The MAGNEPAN TYMPANI Speaker

[luckydoggoldminer]

My first real good speaker was a Magnepan mg 1 in 1978. I brought it with me when i first went to college in nothern california. my room mates were stunned at the realism offered by these unique speakers. So many parties and qustions later the local retailer started selling them a couple years after. I then found a pair of magnepan tympani 1Bs. These speakers were three paneled per side to produce a wide soundstage that no other speaker can copy. Each side is a min of four feet wide and can be un hinged at the tweeter panel to be even wider. The speaker i settled on is the tympani 4 and the single panel mg 3.3. These MAGNEPAN TYMPANI 4s will produce such detail that you will hear the guitar players breath and fingers pluck the strings. The main great thing for me is the mid bass slam. They dont produce much below forty hertz but can be the best speaker used in a huge front projector system if you have the room. You will need the cleanest power you can get and also a good clean pre amp. A nice amp to get is the yamaha b2x or anything with a good and clean power supply. They range from a thousand and up. The earlier TYMPANI 1A,1B,1C,AND 1D were two ways but still great sounding. The newer TYMPANI 4 AND 4As had true ribbon tweeters you have to be real carefull not to damage if you play realistic levels in your theater. The older Tympanis work better for theatre because of this but contact MAGNEPAN on their ability to repair these older speakers.

[JoeE SP9]

You should read the signatures of other posters. Several regular posters use Magnepan's. One of the forums here is devoted to planar speakers; Maggy's, esl's, ribbons etc. I used Maggy's in the past. According to an old Stereophile poll more of their readers own Magneplanar's than any other speaker.

[luckydoggoldminer]

I was just offering my opin on the speakers! ok dude?

[Mash]

JoeE was not challenging you, Mr luckydoggoldminer...................

Many of us do have Magnepan speakers....................

I have used Tympani 3A's T/M/W since 1974, with a Velodyne SS coming in below 50 Hz. Only a servo-sub is articulate enough to blend with Maggies. Magnepan will rebuild their older speakers.

But I chose the Tympani 3A *only* because I heard them driven with a Futterman OTL amp. I even did not like the Tympani's when they were driven with ARC tubies. Go figure......

Magnepans are simply not all that attractive when driven with SS amps. The Bongiorno-designed Ampzilla I have that works so beautifully on the bass panels was merely OK on the T/M panels.

OTL amps like the Futterman, the original OTL amp, usually work well with speakers rated at 8 ohm or above because these amps "tend" to operate as constant-current sources. But one can try an OTL with 4 ohm speakers by using Paul Speltz's autoformers....

http://zeroimpedance.com/products.html

I also use a Jolida 302B, with Winged-C tubes in it, to drive MMG's in our bedroom with very pleasing results. A Musical Fidelity A2 constant-voltage source amp was only decent with the MMG's.

[E-Stat]

My first real good speaker was a Magnepan mg 1 in 1978.

I had MG-IIs in '76 before moving to electrostats. Note that there is a planar speaker sub-forum where you can find others who enjoy them. There's also a Magnepan Users Group forum (MUG) found here.

rw

[luckydoggoldminer]

I once used a Pair of Tympani 1BS for a center SPEAKER ALONG WITH FOURS FOR THE FRONTS AND MG3As FOR THE REARS. THE PRESENTATION WITH A FRONT PROJECTION SET UP WAS AMAZING. I USED A YAMAHA B2 FOR THE CENTER AND A YAMAHA B2X FOR THE FRONTS AND A YAMAHA B2 FOR THE MG3As. I LATER REPLACED THE THEATER SPEAKERS WITH VERTEC SPEAKERS THAT WERE UNIQUE IN THAT THEY WERE MADE OF GUNITE AND USED DANISH AND GERMAN DRIVERS. I STILL USE THE TYMPANIS FOR SERIOUS LISTENING.



I began to edit your post so it is not in all caps. Please finish what was started.

[E-Stat]

I once used a Pair of Tympani 1Bs for a center...

