Have women... in the West at least... "Flipped the Script?"

[Worf101]

The evidence is mounting as we speak. Girls and women doing better in college all across the boards. Doing better in business than many of their male compatriots... Inching ever closer to the true seats of power in this country and the western world. I believe that in my son's lifetime for sure, women will supplant men as primary breadwinner in a mojority os American families and men will be relegated to the roles of providing semen, taking care of the kids and cars and mowing the lawn.

There's a scene in "Orange is the New Black" second season, where Piper's ex-fiance gets set up on a blind date by his parents. The women is in her early 30's, a neuro-surgeon and drop dead gorgeous. She's remarks on how much she likes Piper's ex because "he has nothing going on", he's worthless. She's tired of talking to men who think their blogs constitute real work. She made it plain that she wanted to marry him so they could have pretty children which he would take care of while she did the heavy lifting..

Looking at my son's feeble attempts at gaining an education and more than minimum wage employment (and he's had every advantage I NEVER had trust me) I believe that woman writing the series is quite prophetic. I keep using the term "western world" because in the remainder of the world, particularly in the middle east, men are attempting to maintain what shred of dominance they have by force and terror alone. You know the empire is dead when it is only held together by force. Women don't need men anymore. They don't need us to feed them, clothe them, protect them. They don't need us to marry them or father their children science has handled that quite nicely. Companionship, arm candy and an occasional romp in the hay is about all men in America will be good for if things keep going the way their going. Men will have to keep themselves in shape, learn how to cook, clean and take care of the children lest they wind up working or under achieving at some middling job with no hope for advancement or fulfillment. No I believe the writer Ms. Kenji Kohan is definately on to somthing here... I just wish I knew where it will lead.

Worf

[JohnMichael]

Well men have been screwing things up long enough so it is time for woman to take their turn. My mother raised four children with the bare minimum of assistance from bio-dad. I grew up without any doubt as to what women were capable of doing. I do not see this as a great social change as I do doors being opened for women. They were held back for so long that now they are taking full advantage. Many years a woman's choice of employment was as a teacher or nurse.

I know a lot of very afraid and confused men. Caring for the elderly I find many white men who resent the world becoming fairer for minorities and women. They are not used to less than top dog status. Change is inevitable and I like the direction the world is going. Hell I might even get rights one day.

[Feanor]

I think its a trend for sure: more women in the professions, management, and politics. (Our current provincial premier -- sorta like governor, dudes -- is a female and gay to boot.)

My personal observation of working women was in large life insurance companies. When I first starting working summer jobs in one, many, many years ago, women managers were about as rare a hens' teeth; today they are possibly the majority up to the middle management level at least.

I think women -- on average -- have certain qualities vs. men that are advantageous in these large bureaucratic or quasi-bureaucratic organizations. I won't speculate whether this is genetic or cultural. In any case I think women are more cooperative, more perseverent, more patient, more meticulous, more conflict averse, and less competitive in a counter-productive way, than men.

I'd say there are still fewer women in top management but this will change. Or at least that's my guess: some might say that men are more creative and/or risk-tolerant but that's probably just residual male chauvinism.

[Hyfi]

Where I work, almost all of the Director and similar positions are held by women. Sort of cliquish tho as they all seem to promote and support each other over the guys.

[Feanor]

Where I work, almost all of the Director and similar positions are held by women. Sort of cliquish tho as they all seem to promote and support each other over the guys.

That was my observation too. Definitely cliquish as you say. I don't know whether they were actually discriminatory but it seemed that way at times.

But I had a number of female bosses and never had a particular problem. I liked some better than other of course, but the very best boss I ever had was a woman.

[ForeverAutumn]

Where I work, almost all of the Director and similar positions are held by women. Sort of cliquish tho as they all seem to promote and support each other over the guys.

That goes both ways though. As a woman, I've seen too many companies where the top dogs were all men and the "old boys club" rang strong and true. Including the company that I currently work for.

The top three positions are men. They are the only men in the (small) company. Our CEO is likely to retire in a couple of years and one of the remaining men will be promoted to his position. Will a woman be promoted to replace the empty position (I'm actually next in line)? Or will another man be brought in from outside to take that spot?...time will tell.

[ForeverAutumn]

Women don't need men anymore. They don't need us to feed them, clothe them, protect them. They don't need us to marry them or father their children science has handled that quite nicely.

Women never needed men. That's a fallacy that men invented to keep women subservient. My mother-in-law divorced her husband in the early 1960's when she had four children, all under the age of 6. Life was not easy for her, but she worked hard and raised her children alone. They grew up to be productive, good people. She didn't need a husband to have a successful life. In my mind, she is a remarkable woman who is living proof of what a woman can accomplish on her own (I should tell her that).

Worf, I understand the point that you are trying to make and it's a very good one, don't get me wrong. But that women ever "needed" men is a myth. The only thing holding women back, in the past and now, were laws that made women nothing more than property of a man (past in the western world, present elsewhere in the world) and a society that does not value women as much as it values men (now).

Western society and culture has come a long, long way in changing the way women are viewed. But there is still a long way to go.

When it is no longer news-worthy that the Premier of Ontario is a gay woman, I will know we have arrived.

[Hyfi]

That goes both ways though. As a woman, I've seen too many companies where the top dogs were all men and the "old boys club" rang strong and true. Including the company that I currently work for.

The top three positions are men. They are the only men in the (small) company. Our CEO is likely to retire in a couple of years and one of the remaining men will be promoted to his position. Will a woman be promoted to replace the empty position (I'm actually next in line)? Or will another man be brought in from outside to take that spot?...time will tell.

I agree with all you said but was really pointing out the fact that it is not always just The Old Boys Club. Once women get into these roles, they do the same thing they originally complained about.

[ForeverAutumn]

I see your point. And I agree.


I just saw this on Facebook and thought of this thread, so I'm posting it.

[Hyfi]

Yeah yeah

A Hard Man is Good to Find

[JohnMichael]

Yeah yeah

A Hard Man is Good to Find

Oh no taking a bad turn.

[Hyfi]

LOL, I couldn't resist....no offense intended

[3LB]

Well, my wife has always made more money than me. 20 or so years ago, when my attempts at a career (post Navy) stalled and the wife was pregnant, it didn't make sense that she would put her vital career on hold whilst I knocked about dead-end jobs, so I stayed home with the chirlins for the first few years of their lives and then started working night jobs so that I could keep up the dare care during the day (no village raised my kids). Our situation warranted such a role reversal but I know/knew families that struggled mightily because the men wouldn't dream of doing what I did and letting their wives go to work. Now, they'd had no problem partaking in government programs allowing them to afford cars and housing and medical and whatnot, as long as they looked like the hunter-gatherer they were meant to be.

[Worf101]

Yeah... the more I look around my Department... women are running it for sure.. I guess I've stayed in one place long enough to see the "all white male club over 50" turn into to the "all white women's club". Well, long as they can hack the gear more power to them. My only problem is that they sometimes take a "difference of opinion" as an attack, even when it's clearly not. Well it won't be my problem much longer as I'm VERY close to retirement.

Worf

[Lavarda]

On dating sites you can find different women.

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