Results 1 to 9 of 9
  1. #1
    Can a crooner get a gig? dean_martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Lower AL
    Posts
    2,838

    new cart - Ortofon 2M Red

    The 2M line of moving magnet carts from Ortofon is out. I've had the Red (cheapest of the line) for less than a week and I'm still getting comfortable with it. I've put maybe 2-3 hrs. if that much on it so far. The end of last month I ordered a new headshell (Sumiko HS-12) for my Technics SL-1210mk2. It finally arrived so I'm playing around with it too.

    Initial observations are that the Red has a similar sound (house sound) as my Ortofon MC3-Turbo high-output mc which is a good thing. The MC3-Turbo was tricky to mount on the Technics headshell because its light weight required use of the headshell weight which in turn required me to steady 3 things at once while adjusting and tightening the screws. The Red is heavier and is an excellent match for the Technics headshell. The Sumiko headshell is heavier than the stock Technics so I was able to install the MC3 on the Sumiko without use of the headshell weight...ahh, things are already getting simpler. Now all I have to do is adjust tracking force when switching out carts (perhaps arm height too but I haven't played around with that yet).

    The higher output of the Red allows me to experiment more with the gain of my Bellari phono stage moreso than with the MC3 so I'm still dialing in the perfect level on the Bellari's gain control.

    Hopefully I'll be able to pick out some records I'm very familiar with soon and get a better read on the Red. I just got The Shins Chutes too Narrow. I thought the red was a little abrasive in the treble. There's alot of high-frequency jangly info on this Shins album. But when I went back to the MC3 which I know is very smooth and airy in the treble, I heard the same or similar abrasiveness. Must be the recording. The Red performed much like the MC3 with Built to Spill's Keep It Like a Secret. Very little difference with this album.

    The differences were more apparent with the 45rpm pressing of Louis Armstrong's St. James Infirmary/I ain't Got Nobody (special 12" "single" from Louis Plays King Oliver). This recording is awesome for its time and beats much of today's stuff. When everything is just right ol' Satchmo steps into the room. I'm beginning to develop some preferences between my old belt drive table and the Technics. Jazz in particular seems to be more enjoyable with my old Pro-Ject/MC3 combo than with the Technics even when using the MC3. But with the Red on the Technics, the differences favor the Pro-Ject/MC3 even more.

    OTOH, the Technics has more drive with rock. The bass is more present, extended and solid, and guitars, especially layered guitars, sound fuller. Drum attacks are more crisp and really move along. Playing rock on the Technics, the drop off between the more expensive MC3 and the Red is almost unnoticeable. If there is any truth to break-in and the Red improves any in the frequency extremes, I think the Red will be the better and simpler choice for rock music played on the Technics.

    That's all for now.

  2. #2
    Do What? jrhymeammo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    3,275

    Yo DM,

    Thanks for giving us your insight on both Ortofon and Technics.
    Sounds like you'll br breaking in your new cart.

    I speculate that Pro-Ject arm is better than Technics' S arm, but I cannot stop wondering what a Technics and Rega(Origin) combo can offer.

    Please keep us updated on your further findnings. We would love to hear your experience with DD deck than from others who has not owned SL-1200s.

    Regards,

    JRA from Japan.

  3. #3
    Can a crooner get a gig? dean_martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Lower AL
    Posts
    2,838
    JRA, how's Japan? My son went to Japan 2 years ago and he's in China now. I envy you globetrotters.

    My grand plan is to get the Denon DL-103 and a step-up transformer for the Bellari or another phono preamp to handle the Denon's low output so I can swap out the 2M Red and Denon on the Technics as the mood strikes.

    I want to move the MC3-Turbo to a higher end belt drive table. Its mids and highs are to my liking on my entry-level Pro-Ject but I always thought it had weak bass until I put it on the Technics. It lost some of its silkiness in the mids and highs though. It's all about synergy. The MC3 sounds better overall with the belt drive table and I think it would really do well on a belt drive w/arm that can portray its bass extension along with its smooth mids and highs.

    Anyhow, I am leaning to the conclusion that for my tastes, the Technics may sound best with a cart that is on the warm side of neutral and either extremely open and smooth in the highs (the kind of high frequency response you get from very expensive carts) or that simply rolls off the highs. I guess other options would be some of the mods offered by KAB, but I haven't really studied those yet.

  4. #4
    Can a crooner get a gig? dean_martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Lower AL
    Posts
    2,838
    ok, I know this isn't a personal diary but I made some adjustments and tried a different album late Saturday and early Sunday.

    The recommended tracking force for the Red is 1.8g on the high side. I've tracked my last two carts at 2.0 to 2.2g. I dialed in the tonearm weight to 1.9 and set the corresponding anti-skate to 1.9 on the Technics. I picked out Yo La Tengo's "Summer Sun" to spin. This is a droning, hypnotic album without being boring. Almost all the instruments and vocals throughout the first half of the album are in the midrange band.

    I sat back and listened to side A. Then, I listened again. It was that good! On the 3rd time I adjusted tracking force and anti-skate back down to 1.8 and I noticed the music was just a tad lighter (less weight). The higher tracking force made the music sound right. Then I listened to side B...twice. This album really brings out the Red's strengths. (It's a double album but I didn't have time over the weekend to try sides D & E.) Next time I get a couple of hours of listening time at home I'll try it with different stuff to see if the Red is settling down any in the treble. Right now I'm thinking either it is or the Tengo album just doesn't have much treble info. I liked the higher tracking force with this album. Music was natural and on the warm side which has not been my experience with the Technics.

  5. #5
    nightflier
    Guest
    DM, thanks for the info. I was shopping for an inexpensive cart for my father's TT and thought the Ortofon 2M red would be good (moving up from an inexpensive Grado that is all but worn out), but he's a classical music guy and now I'm a little apprehensive. What are your thoughts there?

    Also, we're using the Pro-Ject PhonoBox, which I've always suspected of being somewhat of an under-performer. The Bellari crossed my mind, but my father's not the most attentive anymore and might forget that tubes can get rather hot. Any thoughts there?

    Thanks.

  6. #6
    Can a crooner get a gig? dean_martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Lower AL
    Posts
    2,838
    hey, NF. Cambridge Audio makes a 640p phono preamp that is supposed to perform well above its price class. It's $169 and has inputs for both mm and low-output mc carts. From what I've read, it's supposed to have higher quality parts than the lower-priced mm-only 540p. I might get the 640p for my son even though he doesn't need the mc input. My understanding is that the 640p is not just the 540p with added mc input. Its mm section is better than the 540p.

    I'm going to let the Red break in a little more then try it with jazz and classical. I'll let you know how that goes. Another cart to consider in the Red's price range is the Audio-Technica AT120E.

  7. #7
    Do What? jrhymeammo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    3,275
    Quote Originally Posted by dean_martin
    hey, NF. Cambridge Audio makes a 640p phono preamp that is supposed to perform well above its price class. It's $169 and has inputs for both mm and low-output mc carts. From what I've read, it's supposed to have higher quality parts than the lower-priced mm-only 540p. I might get the 640p for my son even though he doesn't need the mc input. My understanding is that the 640p is not just the 540p with added mc input. Its mm section is better than the 540p.
    Hey DM,

    I dont want to get off the subject too much, but do you know if 640 has Class-A gain stage like 540?

    They dont state how they measure SN ratio in both MM/MC, but looks to be capable of playing LOMC without too much noise @ 55dbs. It's always nice to have MC capable phonostage.

    I'm breaking in my new cart as well. Lets hope we'll continue to enjoy our new discovery. Peace.

    JRA

  8. #8
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Mortsel, Antwerp, Belgium, Europe, Earth
    Posts
    3,056
    Quote Originally Posted by jrhymeammo
    I'm breaking in my new cart as well. Lets hope we'll continue to enjoy our new discovery. Peace.

    JRA
    how about some news on that cart eh

    one pic doesn't suffice

    Keep them spinning,
    Bert.
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  9. #9
    Can a crooner get a gig? dean_martin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Lower AL
    Posts
    2,838
    Quote Originally Posted by jrhymeammo

    I dont want to get off the subject too much, but do you know if 640 has Class-A gain stage like 540?

    I'm breaking in my new cart as well. Lets hope we'll continue to enjoy our new discovery. Peace.

    JRA
    according to audioadvisor, the 640 has class-A gain stages:

    http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=CA640P

    What's your new cart?

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •