Quote Originally Posted by Woochifer
I think it's a very safe assumption based on the build quality alone. Sony has had power supply reliability problems with several of their recent receiver lines. Denon doesn't "hose people" with their products. Their reliability seems to have slipped somewhat with the two ownership changes they've had in the past couple of years, but it's still a cut above Sony and a lot of the other mass market brands. I don't know where you get this "pathetic" and "truly awful" criteria, since to my ears they really don't sound all that different from competing products. That is, unless you apply those labels to ALL receivers, which would be a gross exaggeraton.



That's BS. I doubt you'd be able to name me a single receiver model that increased its price by $200 just to add "one or two features" on a "2cent chip." If the year-to-year changes involve adding a feature or two that comes from a processor chip, then receiver manufacturers DO NOT charge one cent more for their newer models than the previous ones. Competition, technological improvemeents, and established price points in the market do not allow for that, unless a company's intentionally out to lose market share, in which case their shareholders would probably revolt. The OEM processor suppliers do continually add new features to their chips, but they don't increase the prices in order to do that.

The only receiver I'm aware of that recently increased its list price was the Denon AVR-3803, which added $100 over the 3802. And the component price difference just by switching the DACs from Analog Devices to Burr-Brown, which the 3803 did, is already more than $100. (talking about $7 per unit versus $15 per unit, and the 3803 uses 16 of them)
Firstly where do you get these prices for DAC chips. 3 years ago Burr Brown had their price lists and not a single chip for a DAC was over $1.50. None. Their basic chip was around .85 and their top was $1.20 and a number in between. So some middle man is doing very nicely if Denon is Stupid enough to pay $15.00 each for a $1.00 chip...and you can be sure they are not the top of the line because that is for the 2k cd player.

Show me the information you have on Sony QC issues compared to Denon...any statistacal facts of this?

The new models right now you are correct are not raising prices because receiver sales are in the toilet and they have to hold or even drop prices just to sell them. LOL all these tube companies are popping up and biting into sales perhaps.

For receiver makers to re-model and re-tool and come out with a better product for the same price means that they are not in fact improving the equipment because the scost would go UP not down anf if their sales don't increase then their profit margin decreases...they won't let that happen so they are probably cutting a corner somewhere else(which won't show up in the literature of course). It may be something smaller like not paying attention to QC, or whatever.

I personally don't feel the money paid for the 3803 is remotely worth what you get back in terms of sound or build. When it can be equalled or betterred by the competition at 2/3 or 1/2 the price then I will use words like grossly infferior, in terms of value it is and value is totally subjective.