• 08-26-2006, 09:24 PM
    punkrokr1701
    I need input on my speaker design plans.
    Ok, I'm kinda new at this but I'm planning to build my own set of speaker cabinets. I'm planning at putting two 12" subwoofers, two 12" inch woofers, two 6" mid bass drivers, and three 3 3/4" titanium tweeters in each cabinet. Ambitous, yes, but I'm only 14 so why not.

    Anyway, these are the parts I'm looking at using to build my cabinets.

    Hifonics Brutus subwoofers rated 600 watts rms / 1200 watts peak and they come in 2 ohm and 4 ohm versions.
    Pyle PYM1298 woofers rated 600 watts rms / 1200 watts peak at 8 ohm.
    Pyle PDMW6 mid bass drivers rated 125 watts rms / 250 watts peak at 8 ohm.
    And Pyle PDBT18 titanium tweeters rated 200 watts rms / 400 watts peak at 4 to 8 ohm.

    Now these ratings are per speaker and they are only what the companies that make them claim. Totaled each cab would have a rating of 2900 watts rms / 6100 watts peak.

    As for powering these beasts I was thinking about installing two DJ power amplifiers on each cabinet. I'm looking at some Gli Pro amplifiers that claim a 4000 watt rating each which I seriously doubt at a price of $250 each. But assuming they are no good I was also eyeballing a set of Pyle DJ amps that seem more realistic with an output rating of 3000 watts each at $350 apiece.

    Now I know there are audio addicts out there that know all of this stuff like the back of their hand and know about these brands and their reputation so that's why I put up the companies name and model #. I'd like to know about what these parts are actually about if they really are a steal or if I'm gonna be pissed when they turn out to be an expensive pile of junk.
    And if you know of anything better or have any suggestions as to what I should buy please let me know.For example would I'd be better off getting the 2 ohm or 4 ohm version of the sub. I figure the 4 ohm sub is what I should get.

    Also, I'm also wondering if I could just use a DJ crossover for my cabs and if so would I need one or two and if a Behringer CX2310 3 way mono crossover would work for me.

    Also would I need anything else to set up my cabs besides the terminals, wiring, and ports?

    Any input will help me out but keep in mind I'm not looking at spending anything more than $2500 on this. If I didn't give enough info sorry, like I said I'm new at this.

    I want these speakers to blow anything my friends got out of the water and the reason I'm using car audio brands is because it's much cheaper and I'm lookin for power more than sound qaulity.

    Thanx.
  • 08-27-2006, 05:33 AM
    jtgofish
    For home use you should try to use 8 ohm speakers.Many amplifiers will die trying to drive low impedence woofers.
    If you wire 4ohm speakers in parallel[2 ohm]you are really asking for trouble.

    More is usually not better.

    Why not look at kit speakers.Look at Madisound for example.
    You cannot just cobble speakers together and hope they will work as a whole.And forget about power ratings.This only indicates the power they can handle-not how loud they go.
    100 watts into most speakers will give all the loudness you could ever need-especially if they are sensitive.
  • 08-27-2006, 07:19 AM
    N. Abstentia
    I think before you start this (by the way I think it's great you want to build your own speakers...that's how I got started!) you need to learn some basic acoustic priciples. Start with impedances and actual power ratings for speakers. Those power ratings are rediculously high, almost to the point of being comical.

    You'll also find out that car speakers don't work so well in the house. Also, it's not a good idea to put subwoofers in the same cabinets as the rest of the speakers.

    Sounds like a neat project, I'm just not sure if I would use car speakers. Check out www.partsexpess.com for better speakers to use.
  • 08-27-2006, 08:40 AM
    punkrokr1701
    Well, I have gonna over the basics of speakers, impedance, sensitivity and all that and actually the only car audio related item I looking at is the subwoofers. The tweeters, woofers, and mid bass drivers are all 8 ohm. And all the speakers, besides the subwoofers have a sensitivity rating at or above 100db so they are pretty loud.
    And I plan to seperate the subwoofers from the rest of the cabinet so they don't add stress to the rest of the speakers.
  • 08-27-2006, 12:11 PM
    jocko_nc
    Like someone else said, more is not necessarily better...

    Quality drivers. Quality crossover. Proper design. Anything else is just piling on. On the other hand, I'm sure it would be loud.

    jocko
  • 08-27-2006, 04:14 PM
    N. Abstentia
    Yeah I guess you need to figure out exactly what you're trying to accomplish.

    Do you want loud, or do you want good? If you want loud, knock yourself out. If you want good, I can destroy that setup with a pair of 6" woofers, a pair of tweeters, and a 12" powered sub :)
  • 08-27-2006, 05:36 PM
    audio_dude
    LOL

    why not build a 3-way design?

