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  1. #1
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    looking for small, powerful system

    I'm looking for a small, yet powerful system to be used in my house.
    I was looking at buying a new Bose Lifestyle system until I talked to someone who was very against Bose. So I'll just say what I like about the Lifestyle system and anyone who wants, can say what a good alternative is.
    What I like:
    * 5.1 surround
    * very small speakers
    * MP3/WMA
    * AdaptiQ (I would be okay with just a good 10 band EQ)
    * remote that works through walls
    * nice design of main unit

    I don't mind if the dvd is separate from the amp, from what I've heard, it's better that way.
    I know that there's a lot of grudges against the Bose 901, but has Bose gotten any closer to great sound with any of the new models? Does the bitterness still hold water?

    So if anyone just loves putting together shopping lists for other people, I'll look through as many lists as I can.
    thanks

  2. #2
    Forum Regular elapsed's Avatar
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    I'm not sure which Bose Lifestyle system you're looking at, but the Bose Lifestyle 28 retails for $1,999. If you are looking for very small speakers, here's a system you may want to consider;

    Speakers: HSU Performance 3 Package (includes STF-3 subwoofer), $678
    Receiver: Pioneer VSX-1016TXV, $500
    HD Player: Toshiba HD-A2 $500
    Universal Remote: Logitech Harmony 880, $250
    Cabling: $70

    Total: $1,998

    Prices above are all MSRP, so you can easily build this for several hundred less. If you need the remote to work through walls, consider the Logitech Harmony 890 (next model up). The subwoofer is excellent, and the only large piece in this setup (you could use as an end-table).

    This system is far superior to the Bose Lifestyle system in all imaginable ways. You won't find much love for Bose on this forum, though their systems would certainly be worth consideration if they were 1/3rd the price.

  3. #3
    Forum Regular N. Abstentia's Avatar
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    I don't think you can do much worse than Bose. If you want overpriced crap, go for Bose. Otherswise, follow the previous advice.

  4. #4
    test the blind blindly emorphien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elapsed
    I'm not sure which Bose Lifestyle system you're looking at, but the Bose Lifestyle 28 retails for $1,999. If you are looking for very small speakers, here's a system you may want to consider;

    Speakers: HSU Performance 3 Package (includes STF-3 subwoofer), $678
    Receiver: Pioneer VSX-1016TXV, $500
    HD Player: Toshiba HD-A2 $500
    Universal Remote: Logitech Harmony 880, $250
    Cabling: $70

    Total: $1,998

    Prices above are all MSRP, so you can easily build this for several hundred less. If you need the remote to work through walls, consider the Logitech Harmony 890 (next model up). The subwoofer is excellent, and the only large piece in this setup (you could use as an end-table).

    This system is far superior to the Bose Lifestyle system in all imaginable ways. You won't find much love for Bose on this forum, though their systems would certainly be worth consideration if they were 1/3rd the price.
    At 1/3rd the price it would start to be somewhat reasonable, although I'd still urge people to consider what they can get for just slightly more even if bose were 1/3 of what they cost now.

    Other alternatives to that (bigger speakers though) would be an X-LS based system, or the SVS surround package. If you insist on an RF remote (to work through walls) then Logitech has the 890 which I'm sure can be had for around $200-220 since the 880 can easily be purchased for $170 and has been seen for $120ish on Dell.com and other places I think from time to time. To be honest, unless I were using the system for multiple zones I don't see a need for an RF remote and features like that are worth giving up to get better sound (if you want to save some more money).

    As far as the AdaptiQ equalizer, it's most likely just an attempt to fool the unsuspecting listener in to thinking the speakers are better than they are (easily detected by most anyone who's had the slightest experience listening to a system actually capable of decent quality audio such as the ones already suggested to you). I don't use equalizers on any of my systems, never seen a reason to.

    Do you have a particular budget you want to keep to? $1000? $2000-3000? etc.


    edit: if you truly want powerful, Bose is a poor, poor choice. They're distorted at low volume but as you turn it up it just keeps getting worse.

    I just stumbled across these speakers. http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo...umber=ATMICRA6
    Although I'm not necessarily recommending them to you, I am certain without even hearing them, that they will outperform the Bose system.
    Here's a review:
    http://www.audioholics.com/productre...sMicra6p1.html

    Also, what size is your room?

