Results 1 to 23 of 23

Thread: phono cable

  1. #1
    frenchmon frenchmon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    St. Charles Mo
    Posts
    3,271

    phono cable

    Just wondering if anybody has had experience with Ortofon phono cable or any of their cables?
    Music...let it into your soul and be moved....with Canton...Pure Music


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    W10 i5 Quad core processor 8GB RAM/Jriver 20/ Fidelizer Optimizer/ iFI Micro DSD DAC-iUSB 3.0/Vincent SA - T1/Vincent SP-331 MK /MMF-7.1/2M BLACK/MS Phenomena ll+/Canton Vento 830.2

  2. #2
    frenchmon frenchmon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    St. Charles Mo
    Posts
    3,271
    Wow...no one has tried this cable....they at least look interesting....

    http://www.ortofon.com/index.php?opt...173&Itemid=165
    Music...let it into your soul and be moved....with Canton...Pure Music


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    W10 i5 Quad core processor 8GB RAM/Jriver 20/ Fidelizer Optimizer/ iFI Micro DSD DAC-iUSB 3.0/Vincent SA - T1/Vincent SP-331 MK /MMF-7.1/2M BLACK/MS Phenomena ll+/Canton Vento 830.2

  3. #3
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,462
    Quote Originally Posted by frenchmon
    Wow...no one has tried this cable....they at least look interesting..
    Yet the technical specifications omit the single most important metric for use with MM cartridges - capacitance. One must know the answer in order to optimize their system for a given model.

    rw

  4. #4
    Suspended atomicAdam's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Oaktown!
    Posts
    1,774
    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    Yet the technical specifications omit the single most important metric for use with MM cartridges - capacitance. One must know the answer in order to optimize their system for a given model.

    rw
    Agreed - I was looking for that as well. Getting the Capacitance and Impedance in a cable to match your gear is what you want to look for. Not only that - I'd assume your table has interconnect options at the back, not just a cable that goes from your table to the phono amp - per my Rega - which I oh so enjoy... - anyways. You want to find out what will match your cartridge/table and phono amp.

  5. #5
    frenchmon frenchmon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    St. Charles Mo
    Posts
    3,271
    Oh....yes you right...never noticed that. My dealer can get them...im hoping he has more information about them.
    Music...let it into your soul and be moved....with Canton...Pure Music


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    W10 i5 Quad core processor 8GB RAM/Jriver 20/ Fidelizer Optimizer/ iFI Micro DSD DAC-iUSB 3.0/Vincent SA - T1/Vincent SP-331 MK /MMF-7.1/2M BLACK/MS Phenomena ll+/Canton Vento 830.2

  6. #6
    You play. I listen. Enochrome's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Best Coast
    Posts
    447
    Speaking of phono cables, what is the sonic benefit of balanced xlr's over rca's? If their is any? I have seen the Jelco phono cables bought frequently, but it seems that the Ortofons are just as sought after but more highly regarded due the premium in price that people are willing to pay.

  7. #7
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,462
    Quote Originally Posted by frenchmon
    Oh....yes you right...never noticed that. My dealer can get them...im hoping he has more information about them.
    The top end response of moving magnet cartridges is highly affected by capacitance. Too much and it goes away. Recently, I replaced a Bellari VP-129 phono pre with a NAD C-160. While the Bellari sounded decent, it didn't have enough gain to drive the Threshold amp very loudly. Initially, however, the NAD sounded horribly dull on top. Hmmm. Time to do the math. The Shure M97x cartridge wants to see 250 pF. I discovered the NAD has 475 pF! in addition to 47 pF for the SME arm wiring and another 140 pF for the DH Labs cable for a total of 662 pF! No wonder it sounded so dull.

    I cracked the case on the NAD to assess the situation. What I found were three ceramic disc capacitors: two at 101 pF and one 220 pF. Despite the fact that there are no "user serviceable parts", I removed (desoldered) the 220 and one of the 101s. That left 154 pF. Recently, I had purchased a capacitance meter and now knew the values for various spare cables I had lying around. Turns out, a pair of AR video cables had only 60 pF. Using those with the newly reduced value in the preamp got the total down to around 260 pF - close enough. The top end was substantially better.