A friend of mine has a multi-channel system built around current Maggies - 20.1s and dual CC3s up front with 3.6s in rear. Drives them with Conrad-Johnson and Edge amplification with a Sony projector and 100" screen. Very expansive sound and wonderful picture.

rw

[magtrw]

I combine the best part of two great speakers; Martin Logan
Summits (woofers not used) with Magneplanar Tympani
IV bass panels (modified). The electrostatic portion of the
Summits has great low level detail, imaging (no xover) and
a wonderful sound-stage. The Magneplanar Tympani
bass panels being a dipole, very light in mass, large surface
area, provides powerful, well controlled, huge depth, and
bass with awesome impact. The Maggie bass panel are
bolted together and to the floor, which improves transient
response and lowers distortion. I also extend the bass
response with the Eminent Technology TRW-17 rotary subwoofer down to 1 hz!!!!! These speakers are in placed
well away from all walls and the room is completely
treated with 36 ASC tube traps.

[Feanor]

I combine the best part of two great speakers; Martin Logan
Summits (woofers not used) with Magneplanar Tympani
IV bass panels (modified). The electrostatic portion of the
Summits has great low level detail, imaging (no xover) and
a wonderful sound-stage. The Magneplanar Tympani
bass panels being a dipole, very light in mass, large surface
area, provides powerful, well controlled, huge depth, and
bass with awesome impact. The Maggie bass panel are
bolted together and to the floor, which improves transient
response and lowers distortion. I also extend the bass
response with the Eminent Technology TRW-17 rotary subwoofer down to 1 hz!!!!! These speakers are in placed
well away from all walls and the room is completely
treated with 36 ASC tube traps.

Impressive concept. What amps power the respective speakers and what sort of crossovers do you use

[magtrw]

Impressive concept. What amps power the respective speakers and what sort of crossovers do you use

I use an Arcam AVR600 Receiver to drive the Martin Logan Summits
(woofers not used), Martin Logan Logos center channel, 4 Gallo
Nucleus Micros for rear channels, and 2 Gallo Nucleus Micros and 2
Spica TC-50s for side channels. The Arcam has great current capabilities and truly state of the art in sound. It has superb detail,
imaging, depth and fantastic spacial reproduction. To drive the Magneplanar Tympani bass panels I use a Audio Research D400MKII power amplifier which is controlled by a Mark Levinson 380S preamp.
The Magneplanar Tympanis impedance is 4 ohms and the Audio
Research power amplifier provides 400 watts at that impedance.
This amp has superb bass transient capabilities and also great
depth. The Summits xover is 270 hz and the Magneplanar Tympanis
low pass xover is 250 hz at 18 db per octave (modified with quality
parts) and the two speakers have a very good transition. The two
speakers being dipole are a wonderful match and integration is
fantastic. The Eminent Technology Rotary woofer gets most of the
power from the ac current rotating the fan blades, and the fan
blades are pitched by a rotor woofer controller, specifically designed
by Marchand Electronics. A low pass xover in this controller is set
to 25 hz, at 18 db per octave and the rotary subwoofer provides bass
down to 1 hz!!!!!!! Once again the integration between all these
speakers is awesome and is a speaker system that is simply realistic,
powerful and one that would be hard to beat.

[E-Stat]

I combine the best part of two great speakers; Martin Logan
Summits (woofers not used) with Magneplanar Tympani
IV bass panels (modified).

That reminds me of Harry Pearson's mating of T-1Ds with Infinity QRS ribbons in the late 70s. Tympanis have always done very well at the bottom. I confess that I've never been a fan of MLs because of their lack of coherency as compared with full range designs. Mating them with dipolar Maggies is a nice answer.

rw

[JoeE SP9]

