Replacement for NAD PP-2 phono pre

[clapton1980]

..and the Graham Slee would be a good pairing despite the fact it's a MM pre? Been reading plenty of reviews and I'm 100% sold on it --just want to make sure it's a good match for my Benz MC Silver.

[jrhymeammo]

..and the Graham Slee would be a good pairing despite the fact it's a MM pre? Been reading plenty of reviews and I'm 100% sold on it --just want to make sure it's a good match for my Benz MC Silver.

If you have a High Output Moving Coil cartridge say higher than 1.6mV with 47k impedance, just treat it as it was a regular MM cartridge. Medium Output Moving Coil cartridges such as Benz Micro M2 will needed to be treated differently. I think they are usuall around 1000 ohm with 0.8mV output.

[jrhymeammo]

I imagine the Graham Slee will be a significant upgrade for you.
It offers sufficient amount of gain for your cartridge.

Graham Slee Spec:

Input range: 2mV - 10mV rms
Output range (for above inputs): 224mV to 1120mV rms
Gain: 41dB (Av 112) ref 1kHz
Input impedance resistive: 47k Ohms
Input impedance capacitive: 100pF

Benz Micro Spec:
Elliptical stylus
2.0mV output
Tracking grams: 2 grams
Loading: 47k ohms
Weight: 5.7 grams
Frequency response: 20hz-25khz


This will work just fine.

[jrhymeammo]

Of course you will want to do your own research, and consider other options if needed.

[Luvin Da Blues]

clapton 1980...any reference to his "Just One Night" album? Juz wunderin'.

[02audionoob]

I think Rega, Cambridge, or Bellari will be a lateral move.

I would try out somem like this. If you don't like it, you can always sell on Agon without much loss.
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....-Gram-Amp-2-SE

Lehmann Black Cube shows up once in a while, and it's been proven by audiophiles over the years.

Agreed. If you want to buy used, your budget could probably get you a Phonomena or a Tube Box.

[JohnMichael]

I have been very happy with my Gram Amp 3. It works well with the Benz MC Gold and better than the Rotel RQ 970BX or the Cambridge Audio 640P. The Graham Slee products do take a while to burn-in. Once the unit was sounding it's best I was impressed with the instrumental textures and how musical it sounds. If I ever go back to my Ortofon OM20 or Grado then I will use the Cambridge Audio 640P. I can not imagine that happening since I am so pleased with the Benz/Fanfare combination.

[clapton1980]

Thanks again to everyone for the great feedback. I think the Graham Slee will be my first choice new (or if I can snag one used on Augiogon).

That said there's a first-gen Phonomena available now in my price range, worth investigating? I've seen great reviews, but mostly for the Phonomena II. Are there key differences?

[clapton1980]

I've read that as well but there appears to be a power input port on the this unit?

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ena-phono-stag

[02audionoob]

I misunderstood your question so I deleted my reply. The original Phonomena seems worth pursuing at or near the asking price. Musical Surroundings made an external battery power supply for it, in addition to the standard wall-mount transformer. The current Phonomena II is the replacement for the original Phonomena and the Nova Phonomena is the battery-powered upgrade model as compared to the II.

The power input on the model you linked would accept a power plug from the wall-mount transforner or the external battery power supply.

[jrhymeammo]

http://buy.audiogon.com/cgia/fsb.pl?preaphon&1&ctg&st1

Yeah, you gotta be quick on great deals at Audiogon.
Check out the link frequently.

I think another option is Dynavector P-75 mk2. I can't believe that $800 phono stage is considered as Entry level phono, but there are too many great reviews on this phonostage. I know a guy who tried them with $4000 TT setup and was quite impressed. I might be wrong, but I think Hifitommy owns one or know someone who does, and was very impressed with the unit.

Just somem to consider. Doesn't Nightflier own the Phonomena? Maybe he can chime in.

[jrhymeammo]

Agreed. If you want to buy used, your budget could probably get you a Phonomena or a Tube Box.

My impression of the Tube Box was that it is very involving sounding phono pre.
Perhaps it made bad music more enjoyable than how the music was intended. With that, I never thought it was accurate, neutral, or resolving sounding gear. But it just made me want to listen to more and more. You can stay up all night listening to LP without getting tired...which can be very good or very bad.

[poppachubby]

I would suggest the Slee over the Phonomena. You can make your own battery stage, VERY simply. My "buddy" Abe Collins gave me his recipe and I have my Music Hall MMF Phono Pack rockin to it. It will lower the noise floor and allow you to hear EVERYTHING your amp is delivering. He uses his on a Slee. Here are the batteries, essentially taking direct current and making it alternate. I added an inline fuse just in case. Get yourself a Slee and I can help you put a battery stage together.

[nightflier]

Well the first generation Phonomena can be had second-hand for $300-400, and it's no slouch. It's still my reference and certainly beat the pants off my previous NAD PP2 as well as a few others I tried like the Cambridge 640p and the Pro-ject Phono Box. I've talked to a few people who have the new version and for all practical purposes the only real difference is that the jumpers are now accessible from the outside. This "shortcoming" of my Phonomena was a bit of an issue for me as I like to tinker, but I just kept the cover off the unit while I was setting things up and then once I got it just how liked it, I replaced the cover (FYI: it uses metric hex-screws and should come with it's own Allen wrench that matches them).

As far as bang-for-the-buck, I can't think of any phono preamp that punches as far above it's weight-class. The Bellaris are nice, especially since you can swap tubes and fine-tune them, but the Phonomenas are a class above that, IMO. Another small issue for miser-types like me is that it doesn't have an on/off switch, but I've also found that leaving it on makes for a much better sounding phono pre because it does change after a good warm-up. It has no tubes, so I don't think there's a wear issue with that.

The other phono-pre I would consider is the Jolida, which I've been reading is also quite impressive, especially with better tubes. It can be had for very little online, I think there was one on Audiogon that sold for just $300. Used ones do go fast online, but that should be a good sign as well. That said, I'm still skeptical of it because I have a love-hate relationship with tubes. They sound better, but they typically cost a whole lot more in comparison to well-engineered solid state like the Phonomenas and Clearaudios.

This is strictly my opinion, but I can say that some of the lower priced ones I've heard (Pro-ject, Bellari, and some Chinese brands I can't remember) have either introduced excessive noise or have been very difficult to set up without doing so. The price-point for better tube-based phono preamps, IMO, is around $2-3K (Audion, used Herrons, BATs, and if you're lucky to find one, Aesthetix...) and that is more than I'm ready to spend right now and my gear doesn't measure up anyhow.

[02audionoob]

I've owned the original Pro-Ject Tube Box and the Bellari VP129. In my experience, much of the noise heard with those are the OEM tubes. With both of those phono preamps, I replaced the tubes with Sovtek 12AX7LPS and heard less noise. They were at least as quiet as the phono stage of my Adcom GFP-565.

[atomicAdam]

Thanks for posting that. It's challenging to get VTA optimized when you consider the 180g re-issues. But since I have it the way I like it with the load at 1k, I can combat the dark tone of the 180g records by adjusting the load to 47k for only those records.

My PS Audio GCPH also has a continuously variable gain dial, like the Nano, but it sells for beyond the OP's budget, even used.

You get a dark tone with 180g re-issues? That is interesting. I've not experienced that.

[02audionoob]

You get a dark tone with 180g re-issues? That is interesting. I've not experienced that.

It's ordinarily very slight. Nothing really to worry about...and almost something I wouldn't notice. But if I do notice it, I just turn the impedance selector one notch and it's all good.

[atomicAdam]

It's ordinarily very slight. Nothing really to worry about...and almost something I wouldn't notice. But if I do notice it, I just turn the impedance selector one notch and it's all good.

For me it is a more full bodied sound with the thicker vinyl, but not always. Anyways, just interesting to read that.

[02audionoob]

For me it is a more full bodied sound with the thicker vinyl, but not always. Anyways, just interesting to read that.

I agree there's something added to the quality in most 180g records. In the context of this thread I'm only referring to the condition in the info JM posted in reply #16...where a thicker record can affect the angle of your tonearm...especially with a relatively short one like mine and less so with something like the 12-inch SME arms. When the stylus contact point is high enough to slightly angle the tonearm upward, you can lose a little in the highs.