  5. #5
    Crackhead Extraordinaire Dusty Chalk's Avatar
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    Someone from another thread pointed me to tsto.com, and I found this, which might or might not be a good taking off point.

    Now all you need is a source and a receiver and a sub.
    Eschew fascism.
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  6. #6
    Suspended topspeed's Avatar
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    The knock against Bose is that most feel they are simply overpriced. Their speakers aren't bad, per se. You just pay out the nose for the Bose name, and most of us like to get the best bang for the buck.

    If you really want small speakers, I'd look into either Gallo (roundsound.com) or Mirage Omnisats. They are both pretty inconspicuous and will offer better performance for far less than any Bose. Of the two, I'm partial more to the Gallos, if only because I found the imaging of the Omnisats to be a little fuzzy for my admittedly music-first bias. For HT, the diffuse soundfield is probably much more enjoyable.

    The bigger the speaker, the better the performance, so let us know if you absolutely have to have micro thingies.

    For a source and amp, any entry-level avr from Yammie, Denon, Onkyo, or Pioneer will do. Pair it with a Panny, Toshiba, or Oppo dvd player and you're good to go.

    Hope this helps.

  7. #7
    test the blind blindly emorphien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by topspeed
    Their speakers aren't bad, per se.
    I'd disagree, they're rather bad and very overpriced

  8. #8
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    If Bose was a third the price, would anyone consider them to be good speakers?
    And what about perspective... considering the size of the speakers in the lifestyle system, do you think they sound ok? Obviously if the speakers were a little larger, they should sound much more amazing, but there not larger. Does the sound relate very well to the size?

  9. #9
    test the blind blindly emorphien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaewlewis
    If Bose was a third the price, would anyone consider them to be good speakers?
    And what about perspective... considering the size of the speakers in the lifestyle system, do you think they sound ok? Obviously if the speakers were a little larger, they should sound much more amazing, but there not larger. Does the sound relate very well to the size?
    For 1/3rd the price, assuming I wasn't handicapping myself by desiring something so small, no I wouldn't consider them to be a good deal even then.

    Orb Audio and Gallo's sphere speakers are similarly small but made with better components in a better enclosure. Orb Audio speakers are relatively inexpensive so if you insist on micro-satellites I'd go that route or go with the Athenas I posted earlier or something similar.

  10. #10
    Crackhead Extraordinaire Dusty Chalk's Avatar
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    And those are just examples. There are plenty of other small speakers.

    BTW, "small" and "powerful" (which I read as, "able to go loud with minimal distortion") are usually mutually exclusive. Depends entirely on the drivers.
    Eschew fascism.
    Truth Will Out.
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    you guys are crackheads.
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  11. #11
    Color me gone... Resident Loser's Avatar
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    Bose is...

    Quote Originally Posted by michaewlewis
    If Bose was a third the price, would anyone consider them to be good speakers?
    And what about perspective... considering the size of the speakers in the lifestyle system, do you think they sound ok? Obviously if the speakers were a little larger, they should sound much more amazing, but there not larger. Does the sound relate very well to the size?
    ...what Bose is...they have good word of mouth in non-audiophile circles and their advertising well, you can't swing a dead cat without seeing or hearing it somewhere...The price reflects those advertising costs and the premium of having relatively simple hook-up and high WAF...I've heard some of the Acoustimass speakers and quite frankly on a cursory hearing they are pretty good I think...

    Some of the problem (audiophile-wise) with Bose Lifestyle, etc. is that they are closed-loop systems, in some (if not all) cases using proprietary interconnects, meaning you can't add to them...with other non-Bose components you can add, change, expand as you wish using standard RCA-type connectors...this may mean little if you are the plug'n'play-type of consumer who has no intention of letting it become a hobby...

    If you like and can afford the Bose, buy it...if you wish to research and shop around (i.e. let it become a hobby) have at it...ultimately the choice is yours.

    With regard to size vs. sound...it all depends...good things can come in small packages and some larger things can be real dogs...and price is not necessarily an accurate indicator of quality either...

    And FWIW, the 901s (at least the Series ll, the ones I have owned for 30+ yrs.) are quite good, just a different take on the notion of what is hi-fi...

    jimHJJ(...good listening...)
    Hello, I'm a misanthrope...don't ask me why, just take a good look around.

