• 09-16-2006, 07:54 AM
    Swish
    Week 10: 50 Albums That Changed Music
    Two things; yes, this is early again for the second week in a row, but I have a busy day tomorrow and will then be gone for 4 days after that, so here it is. The other thing is that I somehow mislabled a couple of the prior weeks because Elvis was # 9, Dylan # 8, and this week is # 10. If you don't like it, call my complaint office at 1-800-Eat-Dirt.

    Anyway, this week's selection is a no-brainer, with The Beach Boys - Pet Sounds (1966). Of late, Pet Sounds has replaced Sgt. Pepper's as the critics' choice of Greatest Album of All Time. Composed by the increasingly reclusive Brian Wilson while the rest of the group were touring, it might well have been a solo album. The beauty resides not just in its compositional genius and instrumental invention, but in the elaborate vocal harmonies that imbue these sad songs with an almost heartbreaking grandeur. Without this....where to start? The Beatles acknowledged its influence; Dylan said of Brian Wilson, "That ear! I mean, Jesus, he's got to will that to the Smithsonian."

    I grew up listening to this band, although I didn't appreciate this record until I was much older, instead listening to their "hits" like most of my friends (I still really love "In My Room"). While I may stop short of calling this the "Greatest Album of All Time", it certainly should be considered among the very best and is among my all time favorites.

    Swish
  • 09-16-2006, 09:44 AM
    dean_martin
    I tried that number and got the White House.
  • 09-18-2006, 08:51 AM
    Resident Loser
    When I was...
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Swish
    Two things; yes, this is early again for the second week in a row, but I have a busy day tomorrow and will then be gone for 4 days after that, so here it is. The other thing is that I somehow mislabled a couple of the prior weeks because Elvis was # 9, Dylan # 8, and this week is # 10. If you don't like it, call my complaint office at 1-800-Eat-Dirt.

    Anyway, this week's selection is a no-brainer, with The Beach Boys - Pet Sounds (1966). Of late, Pet Sounds has replaced Sgt. Pepper's as the critics' choice of Greatest Album of All Time. Composed by the increasingly reclusive Brian Wilson while the rest of the group were touring, it might well have been a solo album. The beauty resides not just in its compositional genius and instrumental invention, but in the elaborate vocal harmonies that imbue these sad songs with an almost heartbreaking grandeur. Without this....where to start? The Beatles acknowledged its influence; Dylan said of Brian Wilson, "That ear! I mean, Jesus, he's got to will that to the Smithsonian."

    I grew up listening to this band, although I didn't appreciate this record until I was much older, instead listening to their "hits" like most of my friends (I still really love "In My Room"). While I may stop short of calling this the "Greatest Album of All Time", it certainly should be considered among the very best and is among my all time favorites.

    Swish

    ...sixteen, I brought it, unheard, to a party the night of the day I purchased it...it was not well received by my fellow party-goers who were obviously expecting some fun, fun, fun...

    Liked it then and still do now...Definitely struck a few chords, the sheet music was light-years beyond my noob-guitarist, first position fingering abilities...Sometimes I get the feeling that if I had a theme song, it would be I Just Wasn't Made For These Times...

    With accolades from the music press, and the likes Sir Paul, Eric Clapton and a host of others, who am I to argue?

    jimHJJ(...IMO definitely belongs on any list...)
  • 09-18-2006, 11:39 AM
    Troy
    My history with this album is weird. I ignored it for most of my life only to have it really grow on me in my 40s. It was like finding the missing link. I can now see the influence his production techniques, his daring use of disparate instruments and off the wall tonality had on all art-rock. One of my all-time favorite bands XTC owes Wilson a huge debt.

    I do think, however, that Wilson the man is an enormous PITA. A pompous, self-absorbed prima-donna that uses his metal illness as a sort of badge of honor. (just to be controversial)
  • 09-18-2006, 11:46 AM
    3-LockBox
    This is one of those albums I own, that I rarely listen to, because while I can certainly see it's impact on pop music, I just can't get into it for whatever reason. While most pop acts leaned toward the blues for inspiration, early Beach Boys were married to the pop standards of the '50s, in both musical and vocal approach. By the early 60s, they were the pop standard. I remeber a teacher of mine (way, way, back when) used to let us listen to music for 'quiet time' and she always played albums like the The Letterman, The Four Freshmen, Perry Como, Ray Conniff singers, etc. And, the Beach Boys. Whenever I hear early Beach Boys I can't help but putting them in that same relm of pop music as the affore mentioned acts.

