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Thread: Bullet bitten and trigger pulled

  1. #1
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Bullet bitten and trigger pulled

    OK, resistance was futile following the commanding leadership of harley, Mr P, and blackraven I'm going Pass Labs.

    I've bought a used Pass Labs 150.5, (on AudioAsylumTrader). I'll be waiting breathlessly for its arrival. I considered one of the XA30.5's available be decide the lower price and heat output of the former was the way to go in my case.


  2. #2
    Forum Regular Jack in Wilmington's Avatar
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    Wow, it's like an audio epidemic. First Mr. P and now it's spreading. I was leaning towards Bryston, but now I'm swaying the other way. Congrats Feanor, hope all goes well in shipping.
    2 Channel System
    Dynaudio Contour 1.8 Mk II
    Pass Labs X150.5 (Amp)
    Cary SLP-03 (Preamp)
    Music Hall MMF 5.1 (TT)
    Goldring 1012GX (Cart.)
    Pro-ject SE II (Phono Box)
    Rotel RCD-1072 (CD Player)
    Bryston BDA-1 ( DAC )
    Sennheiser HD-600 (Headphones)
    Musical Fidelity Xcan V3 (Headphone Amp) _

    HT System
    Usher X-719 (Mains)
    Usher X-616 (Center)
    Usher S-520 (Surrounds)
    Rel T2 (Subwoofer)
    Anthem MCA20 (Amp)
    Yamaha RX-A830 (Receiver)
    Panasonic TH-46PZ85U (Plasma TV)
    Denon DBT-1713UD (BluRay/SACD)

  3. #3
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Smile

    Bill, congrats on the new amp. You won't be disappointed. It will transform your system. I am looking forward to your impressions. If you don't like it, blame Mr P., he started it all
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

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    Epidemic is right, LOL. Congrats Feanor, I will be anxious to hear your report as you sound like one who likes a very neutral presentation. I think if the Pass is to your liking and you can swing picking up the 8001 you will be on the way to a very enjoyable system.

  5. #5
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Some specs of the 150.5 that surprised me (more or less):

    • Wpc @ 8 ohms = 150; @ 4 ohms = 300 -- not all that surprising from such an auspicious maker but it's good to have it confirmed
    • Weight = 62 lbs -- heavy compared to other amps I've owned, including the fairly heavy Adcom GFP555II, and heavier than the pair of my Monarchy SM-70 Pro's.
    • Input impedance = 30/20 kOhms, (balanced/single-ended) -- I would have assumed higher; probably speaks for using an active preamp
    • Damping factor = 150 -- fairly low for an s/s amp
    • Maximum in class A = 10 watts -- not really surprising; this is a pretty common value for modern, quality AB amps
    • Power consumption at idle = 200 watts -- wow! pretty high, plus best sound quality is best when 'On' for 1+ hours. But I don't think I leave mine 'On' 24/7, just leave it in 'Stand By'.


    See X.5 series specifications HERE.

  6. #6
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    Wow cool. I think we are going to have to change this website name to Pass labs review instead of Audio Review. I think if we started a Pass only thread everyone would be there and all the other topics would have no one there. You will love the 150.5, I know i love mine. Let us know what you think and I won't be surprised when it blows you away and be very very surprised if it doesn't

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  7. #7
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    I haven't heard Blackraven mention it but I can definitely tell a difference in the sound once the amp warms up, I usually turn it on ahead of time if I know I will be listening to shorten the time. It's a very similar effect tube amps have, once it warms up things seem to be more open and overall better.

    Also, I forgot to mention it to you but the Pass amp will need to be plugged into AC about 24 hours before it begins to sound the way it should. I couldn't wait myself, I knew out of the box I was going to like it but the next day the sound was improved, especially in the lower region.

    I've heard damping factor really doesn't have to be that high and it's sort of an overrated spec. The Pass bass is about right to me, it doesn't have the iron grip of Krell, but the bass is still very detailed and controlled, allowing enough plum to sound natural.

    Bill, do you use a sub with the Maggies? Just curious, I don't remember you ever talking about one but most seem to add one with 1.6's.

  8. #8
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody View Post
    Bill, do you use a sub with the Maggies? Just curious, I don't remember you ever talking about one but most seem to add one with 1.6's.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody View Post
    Bill, do you use a sub with the Maggies? Just curious, I don't remember you ever talking about one but most seem to add one with 1.6's.
    Yes I do use a sub with the Maggies. I have a PSB Subsonic 5 with the low-pass set to 50 Hz, (the minimum for the sub); the Maggies run full range.

    My system is currently configured like this ...

    Bullet bitten and trigger pulled-stereodiagram17.jpg

  9. #9
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Tonight I did a little benchmarking with my current amp, the Class D Audio SDS-258. Understanding what I currently believe to be the strengths & weaknesses of this amp will help me understand the same for the new amp, the Pass Labs X150.5

    To do this I am using my favorite reference recordings -- which include several Reference Records, (pun intended).

