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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02audionoob
I stopped in at this thread just now, wondering what in the world you guys could be talking about with regard to expensive speaker cables at 196 posts. I see now you're not discussing cables...you're discussing the discussion.
When I see that a thread keeps on getting bigger at a fast pace, I just assume there's somekind of argument going on. Most of the time, I can't be bothered to read the whole thing if I havent been following. It just so happens that I have followed this one:)
I do have to say though, I'm getting a little tired of Sir T vs. the rest debates. I want a change of opponents!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio amateur
I want a change of opponents!
Yeah, wouldn't it be fun if Mytrcraft and his crew came back?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio amateur
I do have to say though, I'm getting a little tired of Sir T vs. the rest debates. I want a change of opponents!
What I find truly interesting is that so many people hate (or at least dislike) Sir T to the point that despite him clearly being on the side of the majority of persons in this thread (the $35K Cables are a clear rip-off camp), they are still anxious to attack and evict him....
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyfi
Mytrcraft and crew
Refresh my memory?
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We're almost all just hobbyists, amateurs, newbies or whatever just here for entertainment or maybe to learn a little something from time to time. We also like to help people when they ask for it. We're like anyone else...we don't react well to being told we're stupid. Everyone has their own areas of expertise. For example...Who do you suppose knows more about the inner workings of a computer...the CEO of Hewlett-Packard or some geek at a computer repair shop?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio amateur
Refresh my memory?
Mtry is now an "Audioholics Overlord" :) A self-confessed "ditch digger" and boom-box fancier, Mtry was the librarian of DBT studies he never read. His choppy, comma-spliced writing style was unmistakable. He also had trouble keeping track of what he said during a thread. Here's one example.
He was banned both here and at Audio Asylum. That should tell you something.
rw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ajani
What I find truly interesting is that so many people hate (or at least dislike) Sir T to the point that despite him clearly being on the side of the majority of persons in this thread (the $35K Cables are a clear rip-off camp), they are still anxious to attack and evict him....
If you find that speculation trumps actual exposure, then so be it. There is clearly a case of diminishing returns found here as with many high tech pursuits, but I can tell you that the sonic results of using a similarly priced Nordost Odin must be heard to be believed. Naturally, that was in an exceptional system capable of showing the differences.
rw
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Originally Posted by E-Stat
He also had trouble keeping track of what he said during a thread.
LOL! I'm looking forward to read up on his threads then:)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Stat
If you find that speculation trumps actual exposure, then so be it.
No I don't. That's why I don't have much regard for the typical "all cables sound the same, based on DBT" view.... While I've yet to hear a difference in cables (that was significant enough for me to rule out my imagination as the source), I'm not willing to label anyone who claims to have heard such differences as crazy, etc... I'd rather try it for myself and come to my own conclusions...
Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Stat
There is clearly a case of diminishing returns found here as with many high tech pursuits, but I can tell you that the sonic results of using a similarly priced Nordost Odin must be heard to be believed. Naturally, that was in an exceptional system capable of showing the differences.
rw
Thing is I believe that "diminishing returns" sets in at about the iPod level... That doesn't mean I wouldn't own a system costing 100X as much though... It depends on how much disposable income (not total income - it's not about who makes the most money) I have at the time and whether I think the differences are worth it...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ajani
It depends on how much disposable income (not total income - it's not about who makes the most money) I have at the time and whether I think the differences are worth it...
My commentary as to what is possible with audio gear is independent of cost. It has nothing to do with ownership, status, bragging rights, "pissing contests" or whatever. It is about experiencing that which is possible. The best systems I've heard are not my own. Such has nothing at all to do with appreciating that which can be perceived. I most certainly do not own an IMAX theater, a symphony orchestra, or the Mormon Tabernacle, but each one of those offers perceptual delights.
As for MoTab, I was in SLC last week on a skiing trip. The wife and I went down to Temple Square Thursday evening and attended a practice session with the chorus. The acoustics of that place and the power of the pipe organ with five thirty-two foot stops is breathtaking. There was one piece where both the chorus and the organ are going full tilt and then stop abruptly - with only the reverberation time hanging in the air majestically.
http://home.cablelynx.com/~rhw/audio/motab.jpg
For me, that is what it is all about.
rw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Stat
Mtry is now an "Audioholics Overlord" :) A self-confessed "ditch digger" and boom-box fancier, Mtry was the librarian of DBT studies he never read. His choppy, comma-spliced writing style was unmistakable. He also had trouble keeping track of what he said during a thread. Here's one example.
He was banned both here and at Audio Asylum. That should tell you something.
rw
Yikes, I just realized how long I have been posting at AR. It was somewhere around 1995-96 that I upgraded for the first time, radio shack zip cord and black & reds to Tara Labs Prism Bi-wire speaker and Quantum Interconnects.
Posting my observations and getting slaughtered in no time flat was my first experiences on the Cable board. Mytr had 5 or so disciples that would drop the axe on you if he was not around for an hour or so.
The basic rule of thumb for him and his followers was that if it was not quantifiable in published articles that it was heard in a DBT, then there is no way that our most incredible human ear could possibly hear subtle differences in cables.
Therefor, black & reds along with zip cord are as audibly the same as a $35K pair in a deserving system.
He never would admit or post to what he himself listened to or through and would never mention any cables although he would argue until death they are all the same. Maybe Belkin.
So the conclusions can only be one of two:
He is actually a deaf man who relies on other senses such as reading DBT studies for all backing belief systems.
or
He is almost deaf and believes that a Boom Box sounds identical to any other high end system you can name.
Either way, his hearing is not good enough to hear subtle detail.
There are plenty of blind people who hear things the normal individual does not hear. Not necessarily because they really can't hear it, but because they are just not paying attention, concentrating hard enough or are somehow distracted.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Stat
My commentary as to what is possible with audio gear is independent of cost. It has nothing to do with ownership, status, bragging rights, "pissing contests" or whatever. It is about experiencing that which is possible. The best systems I've heard are not my own. Such has nothing at all to do with appreciating that which can be perceived. I most certainly do not own an IMAX theater, a symphony orchestra, or the Mormon Tabernacle, but each one of those offers perceptual delights.
As for MoTab, I was in SLC last week on a skiing trip. The wife and I went down to Temple Square Thursday evening and attended a practice session with the chorus. The acoustics of that place and the power of the pipe organ with five thirty-two foot stops is breathtaking. There was one piece where both the chorus and the organ are going full tilt and then stop abruptly - with only the reverberation time hanging in the air majestically.
http://home.cablelynx.com/~rhw/audio/motab.jpg
For me, that is what it is all about.
rw
Very well said... we should be able to appreciate gear, regardless of the cost... Now whether we think it is 'worth' the money is a different issue...
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I never was a huge fan of mrtycraps (as I used to call him) because while I do value the DBT for my own purposes, I see no value in telling other people what they hear. Problem was, if I stae that I heard no difference twix a $30 set of cable and a $300 dollar set of cables (during a DBT that was conducted over 10 years ago) then some golden ear would come along and tell that "of course, there is no diff twix a $30 and $300 set of cables, because they're so close in price range" or "then the equipment they were using was suspect" and my fave was, "your equipment is so low-fi, I wouldn't waste $30 on a set of cables for it". I think that's why Mrtycrafts use a boombox for an analogy...I doubt he even owned one. I think both sides of the debate is guilty of righteous indignation.
I just finally realized one day I'd rather listen to music, not gear. There is no holy grail.
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Ooohhh...I just hate it when someone posts a picture so large the page width goes off my screen.
:mad:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3LB
I think that's why Mrtycrafts use a boombox for an analogy...I doubt he even owned one.
It's "Mtry" which is an abbreviation for Monterrey. You are mistaken about the boom boxes. Here they are along with his HT system.
rw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Stat
If you find that speculation trumps actual exposure, then so be it.
rw
See, this is where you are wrong. You are making assumptions that I have not been exposed to the cables you mentioned. I have heard the entire line of Nordost speaker cable and interconnects both analog and digital when I was building my studio. As I said previously, I listen first, then make comments.
As I have said before, you are not the only one exposed to high end stuff around here. You are the only person that obsesses on it
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02audionoob
Ooohhh...I just hate it when someone posts a picture so large the page width goes off my screen.
