Results 1 to 10 of 10
  1. #1
    Suspended markw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Noo Joisey. Youse got a problem wit dat?
    Posts
    4,676

    Cable Wars Episode 2 - Blue Jeans Cable Strikes Back

    As was promised in the previous linked post, the owner of Blue Jeans Cable, a corporate litigation lawyer himself for 25 years, posted his response to Monster Cables attorneys.

    They just might have picked on he wrong guy.

    http://forums.audioholics.com/forums...ad.php?t=43259

    We might want to get some popcorn. This could take a while but it WILL be interesting. Gotta love the part about the possible tax shelter in Bermuda.

    more to follow as it develops...
    Last edited by markw; 04-15-2008 at 06:15 AM.

  2. #2
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Department of Heuristics and Research on Material Applications
    Posts
    9,048
    That is the most awesomely sarcastic and pissed off legal response I have ever seen!
    For all of us who have been threatened or screwed by lawyers at one time or another, this is inspriring!
    Great read...can't wait to see how this one plays out. My guess is we never hear of any response from Monster.

  3. #3
    Forum Regular audio amateur's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    France
    Posts
    2,603
    haha that seriously ROCKED! The end especially was awesome. Great work! I wish him well and can positively say that I will have a hard time ever buying a 'Monster' product again.

  4. #4
    Audio casualty StevenSurprenant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    592
    I'm not picking sides here.

    Frankly I don't care for Monster products, but if they are in the right then it should be a simple matter of agreeing to correct the situation.

    I read the entire letter and will agree that the author of it is an educated man, but then I have a habit of reducing long winded diatribes into a Reader Digest version. It seems to me that he said that Monster didn't supply enough proof that there was an infringement and asked for more information specific to the claim. That is of course important and necessary to even make a claim of this sort. Second, he makes claims against Monster which questions their business practices. I understand that he is just letting them know that he is aware of their methods which he implies is leaning toward the unethical. This can be construed as slander on his part. He should have left that part out. Lastly, he informs them that in the end, if they do win the litigation, they will never recover the loss of their legal fees so from a financial standpoint it would be in their best interest to drop the entire matter.

    The solution is very simple. If there is an infringement, then monster should prove it and Blue Jeans Cable should make the changes necessary to correct it. No need to take this to court and no money should change hands.

    I would think that Blue Jeans Cable is ethical enough to do the right thing. As for Monster, I don't know. I bought one of their cables and I am still mad at them for it.

    If it does go to court, then the looser should pay all legal fees for both parties.

    I could go either way with this depending on whether Monster can prove their allegations.

    While the letter seems impressive on the surface, it's substance is pretty much what I indicated in the Reader Digest version. The letter has a secondary message beyond that of it's intended message and that is, Kurt Denke is not intimidated and smart enough to give Monster a run for their money. This part is meaningless if Monster is in the right and can prove their claim. If Kurt is correct in that Monster has not and perhaps cannot substantiate they claim, then this is a no brainer. Monster looses.

    As for Kurt's implications of improper business practices by Monster, I realize that it is a threat on another matter not related to the business at hand. I really don't think Kurt would pursue this issue as it could lead him into years of litigation and perhaps bankruptcy due to legal fees. However, if Monster's business practices are illegal or boarding on illegal, then it would make them think twice before taking the primary issue any further. If there actually is an patent infringement, I don't think Kurt should even bring this second issue up. He would be acting unethical at that point. If he feels strongly enough and believes they are acting illegally and wants to pursue this issue separate from the patent issue then more power to him. If he is just using this threat to win the initial patent case, then, in my book, he is acting unethically.



    Well, that's my book report and I'm sticking to it.
    Last edited by StevenSurprenant; 04-18-2008 at 05:05 AM.

  5. #5
    Forum Regular FLZapped's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    739
    Quote Originally Posted by StevenSurprenant
    I'm not picking sides here.

    Frankly I don't care for Monster products, but if they are in the right then it should be a simple matter of agreeing to correct the situation.

    I read the entire letter and will agree that the author of it is an educated man, but then I have a habit of reducing long winded diatribes into a Reader Digest version. It seems to me that he said that Monster didn't supply enough proof that there was an infringement and asked for more information specific to the claim. That is of course important and necessary to even make a claim of this sort. Second, he makes claims against Monster which questions their business practices. I understand that he is just letting them know that he is aware of their methods which he implies is leaning toward the unethical. This can be construed as slander on his part. He should have left that part out. Lastly, he informs them that in the end, if they do win the litigation, they will never recover the loss of their legal fees so from a financial standpoint it would be in their best interest to drop the entire matter.

    The solution is very simple. If there is an infringement, then monster should prove it and Blue Jeans Cable should make the changes necessary to correct it. No need to take this to court and no money should change hands.

    I would think that Blue Jeans Cable is ethical enough to do the right thing. As for Monster, I don't know. I bought one of their cables and I am still mad at them for it.

    If it does go to court, then the looser should pay all legal fees for both parties.

    I could go either way with this depending on whether Monster can prove their allegations.

    While the letter seems impressive on the surface, it's substance is pretty much what I indicated in the Reader Digest version. The letter has a secondary message beyond that of it's intended message and that is, Kurt Denke is not intimidated and smart enough to give Monster a run for their money. This part is meaningless if Monster is in the right and can prove their claim. If Kurt is correct in that Monster has not and perhaps cannot substantiate they claim, then this is a no brainer. Monster looses.

    As for Kurt's implications of improper business practices by Monster, I realize that it is a threat on another matter not related to the business at hand. I really don't think Kurt would pursue this issue as it could lead him into years of litigation and perhaps bankruptcy due to legal fees. However, if Monster's business practices are illegal or boarding on illegal, then it would make them think twice before taking the primary issue any further. If there actually is an patent infringement, I don't think Kurt should even bring this second issue up. He would be acting unethical at that point. If he feels strongly enough and believes they are acting illegally and wants to pursue this issue separate from the patent issue then more power to him. If he is just using this threat to win the initial patent case, then, in my book, he is acting unethically.



    Well, that's my book report and I'm sticking to it.
    You seem unaware of Monster's practices....it isn't about going to court for them, it's about shaking down someone for whatever they can get. When people have fought back, Monster usually shrinks back into the woodwork. Therefore, his menitoning their practices was quite relevant as it shows a predicatble pattern of behaviour. Judges just eat those things up......and Monster damned well knows it.

    -Bruce

  6. #6
    Audio casualty StevenSurprenant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    592
    Quote Originally Posted by FLZapped
    You seem unaware of Monster's practices....it isn't about going to court for them, it's about shaking down someone for whatever they can get. When people have fought back, Monster usually shrinks back into the woodwork. Therefore, his menitoning their practices was quite relevant as it shows a predicatble pattern of behaviour. Judges just eat those things up......and Monster damned well knows it.

    -Bruce
    You are correct. I am not aware of it.

    Even so, I would have to review Monsters past claims to make a determination as to whether they are truly shaking people down or whether their claims were valid. Part of the problem with the legal system is that they like to give other peoples money away. If there is a patent violation, the court should give a cease and desist order and not give any monetary awards. This should remove the motivation from the picture.

    Part of the problem is the court (legal) system itself. For instance...

    True story...(massively shortened)

    A chemical company dumps its waste product in a nearby water way. When they get caught, they are fined. When no-one is looking they do it again until they are caught again. The cycle repeats itself for years. Why do they do it? Because it is cheaper to pay the fine than paying for processing the waste material.

    Instead of just fining the company, what would happen if the court would put these people in jail or closed down the business. I would think that the problem would end very quickly.

    Well anyway, if Monster is truly shaking people down then the owners should be put in jail and their business should be closed down.

    If the court system was what it was supposed to be, justice for all, then we wouldn't have these problems. Of all professions, I think it is the most incompetent one on the planet. It doesn't work and that is why people like Monster can bilk people out of their money (assuming the allegations against them are true.)

    Frankly, I would like to see the business closed down so they would get that junk out of the stores and make room for decent cables that are reasonably priced. As far as I am concerned, the Monster displays that are in most stores are just wasted space.

    As you can see, I have no love for Monster. I have no opinion on Blue jean cables except that I read that many people recommend it, good bang for the buck kind of thing.

    If it is true that Monster is laundering money over seas, than the IRS should be made aware of it and the IRS should take action against the company. If Monster is, metaphorically speaking, jumping in front of cars to collect insurance money, then it should be put out of business.

    You see, I don't have enough facts to make any determination along these lines and I cannot assume that the rumors against Monster are true. If the rumors are true, then, by god, hang em from the highest tree.

    As for me, I bought a cable from them and it was worse than the cheap interconnects that many companies supply with their products. They will never get any of my money again. I don't know how to make a cable worse that those cheap interconnects, but Monster figured it out. LOL

    Now, it's time for me to research Monster to see if what many are saying is true.

    I still stand by my assessment of my previous posting only because I don't respond well to threats. Although, in the real world, I realize this is how business is done. It's not right, but it really doesn't matter what I think, does it? The only question is, does it work in the real world?

    Kurt opened up a large can of worms. As I see it, there are now two issues. The possible patent infringement and Monster's purported business practices. If Monster wanted to pursue it, they can now claim that Kurt hurt their business with his slander. But of course, all this litigation costs money and I am sure that Kurt feels that Monster will not want to go down that path.

    If the rumors are true, I stand behind Kurt 100%, as I am sure most people do.

    Well, I'm rambling...

    Thanks for the reply.

  7. #7
    Forum Regular hermanv's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Santa Rosa, CA
    Posts
    980
    Forgive my thin understanding of law, but as I understand it: The act that allowed for the creation of corporations was passed in the late 1800's. Part of the act says that the government may revoke a corporate charter if it's found that the corporation is acting against the public interest. This remedy has never once been applied in all those years, certainly there have been some truly bad corporate actors.
    Herman;

    My stuff:
    Olive Musica/transport and server
    Mark Levinson No.360S D to A
    Passive pre (homemade; Shallco, Vishay, Cardas wire/connectors)
    Cardas Golden Presence IC
    Pass Labs X250
    Martin Logan ReQuests.

  8. #8
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Department of Heuristics and Research on Material Applications
    Posts
    9,048
    Quote Originally Posted by hermanv
    Forgive my thin understanding of law, but as I understand it: The act that allowed for the creation of corporations was passed in the late 1800's. Part of the act says that the government may revoke a corporate charter if it's found that the corporation is acting against the public interest. This remedy has never once been applied in all those years, certainly there have been some truly bad corporate actors.
    Problem is the likely targets are often large contibutors to both political camps, bad for business if you start pulling the plug on some of them - loss of jobs, aftermath lawsuits - that would surely be a messy affair. I'd love to see it happen to a truly deserving company but I doubt it ever will.
    First up...HMO's...

  9. #9
    Forum Regular hermanv's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Santa Rosa, CA
    Posts
    980
    Quote Originally Posted by kexodusc
    Problem is the likely targets are often large contibutors to both political camps, bad for business if you start pulling the plug on some of them - loss of jobs, aftermath lawsuits - that would surely be a messy affair. I'd love to see it happen to a truly deserving company but I doubt it ever will.
    First up...HMO's...
    Yes. My rather oblique point was that we have the best government money can buy.

    No idea of exact numbers, but millions of corporations thousands, of criminal convictions, never once has a charter been pulled even for a tiny company who can't afford a private senator.
    Herman;

    My stuff:
    Olive Musica/transport and server
    Mark Levinson No.360S D to A
    Passive pre (homemade; Shallco, Vishay, Cardas wire/connectors)
    Cardas Golden Presence IC
    Pass Labs X250
    Martin Logan ReQuests.

  10. #10
    Forum Regular FLZapped's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    739
    Quote Originally Posted by StevenSurprenant
    You are correct. I am not aware of it.

    Even so, I would have to review Monsters past claims to make a determination as to whether they are truly shaking people down or whether their claims were valid. Part of the problem with the legal system is that they like to give other peoples money away. If there is a patent violation, the court should give a cease and desist order and not give any monetary awards. This should remove the motivation from the picture.

    Part of the problem is the court (legal) system itself. For instance...

    True story...(massively shortened)

    A chemical company dumps its waste product in a nearby water way. When they get caught, they are fined. When no-one is looking they do it again until they are caught again. The cycle repeats itself for years. Why do they do it? Because it is cheaper to pay the fine than paying for processing the waste material.

    Instead of just fining the company, what would happen if the court would put these people in jail or closed down the business. I would think that the problem would end very quickly.

    Well anyway, if Monster is truly shaking people down then the owners should be put in jail and their business should be closed down.

    If the court system was what it was supposed to be, justice for all, then we wouldn't have these problems. Of all professions, I think it is the most incompetent one on the planet. It doesn't work and that is why people like Monster can bilk people out of their money (assuming the allegations against them are true.)

    Frankly, I would like to see the business closed down so they would get that junk out of the stores and make room for decent cables that are reasonably priced. As far as I am concerned, the Monster displays that are in most stores are just wasted space.

    As you can see, I have no love for Monster. I have no opinion on Blue jean cables except that I read that many people recommend it, good bang for the buck kind of thing.

    If it is true that Monster is laundering money over seas, than the IRS should be made aware of it and the IRS should take action against the company. If Monster is, metaphorically speaking, jumping in front of cars to collect insurance money, then it should be put out of business.

    You see, I don't have enough facts to make any determination along these lines and I cannot assume that the rumors against Monster are true. If the rumors are true, then, by god, hang em from the highest tree.

    As for me, I bought a cable from them and it was worse than the cheap interconnects that many companies supply with their products. They will never get any of my money again. I don't know how to make a cable worse that those cheap interconnects, but Monster figured it out. LOL

    Now, it's time for me to research Monster to see if what many are saying is true.

    I still stand by my assessment of my previous posting only because I don't respond well to threats. Although, in the real world, I realize this is how business is done. It's not right, but it really doesn't matter what I think, does it? The only question is, does it work in the real world?

    Kurt opened up a large can of worms. As I see it, there are now two issues. The possible patent infringement and Monster's purported business practices. If Monster wanted to pursue it, they can now claim that Kurt hurt their business with his slander. But of course, all this litigation costs money and I am sure that Kurt feels that Monster will not want to go down that path.

    If the rumors are true, I stand behind Kurt 100%, as I am sure most people do.

    Well, I'm rambling...

    Thanks for the reply.
    In the grand scheme of things, Monster is a tiny little pin fish in a great big ocean. The government isn't going to take note until they get to the Enron size.....

    -Bruce

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Latest AudioReview Articles

Hot Deals

Latest News

AudioReview on Facebook