    Lesson: it sure helps if you know the value for cables when used with MM cartridges.

    rw

  8. #8
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Mortsel, Antwerp, Belgium, Europe, Earth
    Posts
    3,056
    Well,

    I use this one...

    I'm happy with it. I now use it with my Jelco SA-750D. Before that, I used it with a Rega RB301, and it was a big improvement over the stock cable. They also have a really sturdy feel about them, good quality materials too...

    I have no experience with interconnects, but they sure do look promising

    Keep them spinning,
    Bert.
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  9. #9
    Forum Regular hifitommy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    sylmar, ca. in beautiful so cal earthquake country
    Posts
    1,442
    how does one measure and then compensate for discrepancies without invasive procedures like soldering? there must be a way for each.
    ...regards...tr

  10. #10
    frenchmon frenchmon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    St. Charles Mo
    Posts
    3,271
    Quote Originally Posted by basite
    Well,

    I use this one...

    I'm happy with it. I now use it with my Jelco SA-750D. Before that, I used it with a Rega RB301, and it was a big improvement over the stock cable. They also have a really sturdy feel about them, good quality materials too...

    I have no experience with interconnects, but they sure do look promising

    Keep them spinning,
    Bert.
    What are the price range of the phono cables?
    Music...let it into your soul and be moved....with Canton...Pure Music


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    W10 i5 Quad core processor 8GB RAM/Jriver 20/ Fidelizer Optimizer/ iFI Micro DSD DAC-iUSB 3.0/Vincent SA - T1/Vincent SP-331 MK /MMF-7.1/2M BLACK/MS Phenomena ll+/Canton Vento 830.2

  11. #11
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,462
    Quote Originally Posted by hifitommy
    how does one measure and then compensate for discrepancies without invasive procedures like soldering? there must be a way for each.
    I'm not sure I understand the question, but in my case the SME arm has hardwired cabling from the shell to the base where they attach to jacks. You can then use any IC you wish. Same is true for my Souther TQ-1.

    rw

  12. #12
    Forum Regular hifitommy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    sylmar, ca. in beautiful so cal earthquake country
    Posts
    1,442
    ralph, i was talking about the capacitance.
    ...regards...tr

  13. #13
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,462

    So was I

    Quote Originally Posted by hifitommy
    i was talking about the capacitance.
    You clip one lead of a capacitance meter to a hot leg and the other to a ground on either side of a cable. Set the range and go!



    rw

  14. #14
    Forum Regular hifitommy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    sylmar, ca. in beautiful so cal earthquake country
    Posts
    1,442
    how much is one of those? its not quite your basic vom.

    also, is there an external way of altering the capacitance? like the impedance tricks you can do with y connectors and resistors.
    ...regards...tr

  15. #15
    frenchmon frenchmon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    St. Charles Mo
    Posts
    3,271
    Quote Originally Posted by hifitommy
    how much is one of those? its not quite your basic vom.

    also, is there an external way of altering the capacitance? like the impedance tricks you can do with y connectors and resistors.
    I found an online price for the phono at $230. 1m

    EDIT: Oh you are talking about the meter...my bad.
    Last edited by frenchmon; 02-09-2011 at 05:50 PM.
    Music...let it into your soul and be moved....with Canton...Pure Music


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    W10 i5 Quad core processor 8GB RAM/Jriver 20/ Fidelizer Optimizer/ iFI Micro DSD DAC-iUSB 3.0/Vincent SA - T1/Vincent SP-331 MK /MMF-7.1/2M BLACK/MS Phenomena ll+/Canton Vento 830.2

  16. #16
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,462
    Quote Originally Posted by hifitommy
    how much is one of those? its not quite your basic vom.
    No, it is not a conventional VOM. I got mine for $43 delivered. There was a post over at AA here which mentioned this unit. I've found it quite useful.