I use an Arcam AVR600 Receiver to drive the Martin Logan Summits
(woofers not used), Martin Logan Logos center channel, 4 Gallo
Nucleus Micros for rear channels, and 2 Gallo Nucleus Micros and 2
Spica TC-50s for side channels. The Arcam has great current capabilities and truly state of the art in sound. It has superb detail,
imaging, depth and fantastic spacial reproduction. To drive the Magneplanar Tympani bass panels I use a Audio Research D400MKII power amplifier which is controlled by a Mark Levinson 380S preamp.
The Magneplanar Tympanis impedance is 4 ohms and the Audio
Research power amplifier provides 400 watts at that impedance.
This amp has superb bass transient capabilities and also great
depth. The Summits xover is 270 hz and the Magneplanar Tympanis
low pass xover is 250 hz at 18 db per octave (modified with quality
parts) and the two speakers have a very good transition. The two
speakers being dipole are a wonderful match and integration is
fantastic. The Eminent Technology Rotary woofer gets most of the
power from the ac current rotating the fan blades, and the fan
blades are pitched by a rotor woofer controller, specifically designed
by Marchand Electronics. A low pass xover in this controller is set
to 25 hz, at 18 db per octave and the rotary subwoofer provides bass
down to 1 hz!!!!!!! Once again the integration between all these
speakers is awesome and is a speaker system that is simply realistic,
powerful and one that would be hard to beat.

I may be reading things incorrectly. A high pass of 270Hz and a low pass of 250Hz leaves a 20Hz difference. A crossover frequency in that area is why I along with E-Stat have problems with most ML's. Ideally no crossover is best. However, if you have to have one the lower the frequency the better. E-Stat has none and I envy that. Me, I use 80Hz and wish I could go lower.
What kind of crossover are you using between the Tympani panels and the ML panels? (IME) I have found passive crossovers to be a major source of veiling. In every instance (that I've heard) where an active electronic crossover has replaced a passive crossover there has been an improvement in the sound.

[magtrw]

I may be reading things incorrectly. A high pass of 270Hz and a low pass of 250Hz leaves a 20Hz difference. A crossover frequency in that area is why I along with E-Stat have problems with most ML's. Ideally no crossover is best. However, if you have to have one the lower the frequency the better. E-Stat has none and I envy that. Me, I use 80Hz and wish I could go lower.
What kind of crossover are you using between the Tympani panels and the ML panels? (IME) I have found passive crossovers to be a major source of veiling. In every instance (that I've heard) where an active electronic crossover has replaced a passive crossover there has been an improvement in the sound.

The Tympanis response goes up to 250 hz and the Summits electrostatic
elements go down to around 270 hz; but combining the two gives
one a very smooth transition. There is still response below 270 hz
for the summits and response above 250 hz for the tympanls. I have
tried electronic xovers and passive as well and each one has there
good points and bad points (tradeoffs) I ended up with passive using
high quality inductors (Goertz) for the tympanis and the Summits
with there own xovers. This combination works extremely well and
is a major improvement over the Summits with there woofers. So there is
no xover in the Summits above 270 hz as the electrostatic transducers work
up to 23,000 hz. The Maggies are just rolled off above 250 hz. If you
could hear this combination, I am sure you would agree how it sounds. The
major benefit is now both speakers have a dipole radiation and light
mass, giving one detailed, spacious, depth, powerful bass with impact.
Choosing the right tradeoffs makes a difference.

[JoeE SP9]

I've been using panels of one type or another since I purchased a pair of new MG-1's in 1976. Consequently I have some experience with them. The discontinuities inherent with a 270Hz crossover from dipolar esl panel to point source cone woofer has always bothered me about most ML speakers. Using a panel below that point would certainly ameliorate some of the problems I hear.

However, there is still the "sound" of a passive crossover. In my experience passive crossovers are always audible. How audible is hard to determine until it's removed and replaced with an active electronic one. Running my ESL's full range (no crossover) results in the best sound my system is capable of producing. Unfortunately, I'm a bass freak. So some augmentation in the low end is necessary. After much experimentation I settled on an electronic crossover feeding dual transmission line subs below 80Hz. Although there is still a difference in radiation patterns, dual subs and an 80Hz crossover frequency are, to my ears, a reasonable compromise.

The lack of a passive crossover is IMO a major factor in getting better sound. No crossover at all is even better.

[magtrw]

I've been using panels of one type or another since I purchased a pair of new MG-1's in 1976. Consequently I have some experience with them. The discontinuities inherent with a 270Hz crossover from dipolar esl panel to point source cone woofer has always bothered me about most ML speakers. Using a panel below that point would certainly ameliorate some of the problems I hear.

However, there is still the "sound" of a passive crossover. In my experience passive crossovers are always audible. How audible is hard to determine until it's removed and replaced with an active electronic one. Running my ESL's full range (no crossover) results in the best sound my system is capable of producing. Unfortunately, I'm a bass freak. So some augmentation in the low end is necessary. After much experimentation I settled on an electronic crossover feeding dual transmission line subs below 80Hz. Although there is still a difference in radiation patterns, dual subs and an 80Hz crossover frequency are, to my ears, a reasonable compromise.

The lack of a passive crossover is IMO a major factor in getting better sound. No crossover at all is even better.

We all have are preferences; thats what the hobby is all
about. You call yourself a bass freak, but have you ever
heard the Tympani IV bass in combination with the Eminent
Technology TRW-17 Rotary Subwoofer. This is a match
of bass transducers that is coherent, with powerful impact,
transient response that is stunning and response flat down
to 1 hz without equalization. I have given many demos
to experienced audiophiles and they all have come away
with the same conclusion (realistic, stunning, and a
sound experience that none of them has ever heard before.

[Feanor]

We all have are preferences; thats what the hobby is all
about. You call yourself a bass freak, but have you ever
heard the Tympani IV bass in combination with the Eminent
Technology TRW-17 Rotary Subwoofer. This is a match
of bass transducers that is coherent, with powerful impact,
transient response that is stunning and response flat down
to 1 hz without equalization. I have given many demos
to experienced audiophiles and they all have come away
with the same conclusion (realistic, stunning, and a
sound experience that none of them has ever heard before.

Regarding the TRW-17, I guess I have a few of questions or reservations.

First, obviously, the price. Eminent Technology progects the estimated installed cost at $21-26k; the equipment is over $14k, the rest is design & installation. This is reserved for the extremely well-heeled, and also for people who can and will undertake to do the home renovations recommended.

Secondly, how realistic is it to actually get a very low frequency reproduced in even a fairly large room. From what I gather at least one dimention of the room must exceed 1/2 the wave length of the frequency: On this basis 20 Hz requires a room at least 28 feet in length. Are you really going to feel, (not hear), say 8 Hz?

Thirdly, music goes down to the 42 Hz of the bass bassoon or, arguably, 16 Hz of the largest organ pipes; lower than that we're talking sound effects, not music. So 8 Hz would be relevant only to movie sound tracks or the like -- were Sir TtT around these days he might comment on whether, in fact, sound tracks ever have such deep sounds.

[JoeE SP9]

We all have are preferences; thats what the hobby is all
about. You call yourself a bass freak, but have you ever
heard the Tympani IV bass in combination with the Eminent
Technology TRW-17 Rotary Subwoofer. This is a match
of bass transducers that is coherent, with powerful impact,
transient response that is stunning and response flat down
to 1 hz without equalization. I have given many demos
to experienced audiophiles and they all have come away
with the same conclusion (realistic, stunning, and a
sound experience that none of them has ever heard before.

Yes I've heard a full Tympani system with the extra bass panels. Like Feanor I feel that response to 1Hz is a little overkill. Hey, if you can afford it go for it. I probably would.

My subs are crossed over at 80Hz and Eq'd flat to 18Hz. My audio buddies are favorably impressed with my rig. They include an IRS V owner an MG-20 owner with dual 18" Velodynes and others with very good systems. Yes, my room is long (almost 30') enough to support lower frequencies.

BTW: I sometimes listen at peak levels above 110dB@ 10'. The sound makes me smile.

No one here will suggest you don't have stellar bass. My main comments were directed at using passive crossovers. To be frank, replacing them with an active crossover is an ear opener.

Low E on an electric bass is ~41.2Hz.

[blackraven]

You should check out the Planar forum here-

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?board=177.0