    The SDS-258 actually has some great strengths -- remains to be seen if the new amp is better/equal/not so good:

    • Very fine transparency, air, and separation of voices & instruments
    • Very good soundstage and palpability of performers in it. The soundstage, to my ear, is just as wide, deep, and high as the recording provides -- as demonstrated by the ability of the amp to distinguish recordings from each other
    • Lean, precise bass; not bloated or overhung (like my former NAD C270 or Forte Model 5)
    • A clear, neutral mid-range the conveys instruments and vocals realistically, (unlike the Forte Model 5 that just sounded weird to my ear)



    But there is definitely downside to the SDS:

    • Highs that are extended but bright; not "grainy" or "etched" as those words are typically used, but definitely bright. On good recordings this isn't a big problem for me, but on less than good recordings highs can sound unpleasantly shrill.

  10. #10
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Bill, my X250 has more texture to the music when compared to my CDA-254. Both have good air and transparency but the Pass is more musical and detailed. I find treble to be pushed back with the Pass. It's my only complaint about it. I have not noticed any change in sound after the amp has been on for an hour but I have not been listening for it.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  11. #11
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    Blackraven what do you mean by "pushed back", is it further back in sound stage or are you saying rolled off? I find the treble very good in my system, I wonder if your effect is due to tube compliment of associated gear.

    Bill, when you are noting the sound of the digital amp are you using the ARC preamp?

  12. #12
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody View Post
    Bill, when you are noting the sound of the digital amp are you using the ARC preamp?
    Yes, my comments are based on driving the CDA SDS-258 with the ARC LS9 and a balanced connection.

    However the general characteristics of the SDS were the same with the passive preamp I was using recently. The contribution of the LS9 is principally improved dynamics.

  13. #13
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackraven View Post
    Bill, my X250 has more texture to the music when compared to my CDA-254. Both have good air and transparency but the Pass is more musical and detailed. I find treble to be pushed back with the Pass. It's my only complaint about it. I have not noticed any change in sound after the amp has been on for an hour but I have not been listening for it.
    Well the SDS-258 is a $600 amp while the 150.5 is $5,500 amp, so I will be ... uhmm ... "disappointed" if the latter isn't better in virtually all respects.

    I won't miss the over-bright highs of the SDS provide the 'air' and overall naturalness are improved.

  14. #14
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Mr P. I find the treble to be pushed back in the sound stage and less prominent when compared to my A21 and Class D amps. There is also less air in the treble but there is also no grain. I have tried various tube combo's and some are better than others. I have 0.6 ohm resistors in my Maggie tweeters which I will remove this weekend which will help by increasing the tweeter volume by about 1dB.

    Bill, your 150.5 will sound different than the X250. The 0.5 series has a different sonic character and is supposed to be more refined. When do you expect to receive the amp?
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  15. #15
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackraven View Post
    ...
    Bill, your 150.5 will sound different than the X250. The 0.5 series has a different sonic character and is supposed to be more refined. When do you expect to receive the amp?
    Maybe there are "refinements" but I believe they are relatively slight.

    When will I get the 150.5? Well with any luck the seller will be able ship today. Due to the high shipping weight, 75 lbs, it can't be shipped USPS, (my preference by a wide measure), so it going FedEx.

    FedEx was telling him he need a Certificate of Origin to export the amp. This CoO would make it possible avoid Canadian import duty under NAFTA. However the CoO requires official documentation from the manufacturer plus notarization.

    I told my seller to tell FedEx that his buyer, (that's me), would pay the duty in the absence of an CoO. It's easier, quicker, and possibly cheaper to just pay the duty than obtain a CoO.

    N.B. Under NAFTA in theory a US product can be imported in Canada without duty and vice versa. But in practice it doesn't work out so well in case of a one-off, personal cross-border sale -- see above. In fact, a US buyer can end up paying duty on a US-made product that he buys from a Canadian seller, (and vice versa): this sucks but it's the way it is. The good news is that the tariff rate is fairly low.

    I HATE FedEx; I always prefer the USPS and Canada Post option for being far easier and often cheaper. Coming from the US to Canada it's invariably cheaper because Canada Post charges a flat brokerage fee which is only $8.00 depending on the service selected.

  16. #16
    frenchmon frenchmon's Avatar
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    Well Fenor.....congrats! I'm sure your ears will like the Pass...its a great amp man. When I first heard Peabodys I loved it. And your talking about power concumption just sitting at 200 watts...try a wopping 270 watts my Vincent uses just sitting.

    Harley, you took the words out of my mouth...the PASS LAB REVIEW FORUMS!