Sorry. I resized the original 1600 x 1200 image down to 1024 x 768. Are you using an 800 x 600 VGA monitor?
rw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
See, this is where you are wrong. You are making assumptions that I have not been exposed to the cables you mentioned. I have heard the entire line of Nordost speaker cable and interconnects both analog and digital when I was building my studio.
So, tell us what you find about each of the fourteen models and on what system you decided to listen to that many speaker cables on. Don't tell me, don't tell me - it's none of your business. Credibility=zero. :)
rw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Stat
Sorry. I resized the original 1600 x 1200 image down to 1024 x 768. Are you using an 800 x 600 VGA monitor?
rw
Hey...thanks. I use a 1280 x 1024 monitor, so a 1024 image width doesn't push the thread off my screen.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Stat
So, tell us what you find about each of the fourteen models and on what system you decided to listen to that many speaker cables on. Don't tell me, don't tell me - it's none of your business. Credibility=zero. :)
rw
Now you must know by now that having Credibility=zero in your eyes means absolutely nothing to me. You gotta know this.......
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
Now you must know by now that having Credibility=zero in your eyes means absolutely nothing to me. You gotta know this.......
Absolutely. With video topics, you actually provide legitimate examples and compelling evidence that I truly appreciate. Your audio advice, on the other hand, is useless. Especially when you make inept, sweeping statements like you did in the last post which makes no sense. As for me, I've only auditioned two particular Nordost cables at length in a known system (Valhalla and Odin) and own neither. Only a fool would take the time to burn in and evaluate fourteen different cables in their system - if that is truly what you did. Or should have done if you were seriously looking for high performance cabling. I would have thought you were smarter and valued your time more.
rw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E-Stat
It's "Mtry" which is an abbreviation for Monterrey. You are mistaken about the boom boxes. Here they are along with his HT system.
rw
I think I used to own that one boombox...it had a built-in "sub" (dedicated 4" bass speaker) or at least mine did. It was a great little unit until it got knocked off some scaffolding on the concrete floor :frown2:
I knew about the Mtry thing but sometimes I called him Marty for shits-n-grins
one of his tagteam partners here had those humongous Infinity speakers with the 4 open-baffled 15" woofers per speaker. I forget his name...nice guy though
You know, there's something to be said for owning multiple systems. I have four currently, all different approaches. I build my own speakers (two-ways, three-ways and single driver concept). I've attempted some "special" cables - I followed the directions to a tee (from a Stereophile article) but they were so suseptable to radio interference I tossed them. I own one of those cool little Super-T amps that I bought. I don't have the soldering equipment or skill required to build my own amps but I do hope to rectify that soon. I like going from system to system, listening to music on each one brings out something different each time, especially the single driver speakers. I use regular old lamp cord for the internal wiring and they've measured rather well. I've won first and second place in speaker contests with some of my entries using some rather inexpensive drivers (sound only - judges could not see what they were listening to). I love listening to high end systems but I'm not remiss for not owning one. I scoffed at the $35K cables but I do realize that audiophilia has its place - its the reason why technology advances in most cases. If rich guys didn't spend $1500 on the first genration CD players, then the manufacturors may have never made $150 ones for the masses. Same with cables. Once upon a time, $35 dollars got some really crappy cables, not just sound-wise, but fit and finish as well - these things couldn't be moved too much before they developed shorts or breaks and made better AM antennas than they did cables. Nowadays $20 will buy you a lot sturdier set of cables, with shielded casings and higher quality materials all around - these are the cables that used to cost over $100 from Monster or some brand like that 20 years ago. I know I know, prolly has a lot more to do with slave labor. Hopefully, the guys building the $35K cables will give their employees a hell of a benefits package.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio amateur
Refresh my memory?
Here is a typical link which if I didn't know better I would have thought it was from here but in 1995.
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums...ad.php?t=37657
If it is not published from a DBT, it does not exist.
Get it?
Got it?
Good!:cryin:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyfi
I already feel like wringing his neck.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audio amateur
I already feel like wringing his neck.
It's too funny since that recent post looks no different than what happened here back in 1995.
We should all go over there and mess with him for some fun even though it will turn out just the same.
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