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    If you repeat a lie often enough, some will believe it to be the truth...

  12. #12
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    what about:

    small speakers with huge sound, that still sounds reasonable at higher volume, are physically impossible?

    what do you understand as "small"
    and why do you need small ones?
    bigger ones are really much better, and they're better looking too...


    Greetings,
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    Life is music!

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  13. #13
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Many great examples of better systems for less money above already. Even more still exists depending on your tastes.
    Best bet is really to wait a bit. Give yourself a chance to hear some of these suggestions as well as others before you buy. Try not to rush into it and then find something you like a lot better for less money.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  14. #14
    test the blind blindly emorphien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resident Loser
    If you like and can afford the Bose, buy it...if you wish to research and shop around (i.e. let it become a hobby) have at it...ultimately the choice is yours.
    Exactly

  15. #15
    Suspended topspeed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by emorphien
    I'd disagree, they're rather bad and very overpriced
    The 301's and 601's aren't bad for the price. For a small monitor, I've heard a lot worse.

    'Course, I've heard better, too!

  16. #16
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    My budget for a bose system was about $1500. If I could find another system for around $1000, I'd be happier But of course, I'm always a fan of getting good stuff at lower prices. Hey, maybe I should look at Wal-Mart. Er, wait, they just have stuff. No good stuff.
    Now about the small speakers, I think it's pretty important. I don't want some big speakers taking up my living room space. If I did, I would keep the speakers I have and just buy a new amp, eq, & dvd. Something that I can either mount on a wall or place on a shelf.

  17. #17
    Color me gone... Resident Loser's Avatar
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    Small speakers...

    Quote Originally Posted by michaewlewis
    My budget for a bose system was about $1500. If I could find another system for around $1000, I'd be happier But of course, I'm always a fan of getting good stuff at lower prices. Hey, maybe I should look at Wal-Mart. Er, wait, they just have stuff. No good stuff.
    Now about the small speakers, I think it's pretty important. I don't want some big speakers taking up my living room space. If I did, I would keep the speakers I have and just buy a new amp, eq, & dvd. Something that I can either mount on a wall or place on a shelf.
    ...generally do not provide bass sufficient for the LFEs of HT...if that is your intent...You either need a full range system capable of suitable low range extension or smaller mains with a sub woofer...Subs require valuable real estate AND when positioned optimally, usually have a low WAF...No way around it, lo-freqs need to push a lot of air and most smaller, decor sensitive, loudspeakers just won't cut it...

    jimHJJ(...this is one case where size definitely matters...)
    Hello, I'm a misanthrope...don't ask me why, just take a good look around.

    "Men would rather believe than know" -Sociobiology: The New Synthesis by Edward O. Wilson

    "The great masses of the people...will more easily fall victims to a great lie than to a small one" -Adolph Hitler

    "We are never deceived, we deceive ourselves" -Goethe

    If you repeat a lie often enough, some will believe it to be the truth...

  18. #18
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    If you can squeeze out a little more room and go with bookshelf speakers you'll get a much better sound. Something that goes below 80htz and then the sub can get the rest below that. Those tiny speakers usually don't go below 100 or 120htz leaving you with a gap of frequencies that don't keep up with the rest of your system. There are tons of decent bookshelf speakers that can be had for around $100 a pair. Mate them with a $500 receiver and you'll have better sound than any of the Lifestyle systems can offer.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  19. #19
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    yeah,
    and no, bookshelf speakers aren't huge...
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  20. #20
    nightflier
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    Not to back the Bose option, but I think what the original poster is also asking is for something that looks good. For all the bad press, no one ever said that Bose looks bad. For those people buying new homes or going to Tweeter/Magnolia/Etc. to buy a system, they are oogling in-wall solutions and slick all-in-one packages like the Bose lifestyle system. They are also comparing this to what their friends and neighbors have installed. Given the huge surge in all-built-in systems everywhere, it's likely that a good old separates setup with bookshelf speakers on stands just isn't going to be as sexy.

    Let's face it, all the magazine ads, all the TV spots, all the advertising dollars are being diverted to all-in-one, unobtrusive, techy, and small systems with iPod-like interfaces built-into-the-walls. Just look at the ads in Sound & Vision, The Perfect Vision, and all the other A/V trade-rags: even tower speakers are pushed back to the walls, subs are tucked under coffee tables, cables are squeezed through tiny conduits, and components are all behind in-wall cabinet doors - hardly the best setup for optimal sound. Bose is designing systems that fit into this culture.

    Sure, michaewlewis, can purchase an SVS speaker system, but then he still has to hunt down all the other components from different manufacturers, with cables hanging down the back and around the room. Fact is, for an all-in-one system, Bose looks like it's right out of Star Trek and it's the right price-point. The truth is that people who buy Bose don't care about sound quality but sound quantity - that is: "can I get my gazillion MP3s playing all through the house?"

    When I first read the post, my recommendation was going to be:

    - Gallo speakers
    - B&W sub (that round one that would match so nicely)
    - NAD L-53
    - Audioquest in-wall cables

    Now, that would be a system that would blow the Bose out of the room. But that's not going to cost $2K, either. Fact is, if you want sexy and good sound, you have to pay for it. If you want marginally better sound than Bose, and to pay less, you'd have to compromise with something like:

    - Polk RM 10
    - LG LST-3510A
    - Home Depot in-wall speaker cables

    At that point you have to ask yourself, should I have paid an extra $200 to impress my friends with the well known Bose name? Most of us here will say hell no, but can we be so sure that others (and we all know them) won't want the Bose Lifestyle?

  21. #21
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightflier
    Not to back the Bose option, but I think what the original poster is also asking is for something that looks good. For all the bad press, no one ever said that Bose looks bad. For those people buying new homes or going to Tweeter/Magnolia/Etc. to buy a system, they are oogling in-wall solutions and slick all-in-one packages like the Bose lifestyle system. They are also comparing this to what their friends and neighbors have installed. Given the huge surge in all-built-in systems everywhere, it's likely that a good old separates setup with bookshelf speakers on stands just isn't going to be as sexy.

    Let's face it, all the magazine ads, all the TV spots, all the advertising dollars are being diverted to all-in-one, unobtrusive, techy, and small systems with iPod-like interfaces built-into-the-walls. Just look at the ads in Sound & Vision, The Perfect Vision, and all the other A/V trade-rags: even tower speakers are pushed back to the walls, subs are tucked under coffee tables, cables are squeezed through tiny conduits, and components are all behind in-wall cabinet doors - hardly the best setup for optimal sound. Bose is designing systems that fit into this culture.

    Sure, michaewlewis, can purchase an SVS speaker system, but then he still has to hunt down all the other components from different manufacturers, with cables hanging down the back and around the room. Fact is, for an all-in-one system, Bose looks like it's right out of Star Trek and it's the right price-point. The truth is that people who buy Bose don't care about sound quality but sound quantity - that is: "can I get my gazillion MP3s playing all through the house?"

    When I first read the post, my recommendation was going to be:

    - Gallo speakers
    - B&W sub (that round one that would match so nicely)
    - NAD L-53
    - Audioquest in-wall cables

    Now, that would be a system that would blow the Bose out of the room. But that's not going to cost $2K, either. Fact is, if you want sexy and good sound, you have to pay for it. If you want marginally better sound than Bose, and to pay less, you'd have to compromise with something like:

    - Polk RM 10
    - LG LST-3510A
    - Home Depot in-wall speaker cables

    At that point you have to ask yourself, should I have paid an extra $200 to impress my friends with the well known Bose name? Most of us here will say hell no, but can we be so sure that others (and we all know them) won't want the Bose Lifestyle?
    I'd still rather have these speakers: http://www.accessories4less.com/cgi-...em/KEFKHT1005S

    And this receiver: http://www.accessories4less.com/cgi-.../MARSR4600BLKA
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  22. #22
    Crackhead Extraordinaire Dusty Chalk's Avatar
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    Yeah, those Kef's in all black look hot. And considering their legacy, should sound half decent...
    Eschew fascism.
    Truth Will Out.
    Quote Originally Posted by stevef22
    you guys are crackheads.
    I remain,
    Peter aka Dusty Chalk

  23. #23
    Forum Regular flippo's Avatar
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    Another small system that would sure beat Bose would be Mirage Omnisat system.

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