even more confusing mix of stuff out there. But at least you now know how many episodes were "officially" made, and supposedly "out there".

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by jack70
    I got out my old Harry & Wally TV book (600 pages of 2000+ TV shows). Here's the deal:

    In '52 CBS broadcast The Jackie Gleason Show (1 hr-LIVE)... the "Honeymooners" (skits) ran for a few minutes... or a good chunk of the show, depends. They were never seen again, but were preserved on low-q kinescopes only. In the mid 50's he got tired of the grind of a 1-hr live weekly show and filmed a series of 39 Honeymooners episodes, each 1/2 hr, and they ran during the 55-56 season. Fearing a burn out of the material (guess he never heard of 10-yr series runs, LOL) Gleason went back to his 1-hr show for the next 2 years, during which they did some more occasional Honeymooners skits. He left TV for a while, and returned in 62 with a new 1-hr variety show, of which a few new "Honeymooners" skits were done. In 66 they did 11 hr-long color Honeymooners episodes, but they were more a "Broadway" type thing than the old B&W comedies. In 76-78 there were 4 more hr-long specials ("2'nd Honeymoon").

    The original 39 episodes were re-run on CBS (often) and released on video tape early on. Gleason had rights to the (earlier) 52-55 & (later) 55-56 kinescopes, and finally chose to release them in 85 before he died of cancer in 87. They were all shown "as is" on Showtime in 85-86... then trimmed down, repackaged, and re-issued as 68 -30min shows. So there's 39 (classic) + 68 (var other mixed) shows out there.

    The book was published in 89, so I have no idea who/what the status of the DVD issue thinking is. With the newer high-density discs & such, you'd think they would put all 68 of those "other" shows (34 hrs) on a set of DVDs, but they probably released em as individual discs because of the higher cost of such a set. Of course, I don't know if they were "cleaned up" digitally, but if not, expect a new re-issue down the road when/if that happens...and you can buy em all over again...LOL. I've only recently gotten into DVD's so I don't know what company has the rights, and if other companies have also re-issued them (for a fee). If so, it's possible there is an even more confusing mix of stuff out there. But at least you now know how many episodes were "officially" made, and supposedly "out there".
    Jack,

    Thanks a million for doing the research....68 OTHER episodes aside from the ones in the box set I bought? I feel totally abused. This is an outrage. As one person on here said, I believe it was Kelsci, this series as a whole would be a monstronsity to collect---near impossible for the person with an average income (or below average like me) or a non-diehard fan affection for the show. I VERY MUCH enjoyed the show, but it's not something I would go out and try to collect so much DVD material for as you say is available.

    Should I just hold on to this box collection I bought and call it a day?

  8. #8
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    John; Yes. Like Jack pointed out, that the 39 episodes really was the only time Gleason made it as a series.

  9. #9
    Forum Regular GrendelZ's Avatar
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    Classics

    The classic 39 are the best episodes,I am quite happy getting them all in one set.They represent the best of this show.I dont know how many of the others youve seen but they dont quite have the same punch as these,not to mention the old kinescope ones are almost unwatchable.I love this set.

    (who isnt going to be my G/F for much longer, I dont think, coincidentially, because I just dont think she is right for me---for many reasons; she seems to be more into being there for her friend she lives with and could care less that she made plans to go to Florida to visit her family for Christmas without me---knowing I had to work. Sorry, just venting)
    You need to put this on CrappyGirlfriendReview.com

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