    Quote Originally Posted by hifitommy
    also, is there an external way of altering the capacitance? like the impedance tricks you can do with y connectors and resistors.
    Well, you can always add capacitance by using inexpensive ceramic disc caps.

    rw

  17. #17
    Forum Regular hifitommy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    sylmar, ca. in beautiful so cal earthquake country
    Posts
    1,442
    "add capacitance by using inexpensive ceramic disc caps."

    can that be done without soldering?
    ...regards...tr

  18. #18
    _ Luvin Da Blues's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    _
    Posts
    1,951
    Quote Originally Posted by hifitommy
    "add capacitance by using inexpensive ceramic disc caps."

    can that be done without soldering?
    Sure can, just not very well.
    Back in my day, we had nine planets.

  19. #19
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,462
    Quote Originally Posted by hifitommy
    can that be done without soldering?
    You could provide only a physical connection, but it would not be ideal. On the other hand, you could solder the caps across an otherwise "empty" phono plug and plug it and another cable into a Y adapter. In that way, you are not doing anything irreversible to other components.

    Pic of approach.

    rw

  20. #20
    Forum Regular hifitommy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    sylmar, ca. in beautiful so cal earthquake country
    Posts
    1,442
    i must be chewing gum again. i meant to specify soldering on the circuit board. the Y adaptor trick as used with resistors for impedance adjustment would of course require soldering. does anybody have some spare lithium capsules?
    ...regards...tr

  21. #21
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,462
    Quote Originally Posted by hifitommy
    i must be chewing gum again. i meant to specify soldering on the circuit board. the Y adaptor trick as used with resistors for impedance adjustment would of course require soldering.
    I guess it depends whether your concern has to do with messing with an otherwise functioning unit - or just the notion of soldering at all. Some folks just don't want to have to open up their preamp, locating exactly where to add the resistors and/or caps, and solder on the board potentially voiding the warranty. The Y adapter trick avoids that for adding resistance or capacitance. On the other hand, if you don't have a soldering iron, then you'd have to use the physical contact approach twisting the leads tightly.

    rw

  22. #22
    Forum Regular hifitommy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    sylmar, ca. in beautiful so cal earthquake country
    Posts
    1,442
    yeah, i have a soldering iron and dont mind a little ofdoing that,as you say, i dont want to mess with a board and a permanent change.

    i havent been using mm carts for a while but i will soon as i have some good ones.
    ...regards...tr

  23. #23
    frenchmon frenchmon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    St. Charles Mo
    Posts
    3,271
    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    The top end response of moving magnet cartridges is highly affected by capacitance. Too much and it goes away. Recently, I replaced a Bellari VP-129 phono pre with a NAD C-160. While the Bellari sounded decent, it didn't have enough gain to drive the Threshold amp very loudly. Initially, however, the NAD sounded horribly dull on top. Hmmm. Time to do the math. The Shure M97x cartridge wants to see 250 pF. I discovered the NAD has 475 pF! in addition to 47 pF for the SME arm wiring and another 140 pF for the DH Labs cable for a total of 662 pF! No wonder it sounded so dull.

    I cracked the case on the NAD to assess the situation. What I found were three ceramic disc capacitors: two at 101 pF and one 220 pF. Despite the fact that there are no "user serviceable parts", I removed (desoldered) the 220 and one of the 101s. That left 154 pF. Recently, I had purchased a capacitance meter and now knew the values for various spare cables I had lying around. Turns out, a pair of AR video cables had only 60 pF. Using those with the newly reduced value in the preamp got the total down to around 260 pF - close enough. The top end was substantially better.

    Lesson: it sure helps if you know the value for cables when used with MM cartridges.

    rw
    E-Stat...this is valuable to me...thanks.
    Music...let it into your soul and be moved....with Canton...Pure Music


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    W10 i5 Quad core processor 8GB RAM/Jriver 20/ Fidelizer Optimizer/ iFI Micro DSD DAC-iUSB 3.0/Vincent SA - T1/Vincent SP-331 MK /MMF-7.1/2M BLACK/MS Phenomena ll+/Canton Vento 830.2

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •