• 01-27-2004, 01:54 AM
    CaymanCroc
    Enjoyed my speakers when i got them - BUT now they sound too bright for my liking!
    Hi,

    I have Wharfedale Pacific Evo-30 fronts, which im using with a Marantz SR6200 AV Receiver, and a NAD C541 CD Player. I have monster cable interconnects and speaker cables (Thick SOBs!).

    I enjoyed my speakers when i got them, but off late i found the tonality too bright. Ive tried moving them closer to the wall but the sound is the same. Anyone got any suggestions? Im willing to do anything!!! Help!

    Thanks,
    CaymanCroc
  • 01-27-2004, 06:26 AM
    Bryan
    Have you tried adjusting the treble any? May want to lower it a notch or two.
  • 01-27-2004, 06:41 AM
    CaymanCroc
    That dont work!
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Bryan
    Have you tried adjusting the treble any? May want to lower it a notch or two.

    Hey Bryan,

    Yea ive tried that, but that messes up the mids as well. AND i use the Source Direct function on the receiver, for a clearer sound. It pumps up the bass a notch and the vocals are a lot clearer, but the tone controls dont work in SDirect mode.

    Got any ideas?
  • 01-27-2004, 09:31 AM
    TinHere
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by CaymanCroc
    Hey Bryan,

    Yea ive tried that, but that messes up the mids as well. AND i use the Source Direct function on the receiver, for a clearer sound. It pumps up the bass a notch and the vocals are a lot clearer, but the tone controls dont work in SDirect mode.

    Got any ideas?

    Check on DIY boards. Maybe adding a resistor will tame them to your liking.

    Good luck.
  • 01-27-2004, 09:55 AM
    bturk667
    Probably should have kept looking around for some speakers that better suited you ears. Best suggestion is to get rid of them. This time go out and do a lot of listening before you choose.
    You did say anything, didn't you?
  • 01-27-2004, 10:54 AM
    topspeed
    Check your room
    When you auditioned the Wharfedale's, they were probably in a well damped room. Your fatigue could be coming from an overly "bright" room, and I don't mean lighting. If you have lots of glass, tile, hardwood, etc. you could be experiencing lots of first and second order reflections. Try taming the room with some wall, floor, and/or ceiling treatments. Woochifer seems to be pretty knowlegeable about this stuff so I'd advise you ask him. How a room interacts with a room is critical. Try it out and see if it helps, otherwise you'd better get acquainted with Audiogon and Ebay because a fatiguing speaker is pretty much a paperweight in my book.

    Good Luck
  • 01-27-2004, 12:08 PM
    Woochifer
    Many many ways to take the harsh edge off a pair of speakers, and the most effective ones I've tried deal with room acoustics. If you have a very live sounding room with lots of reflective surfaces, then even a neutral sounding speaker can sound harsh and bright. To roughly check whether your room is overly live sounding, just stand up and clap hard. If you hear reverberation and echo, then your room's the culprit. Simple ways to reduce this "slap echo" include hanging wall tapestries, thick rugs, cushy furniture, bookcases along the side or backwalls, etc. The fewer flat reflective surfaces you got in your room, the better. More advanced ways of taming a room include lining up acoustic panels or foam behind the speakers, along the side walls (position them by sitting at your listening position and have someone hold a mirror along a wall -- where you see the tweeter is where you should position a piece of sound absorbing material because that's the reflection point), and even overhead. Things like diffusers in the back of the room or sidewalls also work -- diffusers can be something as simple as a bookcase with lots of books of different sizes.
  • 01-27-2004, 12:12 PM
    Woochifer
    Many many ways to take the harsh edge off a pair of speakers, and the most effective ones I've tried deal with room acoustics. If you have a very live sounding room with lots of reflective surfaces, then even a neutral sounding speaker can sound harsh and bright. To roughly check whether your room is overly live sounding, just stand up and clap hard. If you hear reverberation and echo, then your room's the culprit. Simple ways to reduce this "slap echo" include hanging wall tapestries, thick rugs, cushy furniture, bookcases along the side or backwalls, etc. The fewer flat reflective surfaces you got in your room, the better. More advanced ways of taming a room include lining up acoustic panels or foam behind the speakers, along the side walls (position them by sitting at your listening position and have someone hold a mirror along a wall -- where you see the tweeter is where you should position a piece of sound absorbing material because that's the reflection point), and even overhead. Things like diffusers in the back of the room or sidewalls also work -- diffusers can be something as simple as a bookcase with lots of books of different sizes. Some links are posted below.

    http://forums14.consumerreview.com/c...P.2@.ef9ccd3/0
  • 01-27-2004, 03:37 PM
    Geoffcin
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by CaymanCroc
    Hi,

    I have Wharfedale Pacific Evo-30 fronts, which im using with a Marantz SR6200 AV Receiver, and a NAD C541 CD Player. I have monster cable interconnects and speaker cables (Thick SOBs!).