    4x12" woofer? are you mad? those things will be absolutly massive! almost as big as Flo's apogee grands!!!

    my advice, take a look at Cerwin-Vega, or for that matter any 3-way from the 70's or 80's, put in a tweeter, midrange, and a 12" woofer driver.
  • 08-27-2006, 05:59 PM
    punkrokr1701
    What I'm trying to accomplish is enough bass power to rock the house in two and a set of cabinets that looks monsterous.
    And right now I'm not interested in any thing else. But in the future I probably will build a set of smaller speakers with more quality parts for better sound.
  • 08-28-2006, 06:52 AM
    jocko_nc
    If you want loud, I'd look at pro audio components. That is basically what you will be building, a PA rig like a band would use. If you haven't found them yet, go to partsexpress.com for all the hardware, etc. I'd buy drivers from them, too. Make sure your driver selections have enough mid output. Good pro audio drivers will have a wide frequenct range.

    One point. As big as these things will be, you will want to cover with vinyl of carpet. I would not want to try to paint or veneer such a thing.

    One other point. Use plywood versus MDF. It is stronger and a lot lighter.

    Oh yea. Please don't move next door to me...

    jocko
  • 08-28-2006, 08:24 AM
    audio_dude
    oh well, but don't put three friggin tweeters in the thing, maybe try this:

    2 tweeters, 2 midranges and 1 woofer, and 1 subwoofer

    PS: you might want to post something on the DIY page too...
  • 08-28-2006, 08:39 AM
    Feanor
    Like others have said ...
    Bigger is not necessarily better, although it might be louder. :biggrin5:

    But to get down to your case, a single cabinet per side is grossly impractical I would say. First, there is now practical way, (for an amateur at least), to design the single cabinet that will accomodate both the 12" woofers and the subwoofers -- they will have conflicting requirements. Secondly the cabinet is likely to be very large which means not only too difficult to build, but also difficult or impossible to move if you should ever hope to do so. At least build two separate cabinets for the subs and the other components. The 6" mids will need their own sub-enclosure too.
  • 08-28-2006, 09:14 AM
    audio_dude
    like i said, go SIMPLE!!!

    get a nice huge bass driver, a midrange and a tweeter, you can rock the house, be able to move them... and it might produce something resembling "music"
  • 08-28-2006, 11:36 AM
    noddin0ff
  • 08-28-2006, 11:58 AM
    poneal
    If you want loud with quality then try these
    http://home.stx.rr.com/poneal/pdfs/Rs225MDM5522TAFg.pdf

    Around 90db efficient and full range. I drive them with a 250wpc pro Yamaha amp and it can take it all with flinching :) as long as the signal is clean.
  • 08-28-2006, 01:50 PM
    JoeE SP9
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by punkrokr1701
    What I'm trying to accomplish is enough bass power to rock the house in two and a set of cabinets that looks monsterous.
    And right now I'm not interested in any thing else. But in the future I probably will build a set of smaller speakers with more quality parts for better sound.

    Why would you ask for advice if you're not going to take it. If you want a system as loud and horrible as the ones that have four wheels asking here was a waste of time. This site is about what Cerwin Vega claims they are. Loud is good is long as it's clean and clear. What you are proposing is neither of those. :ihih:
  • 08-28-2006, 02:30 PM
    audio_dude
    LOL

    the number one rule of speaker building for amatures: K>I>S>S : KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID!!!
  • 08-28-2006, 02:30 PM
    jrhymeammo
    If you desire to out-do/one up on your friends' speakers by Size and SPL, you oshould consider JBL Pro series and others that are comparable. There are many options for you. You can get a dual 18" subs for around $800 each or get two 18" subs for around $500 each for each channel. Or maybe have'em all in a same cabinet with a set of massive stands. Somem like these http://www.musiciansbuy.com/JBL_SRX7...ee_SRX738.html

    http://www.samedaymusic.com/product--MACSA1532Z

    Powered/Active monitors might be the way for you.

    I understand that you wanna blow away the entire neighborhood. That sounds like soooooo much fun since I do not live anywhere near you. What is the size of room your speakers will be pumping in?
  • 08-28-2006, 04:11 PM
    hermanv
    OK so how loud is loud? Speakers are almost always rated as xx dB per watt at 1 meter.

    Take an example, many speakers are rated at 87dB/watt. Now loudness doubles for each 3 dB you add. So, 115 dB is damn loud (jet plane at 50 feet) but you're young and a little crazy so why not go for 118dB (twice as loud)? ps. You will be stone deaf after a few hours.

    So that is 31 dB above 1 watt or 1250 watts, please understand that in spite of advertising claims there is no such thing as a 12" speaker that can actually dissapate 1250 watts (think of one of those 1000 watt electric room heaters. Where would that much heat go? The voice coil is much smaller than that room heater heating element and there's no fan, have you ever seen a speaker glow red?

    You are caught in a haze of numbers, heaped on by car audio makers who alway strech the truth past imagining. Before you invest time and money learn more. You can ask here or on other sites.

    Even if you build it, you will find that showing off looses interest of everyone involved in a matter of minutes. And no, the women will be impressed least of all.
  • 08-28-2006, 04:27 PM
    PHiX
    You're 14 and have $2500 to spend on building home made crappy but noisy neighbor bullies? Damn... when I was at that age buying a Nintendo game was a big expenditure. Teenagers are really getting spoiled these days.


    While it's an insane amount of money to spend at such a young age, it just proves that teenagers dont have any rational logic in spending it, since you end up with garbage while you could get something great for that amount.


    If you'd be my son I'd cancel your weekly allowance right away. :p


    Get two of these if loud is what you want. Insert one end in each ear canal and just rock.

    http://www.biglrentals.com/images/jackhammer.jpg
  • 08-28-2006, 07:14 PM
    SlumpBuster
    At $2500 and only 14, get one of these. You can thank me later. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1985-...QQcmdZViewItem
  • 08-28-2006, 07:24 PM
    punkrokr1701
    Lol,
    I for one agree that the ladies would consider it worthless racket, but my girlfriend thinks it's an awesome idea and completely backs me up in this, matter of fact she's actually offering to help me with them. What are the odds?

    Well, I guess I was being stubborn about this. Thanx for the input though. What I think I'll do is go a pro audio store and find exactly what I'm looking for as far as sound. An like you said bigger isn't always better so I'm gonna down size and start simple being I'm only a newbie at this stuff.

    I think I'm gonna find a 15" subwoofer with tone put in in a ported side firing design a the base of each cabinet. Then I think I'll pair up two 10" woofers, and top it off with a powerul mid-range and and titanium tweeter. So for now I'm going to check out the Buttkicker tactical transducers at the pro audio store and probably install one of those babies in "my" personal recliner for that shake I'm looking for.

    I guess this way I'll have some experience before I rush into building a gaint pair of cabinets that are I've blueprinted to be almost 7ft tall and find myself stumped with a half built pair of 300lb speakers.

    But don't think I'm not gonna build them.Like I said I will continue on with plans but first I think it'll be a little wise to start out smaller so I'll have so I'll know what I'm doing when I tackle this project.

    And, just for the record I hardly ever turn my current system up past - 20db with music, and -10db for movies so I'm not as concerned about SPL ratings I just want something that is gonna bump hard.

    And the reason I was looking for bass power more than than something that sounds good is because my current system is a pair of 80's syle Sony 240 watt 3- ways for the rear, two newer Panasonic 3-ways from my first radio on the side, a 5" 160 watt powered subwoofer, and a pair of Skyline AD-900SL Denmark Series Professional Loudspeakers leading my system, which I got for $400 for the pair, a steal compared to their $1800 retail a peice. I power his with a Denon 7.1 channel A/V reciever which feeds 130 watts per channel. So I've got plenty of quality sound in my system, now I just want some power behind it.

    Like I said I'm gonna build the 7ft cabinets,
    as soon as I have more understanding of how to process works.
  • 08-28-2006, 07:27 PM
    punkrokr1701
    Oh and I earned every bit of the $2500 myself from working my ass off in the blistering heat, so I damn well deserve to spend this money how I like.
  • 08-28-2006, 07:29 PM
    punkrokr1701
    And SlumpBuster I already have my own car, it's a black 65 Mustang Fastback with a 392 and an E2 bodtkit.

    Which I also earned myself. :)
  • 08-28-2006, 07:46 PM
    bubslewis
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by punkrokr1701
    Oh and I earned every bit of the $2500 myself from working my ass off in the blistering heat, so I damn well deserve to spend this money how I like.


    You tell em' punkrokr. Just cause some of these guys are old enough to be your grandfather doesn't mean they should act like one.

    On the other hand..... I'm old enough to be your grandfather also. I've never built a speaker myself before, but from the description you gave in your original post, I'd offer this advice - Get all the info you can on what you want to do from as many sources as possible. Do this BEFORE you go out and spend your hard earned $$$.
  • 08-29-2006, 07:14 AM
    JoeE SP9
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by punkrokr1701
    And SlumpBuster I already have my own car, it's a black 65 Mustang Fastback with a 392 and an E2 bodtkit.

    Which I also earned myself. :)

    When was the engine changed?:sleep: