Wire is Wire - The Proof

[okiemax]

For the record, I do not think it is ridiculous to think someone can communicate with the dead. That is a personal or religious matter and there may be something to it, however, there is simply no evidence other than personal accounts. What I don't like are guys like John Edwards who takes money from people by exploiting this unproven possibility. He has been caught many times on his method of "talking to the dead" which is really a form of hot or cold readings.

And I have never used the words lying or delusional when describing a cable believer. All I am saying is that there is no proof, senses can be fallible, actual differences can be caused by other factors, and emotions play a large part in subjective assessments.

The only real difference between me and cable believer is that the cable believer has positively concluded that his cable has improved his system sound while I am saying let's look at all the other factors first, before reaching a conclusion.

Yes, I know you have never accused cable yeasayers of lying.I should have left "lying" out of the analogy. I thought you had implied that they are delusional, although you may not have used the word "delusional."

I cannot communicate with the dead, and doubt anyone who claims they can. However, I occasionally imagine conversations with my dead parents. Something will happen that reminds me of my Father, for example, and I will think about what he would say and what I would say. He lives on in my mind.

An individual's claim about hearing a difference in two cables can be verified through blinded testing. But verifying subjective experience with objective testing is not a common consumer practice. Why? Because people have found that relying on their senses works. Trying to persuade people that their senses are fallible contradicts their experience, and may be unwelcomed instead of appreciated.

BTW, I agree with your post on American Splendor and Adaptation. I really enjoyed these movies.

[mtrycraft]

But verifying subjective experience with objective testing is not a common consumer practice. Why? Because people have found that relying on their senses works.


Yes, and no. Multiple senses 9in combination can confuse the issue when you are checking small differences. That is well know. Subjective experience, unchallenged, is what the marketeers are hoping for.


Trying to persuade people that their senses are fallible contradicts their experience, and may be unwelcomed instead of appreciated.

Because they have not been tested, or know better how your senses can mislead you in some instances. Why would the marketeer tell you this? He wants to sell more, not less.

[Monstrous Mike]

I cannot communicate with the dead, and doubt anyone who claims they can. However, I occasionally imagine conversations with my dead parents. Something will happen that reminds me of my Father, for example, and I will think about what he would say and what I would say. He lives on in my mind.

I'm sorry to hear about your parents. I have both of mine and I certainly appreciate them more now then when I was a teenager. I have no problem accepting that you still have personal relationship with them through memories or even conversations. Like I said, this is a personal matter. However, if somebody like John Edwards says he is talking your parents for you, would this not annoy you?

Trying to persuade people that their senses are fallible contradicts their experience, and may be unwelcomed instead of appreciated.

Well actually, it's not the senses that are fallible. It's the interpretation of the information that the senses provide us that causes problems. I agree that this level of analysis for simple home audio enjoyment is probably overkill and most people should just buy what they can afford and be happy with the sound.

The trouble starts when people categorically state things like: "My JPS Labs speakerwires sound better than zip cord because of their proprietary crystal lattice structure, doing recommended burn in period and the mathematical analysis of Jon Risch."