    I enjoyed my speakers when i got them, but off late i found the tonality too bright. Ive tried moving them closer to the wall but the sound is the same. Anyone got any suggestions? Im willing to do anything!!! Help!

    Thanks,
    CaymanCroc

    Easiest and cheapest way to tame shrillness is damping the floor in front of your speakers. A lot of the shrillness people hear is coming from the first refection off the floor, it can also mess up your soundstage a lot. You can try a throw rug, or a friend of mine uses industrial carpet tiles to great effect.
  • 01-28-2004, 03:02 AM
    CaymanCroc
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Woochifer
    Many many ways to take the harsh edge off a pair of speakers, and the most effective ones I've tried deal with room acoustics. If you have a very live sounding room with lots of reflective surfaces, then even a neutral sounding speaker can sound harsh and bright. To roughly check whether your room is overly live sounding, just stand up and clap hard. If you hear reverberation and echo, then your room's the culprit. Simple ways to reduce this "slap echo" include hanging wall tapestries, thick rugs, cushy furniture, bookcases along the side or backwalls, etc. The fewer flat reflective surfaces you got in your room, the better. More advanced ways of taming a room include lining up acoustic panels or foam behind the speakers, along the side walls (position them by sitting at your listening position and have someone hold a mirror along a wall -- where you see the tweeter is where you should position a piece of sound absorbing material because that's the reflection point), and even overhead. Things like diffusers in the back of the room or sidewalls also work -- diffusers can be something as simple as a bookcase with lots of books of different sizes. Some links are posted below.

    http://forums14.consumerreview.com/c...P.2@.ef9ccd3/0



    Thanks Woochifer!

    Ive just spent the last 3 hrs, repositioning my speakers, putting a huge rug across the room, and basically moving everything around in my room.... The speakers were approx 20 - 25 feet apart, and ive brought them closer to about 8 feet apart. I sit approx 12 feet away with them toed-in to the listening posn. That coupled with the rug has sure helped improve the sound and has dramatically reduced the harshness. The sound is more smooth (like a good scotch!) and "real", just the way i like it. And ive draped a thick flag print towel (theyre a bunch of ferrari f1 flags, so i dont mind it!) on the wall behind each speaker.

    Though the room looks a mess, its sure worth it.. for now anyway. I have been bedridden for the past 2 months and this was (against doctors orders!) the most exhausting thing ive done yet.... well worth it though.

    Cheers!
  • 01-28-2004, 05:21 AM
    skeptic
    I'm curious. Did your dissatisfaction with these speakers happen as soon as you got them home or did it develop over time? Was it gradual or sudden? Do you think the sound changed or that your attitude towards them changed or both? If their sound changed, do you think the changes were the result of a so called "breaking in" process? Did you originally hear demos in a store before you decided to buy this model? If so do you think yours sound different than the demos did? As I said in another posting, I think some manufacturers deliberately make their speakers call attention to themselves (being on the bright side is one way) in order to attract the attention of customers when they are rapidly comparing different models in a sales demo room.
  • 01-28-2004, 06:03 AM
    CaymanCroc
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by skeptic
    I'm curious. Did your dissatisfaction with these speakers happen as soon as you got them home or did it develop over time? Was it gradual or sudden? Do you think the sound changed or that your attitude towards them changed or both? If their sound changed, do you think the changes were the result of a so called "breaking in" process? Did you originally hear demos in a store before you decided to buy this model? If so do you think yours sound different than the demos did? As I said in another posting, I think some manufacturers deliberately make their speakers call attention to themselves (being on the bright side is one way) in order to attract the attention of customers when they are rapidly comparing different models in a sales demo room.


    I loved the speakers at the store (Listened to Mark Knopflers Golden Heart, sounded great!) and i was hooked, got rid of my JBL LX2005s and picked these up. Ofcourse the acoustics in the demo room were way better than anything i could achieve in my room (ive got marble floor and full glass windows on two sides! and not to mention my room is odd shaped with the speakers running on the long wall ... both in corners! and firing into two walls on opposite sides, between which in a "niche" approx 10ft wide and 4ft deep is the sofa where i sit.. hard to explain!).

    Initially, i was hooked because of three factors (1) They sounded better than the JBLs (2) The salesman is a friend of mine plus it came highly recommended by a more experienced audiophile friend (victim of the power of suggestion u think? maybe..) (3) They Look FANTASTIC ! Piano Gloss Black finish sure is excellent.

    I guess as my taste matured and i was over the initial excitement of picking them up i began to notice that the highs were ... well a bit toooo harsh. After about 50 Hrs of playing, the bass had improved though and the imaging is pretty good too.... But oh Lord the treble was unbearable at times!

    Today ive moved them closer together (8ft apart approx), and they fire directly into the "niche". Theyre out of the corner they were in and ive added a rug (see prev thread) ... im much happier with the sound.... have been listening for 6 hrs now!

    Sooo i guess to answer your question, i think that the better acoustics of demo rooms, coupled with better matching equipment (heard it on audio analogue cd player and amp) plus i was too "virgin" to know what i was looking for, made me pick em up. But im very happy with the sound for now..

    PLUS in my case, living in India, its very hard to go to a one stop shop to try out various brands, ie for JBL u go to JBL, for Wharfe to a Wharfe dealer.. .etc etc....


    I hope ive been clear... sorry am pretty tired out now....
  • 01-28-2004, 07:06 AM
    Worf101
    Wooch and Skeptic helped me out as well...
    I had the same problem recently and I did all the same things you didn except putting a new rug down. It really, really helped. The wall hangings, speaker positioning, toeing in etc... did wonders. I almost like these speakers now.

    Da Worfster :D
  • 01-28-2004, 08:14 AM
    CaymanCroc
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Worf101
    I had the same problem recently and I did all the same things you didn except putting a new rug down. It really, really helped. The wall hangings, speaker positioning, toeing in etc... did wonders. I almost like these speakers now.

    Da Worfster :D

    Tell me about it Worf! Its 9:45pm now, been listening since 1:30pm!!
  • 01-29-2004, 05:41 PM
    Willow
    order the polk audio guide online and voila !! it's all explained how to do it your 1rst and 2nd spot too
  • 01-29-2004, 09:47 PM
    CaymanCroc
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Willow
    order the polk audio guide online and voila !! it's all explained how to do it your 1rst and 2nd spot too

    Thanks, tried finding it at the polk website .... but no luck...

    Sure would help if you could paste a link... thanks.
  • 01-29-2004, 10:36 PM
    RGA
    Well it sounds like one of the big problems was the room and the fact you had them 20feet apart. I have maybe the best Wharfedale speakers the company has made and they recommend 10 feet apart. I have never had a problem with treble despite the fact they're a horn design. But I have always had fully carpeted rooms and fairly thick furnature and a lot of it. The only series I have heard that really dissapointed me from Wharfedale was the Modus line. Their new Opus series looks like it might be a winner as well. Interesting spec on the Opus 3 from 30hz to 44khz from a soft dome tweeter. It looks nice to boot.

    This is Mission's Sister company and Quad falls under the umbrella as well - so they should know what end is up. The Diamond Series has been very solid since the 1980s.
  • 01-30-2004, 12:08 AM
    CaymanCroc
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by RGA
    Well it sounds like one of the big problems was the room and the fact you had them 20feet apart. I have maybe the best Wharfedale speakers the company has made and they recommend 10 feet apart. I have never had a problem with treble despite the fact they're a horn design. But I have always had fully carpeted rooms and fairly thick furnature and a lot of it. The only series I have heard that really dissapointed me from Wharfedale was the Modus line. Their new Opus series looks like it might be a winner as well. Interesting spec on the Opus 3 from 30hz to 44khz from a soft dome tweeter. It looks nice to boot.

    This is Mission's Sister company and Quad falls under the umbrella as well - so they should know what end is up. The Diamond Series has been very solid since the 1980s.

    Yessir, guess i just placed them at the most convenient place i could find... I had to get rid of a nice sofa and move around a lot of furniture, but theyre in a better position now and sound more like when i heard them at the demo room... though i think i remember them having more bass ..... I am gonna go back to the store and have a listen once im well.
  • 01-30-2004, 02:17 AM
    maxg
    Cayman,

    The problem you have experienced is one I face every year. I live in Greece and my house also has solid floors. Each winter we put rugs down on the floor and the sound from my system is wonderful. Each summer the rugs are taken away for storage and cleaning and the sound quality drops like a stone.

    The only summer solution that I have found is to hang washing on a clothes horse in the living room when I want to listen. This, as you can imagine, is not a popular solution with the wife!!

    Strangely positioning of the clothes horse does not seem to matter too much. Stranger still with the washing - the wetter the better - not sure why.