    Jack...go ahead and get the Bryston.....I'm sure you will still be in the same category. Which model where you considering?
    Music...let it into your soul and be moved....with Canton...Pure Music


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    W10 i5 Quad core processor 8GB RAM/Jriver 20/ Fidelizer Optimizer/ iFI Micro DSD DAC-iUSB 3.0/Vincent SA - T1/Vincent SP-331 MK /MMF-7.1/2M BLACK/MS Phenomena ll+/Canton Vento 830.2

  17. #17
    Forum Regular Jack in Wilmington's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frenchmon View Post
    Well Fenor.....congrats! I'm sure your ears will like the Pass...its a great amp man. When I first heard Peabodys I loved it. And your talking about power concumption just sitting at 200 watts...try a wopping 270 watts my Vincent uses just sitting.

    Harley, you took the words out of my mouth...the PASS LAB REVIEW FORUMS!

    Jack...go ahead and get the Bryston.....I'm sure you will still be in the same category. Which model where you considering?
    I was looking at the Bryston 4B-SST2 or the Pass X150.5
    frenchmon likes this.
    2 Channel System
    Dynaudio Contour 1.8 Mk II
    Pass Labs X150.5 (Amp)
    Cary SLP-03 (Preamp)
    Music Hall MMF 5.1 (TT)
    Goldring 1012GX (Cart.)
    Pro-ject SE II (Phono Box)
    Rotel RCD-1072 (CD Player)
    Bryston BDA-1 ( DAC )
    Sennheiser HD-600 (Headphones)
    Musical Fidelity Xcan V3 (Headphone Amp) _

    HT System
    Usher X-719 (Mains)
    Usher X-616 (Center)
    Usher S-520 (Surrounds)
    Rel T2 (Subwoofer)
    Anthem MCA20 (Amp)
    Yamaha RX-A830 (Receiver)
    Panasonic TH-46PZ85U (Plasma TV)
    Denon DBT-1713UD (BluRay/SACD)

  18. #18
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Bill, when I talked to Reno Hifi, they guy tried to steer me into buying an X150.5 because he thought the 0.5 series sounded much better than the older X series. So I suspect that there is some truth to that from what I have read. I considered buying an x150.5 but I paid about $1K less for the X250. I was also looking at a used ARC amp, but Reno Hifi steered me away from it saying that he preferred the sound of the Pass amps.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  19. #19
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackraven View Post
    Bill, when I talked to Reno Hifi, they guy tried to steer me into buying an X150.5 because he thought the 0.5 series sounded much better than the older X series. So I suspect that there is some truth to that from what I have read. I considered buying an x150.5 but I paid about $1K less for the X250. I was also looking at a used ARC amp, but Reno Hifi steered me away from it saying that he preferred the sound of the Pass amps.
    I was temped to look for ARC to match my LS9 preamp; (I like the ARC cosmetics). I might have gone for a late model, non-class D model, say an SD135. I'm sure they would have been nice but my ambition for a long while has been for a Pass Labs.

    Come to that, I have some second thoughts along the line that I ought to have got an XA30.5 which would have cost me relatively little more. Another amp might have considered is the Ayre V5XE, though I think it's a bit more "tube like" which isn't necessarily what I'm looking for.

  20. #20
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    I know there are supposed to be differences between the x and .5x series amps but I am just wondering how much? if Reno hifi is saying they recommend the .5 series then there must be more to it than just subtle but I would like to hear that for myself. Too bad everyone does not live close to Missouri or we could all get together and have Mr Peabody bring his x250 and I bring my x150.5 and we could have a Pass off!!!!! and see just how much difference there really is.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  21. #21
    frenchmon frenchmon's Avatar
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    Harley...what is the .5 in the x150.5 ?
    Music...let it into your soul and be moved....with Canton...Pure Music


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    W10 i5 Quad core processor 8GB RAM/Jriver 20/ Fidelizer Optimizer/ iFI Micro DSD DAC-iUSB 3.0/Vincent SA - T1/Vincent SP-331 MK /MMF-7.1/2M BLACK/MS Phenomena ll+/Canton Vento 830.2

  22. #22
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frenchmon View Post
    Harley...what is the .5 in the x150.5 ?
    I am not for sure other than they took the amps to the next level in the .5 update. 'm sure Raven would be able to tell you more than me since he talked to the main Pass Labs dealer about the difference. I just know from what I understand is that they are more refined than the older ones.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  23. #23
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    Honestly I would love to sometime hear one of the XA or XS series amps just to see how much more of that Pass love comes out in those amps over mine. As much as I love how mine sounds I would say that the XA or even better the XS amps would be like being in audio heaven. Too bad the XS amps are the price of a Mercedes and I will probably never be able to afford one on a good year not to mention the price of the associated equipment needed to give them their due.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  24. #24
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    A guy on AA had a X250 and upgraded to the X250.5, he made out like it was a pretty good upgrade. At the time I bought my amp the dealer didn't make out like it was a big difference, as I remember he stated the .5's are warmer. To my ears the
    X250 is a really good amp and at the price they are going for used is a no brainer.

  25. #25
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    Wow, Feanor. That is a beautiful piece of gear.

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