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  1. #1
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    A/V Receiver Q's: $1k to spend, looking for options

    I have spent the last hour or so weeding through all the existing threads on A/V Reveivers and have managed to come away with more questions that answers.


    Background:
    I currently have an older Yamaha RV703 (80/80/80/15/15 wpc) 5.1 A/V receiver. I have had this receiver for going on 8 years now, and with the upgrading of my speakers I am now looking to upgrade the Receiver. Obviously the old 15/15wpc suround power just isn't quite up to snuff...

    Listening Room: 23' long, 13' wide. 8' sloping to 20' cathedral ceilings. TV/Mains/AV at the 8' end.

    Current Speakers: PSB Stratus Silver i's Mains (4 ohm speakers), PSB C5i center, PSB Subsonic 7, PSB Image 10s surrounds. 5.1 channel system. (In theory, I could add the PSB Stratus Mini's as rear surounds and move the Image 10s into presence speakers as an upgrade but...the space just isn't there.)

    I have little need to go beyond 5.1 in my current home, especially since the wall space for 2 more speakers just doesn't exist...

    Question #1: Many of the new receivers today are 7.1 systems. I am only geared for 5.1 surround. Can a 7.1 system be made to perform in 5.1 mode?

    Question #2: I very much enjoy listening to 2-channel stereo. Can someone explain Denon's (or any other manufacturer's...) concept of "Direct Stero" which apparantly bypasses the extra channel amps in favor of straight 2-channel stereo? I have read that this will improve 2-channel stereo sound. Is this true? And, if so, what other manufacturers out there do something similar?

    Question #3: Discrete power & high current. Someone correct me if I am wrong here, but Discrete Amps means multiple amplifiers loaded into the same case. Is there any benefit to finding an a/v receiver that offers a "high current" capability (ala Harmon Kardon)?

    Question #4: Ohm ratings. Given that my mains are 4ohm rated, does it make sense to pursue a/v amping along the 4 ohm line? Furthermore, (yep, noob Q here) what are the disadvantages of running 4ohm speakers with an 8ohm a/v receiver? Am I sacrificing sound quality? At this time, amp heat is not an issue and the amp has never come anywhere near "too hot to touch".

    Question #4: Recomendations. I have long enjoyed my Yamaha a/v amp. It works great for Stereo and I am quite partial to it. Fact is, the Yam will be "retired" to my office while the new amp will do heavy HT/Stereo work.

    So, can you name some $1,000 or less A/V amps which offer high quality stereo sound as well as quality HT. Figure 100wpc, strong emphasis on quality stereo sound first, HT second. All amps will be demo'ed before purchase. In terms of sound quality, the PSB's are increadibly smooth sounding, neutral speakers that aren't particularly bright (Wharfedales by comparison are very bright sounding to the PSB's) - so an a/v amp that edges towards the "bright end" of the spectrum is not a problem.

    Any help greatly appreciated.

  2. #2
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    Just a thought here. Have you considered going with an older model receiver or lesser receiver but that still has preouts? For example, something such as a used Outlaw 1050 but adding on an external amplifier.

  3. #3
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by bmw-k
    I have spent the last hour or so weeding through all the existing threads on A/V Reveivers and have managed to come away with more questions that answers. .
    I know how that is, have experienced it myself. I'll give you what I can, good luck with the rest of it

    Quote Originally Posted by bmw-k
    Question #1: Many of the new receivers today are 7.1 systems. I am only geared for 5.1 surround. Can a 7.1 system be made to perform in 5.1 mode? .
    YES, most of the higher end AVR can do this easily, certainly Yammie 1400 or 2400 and several of the Denon AVR can do this.

    I am in the process right now of doing this myself. I am replacing an older JVC 5.1 system with a Denon 3803 (7.1 system) but will only be setting it up in a 5.1 configuration. Not only do I not have room for the additional speakers on the side walls, we sit all the way to the back of the room also so there is no rooom for a back surround speaker. Also, as of today there is very limited content in the market with true 6.1 or 7.1 sound tracks.

    Quote Originally Posted by bmw-k
    Question #2: I very much enjoy listening to 2-channel stereo. Can someone explain Denon's (or any other manufacturer's...) concept of "Direct Stero" which apparantly bypasses the extra channel amps in favor of straight 2-channel stereo? I have read that this will improve 2-channel stereo sound. Is this true? And, if so, what other manufacturers out there do something similar?.
    If I understand Denon write up correctly they are not just bypassing the other channels amps, if in your AVR setup you choose not to use certain channels those amps are actuall SHUT DOWN. This has the effect of less noise being injected in the systems, resulting in cleaner sound.
    I don't know what other manufactures may have implemented this technology in their AVR

    Quote Originally Posted by bmw-k
    Question #4: Ohm ratings. Given that my mains are 4ohm rated, does it make sense to pursue a/v amping along the 4 ohm line? Furthermore, (yep, noob Q here) what are the disadvantages of running 4ohm speakers with an 8ohm a/v receiver? Am I sacrificing sound quality? At this time, amp heat is not an issue and the amp has never come anywhere near "too hot to touch".?.
    You need to match the impedence of the speakers with the output of the AVR or run the risk of over heating your AVR or not having the power to drive the speakers.

    Most high end units today have the capability or a switch to set to 4 or 8 ohms in order to allow you the flexibility to make this match.

    Here's a summary: If your AVR is set to output into 8 ohms, and you have 4 ohm speakers, the speakers do not provided the adequate amout of resitiance to the reciever which will allow the receiver to run more, shall we say open throttle, and as such will generate more heat in the AVR, which could burn up your reciever output amps.


    Quote Originally Posted by bmw-k
    So, can you name some $1,000 or less A/V amps which offer high quality stereo sound as well as quality HT. Figure 100wpc, strong emphasis on quality stereo sound first, HT second. All amps will be demo'ed before purchase. In terms of sound quality, the PSB's are increadibly smooth sounding, neutral speakers that aren't particularly bright (Wharfedales by comparison are very bright sounding to the PSB's) - so an a/v amp that edges towards the "bright end" of the spectrum is not a problem.".?.
    Denon 8303, Yammie 2400 are a couple of good considerations.
    Denon will be more base than the Yammie which tends to be on the bright side in comparasion. If you had/have bright speakers I would lean towards the Denon (depending on your preferences to sound, base or bright) My point here is .... yammie is brighter than denon

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by omikey
    Denon 8303, Yammie 2400 are a couple of good considerations.
    Denon will be more base than the Yammie which tends to be on the bright side in comparasion. If you had/have bright speakers I would lean towards the Denon (depending on your preferences to sound, base or bright) My point here is .... yammie is brighter than denon

    When I brought my 1400 home I noticed the same 'Brightness'.

    Once I ran the auto setup using the YPAO and microphone, the receiver automatically adjusted everything and the sound quality improvement was off the cahrt. The YPAO is a very impressive feature on the Yamahas

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by wasch_24
    When I brought my 1400 home I noticed the same 'Brightness'.

    Once I ran the auto setup using the YPAO and microphone, the receiver automatically adjusted everything and the sound quality improvement was off the cahrt. The YPAO is a very impressive feature on the Yamahas
    Wasch - yes that is a great feature. The new Denon 3805 will have this feature on it ..... but it will also cost a bunch more then the now outdated 3803.

    Sometimes we are so limited as to what we can really do in the demo store. Listen to yammie and denon on the same speakers, recievers both set to flat so as to hear the native output of the receiver to the speakers.
    Certainly if you get a yammie, run the YPAO and take advantage.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by omikey
    Denon 8303, Yammie 2400 are a couple of good considerations.
    Denon will be more base than the Yammie which tends to be on the bright side in comparasion. If you had/have bright speakers I would lean towards the Denon (depending on your preferences to sound, base or bright) My point here is .... yammie is brighter than denon
    This is a common misconception many have about newer Yamaha receivers. In the past, yes they were considered a little "bright". The newer lines of Yamaha's especially the RX-V1400/2400 and the flagship Z9 are not bright. Are they more detailed than Denon, maybe but that's still up for debate. I run a Yamaha 1400 with Boston Acoustic speakers and the sound is anything but bright. It's been a while but I remember those PSB Stratus Silvers as being pretty warm and laid back. Very similiar to my Bostons. I love the sound I get with my setup. The detail of the Yamaha and the warmness of the Bostons produce a very smooth sound. Sounds like the detailed Yamaha might be good match.

    JSE
    Last edited by JSE; 03-09-2004 at 11:56 AM.

  7. #7
    Forum Regular wasch_24's Avatar
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    I have to agree whole heartedly!

    I too have my 1400 running a gambit of Boston acoustics refer to this post for my system, Home Theater Audio Recommendations

    This combination creates sound that is rich, enveloping, and very realistic. I love it! Music or movies, doesn't matter. All good!

    Of course I am biased because I spent my hard earned money on the stuff.

  8. #8
    JSE
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    Quote Originally Posted by wasch_24
    I have to agree whole heartedly!

    I too have my 1400 running a gambit of Boston acoustics refer to this post for my system, Home Theater Audio Recommendations

    This combination creates sound that is rich, enveloping, and very realistic. I love it! Music or movies, doesn't matter. All good!

    Of course I am biased because I spent my hard earned money on the stuff.

    Wow, almost the same system as mine. I use the VR 910 for the center and Boston Bravos for the rears. I really love the VR965 speakers. After some tweaking with positioning, no need for a sub. Your right in that they do both music and HT well. That's the main reason I got the Boston speakers. Some speakers do one or the other better but the Boston do both nicely.

    JSE

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