    Pet Sounds is a notch above all that, and it is influencial enough to be on this list, though it should be higher on the list than 10th (just incase there's a particular order). This album did raise the bar for pop music, and pop albums as an artistic statement. The compositions and production were ahead of the game for the mid '60s and this album influenced everyone from The Beatles to Pink Floyd to Yes. I think I prefer everyone this album influenced over the original. Like I've stated before, some of the 'instrumentation' used on some of these songs drive me nuckin futs.

    Of course, this would be the band's last hurrah as far as leading edge pop would be concerned. The public couldn't get their squeaky clean image out of it's head and the Beach Boys would represent the very establishment that the hippy movement rebeled against. Further music experimentalism on the part of Brian Wilson left some fans (and band members) disgruntled and attempts by the rest of the band to embrace flower power couldn't change the fact that The Beach Boys were no longer in the fore front of pop music or pop culture. Sure they would continue to chart high with singles off and on, but it didn't help that their own leader/singer/songwriter/producer/genius Brian Wilson was driving himself nuckin futs trying to trump The Beatles.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Troy
    My history with this album is weird. I ignored it for most of my life only to have it really grow on me in my 40s. It was like finding the missing link. I can now see the influence his production techniques, his daring use of disparate instruments and off the wall tonality had on all art-rock. One of my all-time favorite bands XTC owes Wilson a huge debt.

    I do think, however, that Wilson the man is an enormous PITA. A pompous, self-absorbed prima-donna that uses his metal illness as a sort of badge of honor. (just to be controversial)

    I agree on all counts, espcially those who seem to champion his mental ill-health, which has as more to do with his self-destructive tendancies than anything hereditary.

    But yes, even XTC was influenced, enough so that they paid homage to the Beach Boys with their Dukes Of Stratosphere album, particularly the song Pale And Precious, in which Andy Partridge channeled Wilson at his best.
  • 09-18-2006, 11:49 AM
    Dusty Chalk
    So when are we going to get to the good albums on this list?
  • 09-18-2006, 12:40 PM
    3-LockBox
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Dusty Chalk
    So when are we going to get to the good albums on this list?

    I'm afraid this is as good as it gets.
  • 09-18-2006, 05:55 PM
    BradH
    I was listening to the Hoffman/DCC disc of this the other day. Wow! Head and shoulders above any other remaster I've heard. I think this was the technical and artistic pinnacle of the 60's L.A. music machine and its session players. The Bay Area bands called that scene the Hollywood Handjob but once you get outside the Dead, Country Joe's debut and Moby Grape, imo there's nothing there that can stack up against the Beach Boys, Byrds, Zappa, Love and Buffalo Springfield. All of these L.A. bands went through the machine. (Even Carol Kaye is on Zappa's Freak Out.) Heck, even the Monkees became a real band after two albums. But Pet Sounds took that studio process into the stratosphere, never to be equaled. It wasn't done with studio wizardry or gimmickry, it was done with studio performance; I think a lot of people misunderstand that.

    3-Lock: "Of course, this would be the band's last hurrah as far as leading edge pop would be concerned. The public couldn't get their squeaky clean image out of it's head and the Beach Boys would represent the very establishment that the hippy movement rebeled against."

    Not showing up at Monterey was a huge mistake they never recovered from. I don't think they would've been rejected. Most of those kids were suburban students with about six months of hair down their neck and had never seen most of those acts. It was Hendrix's first time in the U.S. since leaving Greenwich Village, The Who's first time to the West Coast, most of the Bay Area bands had never played outside the Bay Area and almost none of those kids had ever seen a soul performer onstage, much less one as powerful as Otis Redding. Buffalo Springfield were huge in L.A. and nowhere else. Wasn't Ravi Shankar there? So, it was a real mix of things coming together for the first time. So, why not the Beach Boys? The BB's identified early that the money was going into a shady real estate deal but hell it was their sound system everybody was using.

    Troy: "I do think, however, that Wilson the man is an enormous PITA. A pompous, self-absorbed prima-donna that uses his metal illness as a sort of badge of honor. (just to be controversial)"

    Mike Love certainly saw it that way. But Love was about half-wacked himself. Don't forget, he's got those same genes from his mom. He had to be put in a straight-jacket at one point. But I've never seen Brian Wilson milk it in public, ever. Not once. In fact, most interviewers try to get all heavy and mythologize his career but he always stays casual, factual and down to earth. No messiah schtick for this guy.

    Btw, Troy, what is a "metal illness". I swear, this board gets the coolest mispellings I've ever seen.
  • 09-19-2006, 11:59 AM
    3-LockBox
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by BradH
    Btw, Troy, what is a "metal illness". I swear, this board gets the coolest mispellings I've ever seen.

    It's the same thing Ozzy has ;)
  • 09-21-2006, 05:30 AM
    MasterCylinder
    good pick
    I had the pleasure of working a Beach Boy tour (and many, many others) in the mid-70s (right after the release of HOLLAND). I was working for a major pro-sound and lighting company at that time.

    Caroline No is still one of my all-time favorite songs - well done.
  • 09-22-2006, 05:42 AM
    shokhead
    Heard it,didnt like it and none of my friends did either. BTW,when's the last time anyone has heard a song from it on the radio? Just wondering because i dont listen to the radio.
  • 09-22-2006, 06:33 AM
    Resident Loser
    Might have heard...
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by shokhead
    Heard it,didnt like it and none of my friends did either. BTW,when's the last time anyone has heard a song from it on the radio? Just wondering because i dont listen to the radio.

    ...Sloop John B within the last year or so...but come to think of it there isn't much I or my peer group find listenable on the airwaves other than classical or jazz...IMNSHO modern music, generally speaking, pretty much s*ucks with a capital s*uck...there are some exceptions, but not enough of them to shake me from that position...

    jimHJJ(...I like The Little Willies, a newer group doing mostly older songs, actually written by folks who could write proper music...)

    AND a big P.S. It may very well have been the first album to use a SOTA Ampex 8-track recorder...also had a veritable who's-who of top session folks...BW used electronic instruments and other studio/editing effects, etc...so whether the material is up to your standards is insignificant (...and BTW it's quite complex in that aspect...)...there are legitimate reasons for it to be on this list, and more so than some other inclusions IMO...
  • 09-22-2006, 06:35 AM
    Swish
    What does the radio have to do with influence?
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by shokhead
    Heard it,didnt like it and none of my friends did either. BTW,when's the last time anyone has heard a song from it on the radio? Just wondering because i dont listen to the radio.

    It did get radio play back in the day, but that has nothing to do with this thread or the top 50 Albums that Changed Music. Why don't you sit back, have a drink, and come up with something useful to add about why you do or do not think this album was influential. The fact that you don't like it means nothing in regard to its influence.

    Jeezum dude!

    Swish
  • 09-22-2006, 08:20 AM
    shokhead
    Did you say something?
  • 09-22-2006, 01:57 PM
    Swish
    No, I typed something.
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by shokhead
    Did you say something?

    Reading your drivel just annoyed me because you didn't type anything relevant to the topic. If you don't care, then I guess you don't, so whatever.

    Swish
  • 09-22-2006, 03:49 PM
    shokhead
    Are you pissy today or what? I could check your old posts for drivel but as we all do it from time to time i wont. Have a drink on me,it should help.
  • 09-22-2006, 07:15 PM
    MindGoneHaywire
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by shokhead
    Heard it,didnt like it and none of my friends did either. BTW,when's the last time anyone has heard a song from it on the radio? Just wondering because i dont listen to the radio.

    Interesting, given yr praise of the Beatles, since they considered it great, as did George Martin. Of course, everyone's entitled to their opinion. But...did yr friends all dislike the Beatles' music also? This here's as succinct a dismissal of this rec I think I've ever seen put forth by someone who actually claims to have liked the music of the Beatles. Given the musical response of the Fab Four to this rec (certain tunes on recs like Revolver & Sgt. Pepper, especially stuff like Here, There, & Everywhere), it's just sorta difficult to imagine what a Beatles fan wouldn't like about toons like Wouldn't It Be Nice, God Only Knows, et al. Perhaps you'd care to elaborate beyond 'heard it, didn't like it?'

    Sloop John B, Wouldn't It Be Nice, & God Only Knows remain on quite a few radio playlists.
  • 09-22-2006, 07:28 PM
    shokhead
    I have no clue what the Beatles have to do with it but if you do thats great. Either ya like something or ya dont. It just didnt do anything for me. Should i say i'm sorry? Geez louise. Now let me go see how much this chick is winning on D or no D.
    BTW,i dont like every Beatle tune,not by a longshot. In fact i dont care for the WA but for 2 or 3 songs.
  • 09-22-2006, 07:59 PM
    MindGoneHaywire
    Well, in case you missed it over the past 10 weeks, this line of threads is based on some UK writers' assessment of the influence of a list of 50 records they put together. Some choose to post based on that concept, others are content to let us know whether or not they like the rec in question.

    If you think that I care that you don't like the rec, you are sorely mistaken. But since you have told us that you do like the Beatles, then I would suggest it does have a bearing, since they are considered the most popular, celebrated, and famous rock group of the 1960s, if not all time...and this here rec arguably had as much of an impact on their music as any other. That may not mean anything to you, but then why bother posting if you don't care about the influence this record had? I mean, I wouldn't want to interrupt yr television show & all. No need to apologize, either.

    When people who are interested enough in music to post on message boards say they like one band, but don't like the record that is thought of as having inspired that band to arguably their greatest artistic triumph, yet have so little to say about it, it strikes me as just a bit odd.
  • 09-23-2006, 05:01 AM
    shokhead
    You can have the last word so this can get back on track. BTW, just like the Beatles i like most the BB stuff,just not this one.
  • 09-24-2006, 10:00 AM
    Swish
    You could say that.
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by shokhead
    Are you pissy today or what? I could check your old posts for drivel but as we all do it from time to time i wont. Have a drink on me,it should help.

    Your post just hit me the wrong way, especially because it had to do with a record that many people, including me, believe is among the best ever recorded, and by a band that deserves their props. They were as important to me as the Beatles since I grew up in the 60s and 70s..

    Your radio comment was the part that really got to me the. I mean WTF does radio have to do with it? Most of what I listen to, thankfully, will never be heard on the radio, and any serious music enthusiast would never consider radio exposure as the barometer for "good music". That's like saying McDonald's makes the best burgers because they've served "billions".

    Ok, it's off my chest now. I'll let it be.

    Swish
  • 09-24-2006, 11:07 AM
    shokhead
    I was guessing at the radio play as i dont listen to the radio but for news. Many consider pet sounds one of the best recorded as many belive the Beatles are the best. I like some of each. All in the eyes of the beholder. Dont forget,the east coast didnt know what the beachboys was for awhile but i agree,they should get props and are very under rated. They are almost never talked about when best bands come up.
  • 09-25-2006, 08:26 AM
    Resident Loser
    On which planet?
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by shokhead
    Dont forget,the east coast didnt know what the beachboys was for awhile but i agree,they should get props and are very under rated. They are almost never talked about when best bands come up.

    ...here in the Big Apple in the early/mid-60s, in addition to Dion (with or wIthout the Belmonts), groups from Philly and Motown, West coast groups like the BBs and Jan and Dean did indeed have a following, particularly among the chino/penny-loafer crowd, AKA the "collegiates"...and Pendleton's (or CPOs) were all the rage, mine was navy blue...Why, golly gee, we even done heard of the Kingston Trio!...

    jimHJJ(..."almost never talked about..." as a best band...man, where do I begin with that one????...)
  • 09-25-2006, 09:07 AM
    Heywood Djahblomie
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Resident Loser
    ...chino/penny-loafer crowd, AKA the "collegiates"...and Pendleton's (or CPOs) were all the rage, mine was navy blue...

    Oh...you were one of those


    did you live the the Village?


    not that there's anything wrong with that


    :ciappa:
  • 09-25-2006, 10:33 AM
    Resident Loser
    You're...
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Heywood Djahblomie
    Oh...you were one of those


    did you live the the Village?


    not that there's anything wrong with that


    :ciappa:

    ...confusing the outer-borough, collegiate-dressed, preppy-types with the post-beat, psuedo-bohemian, NYU/Washington Square, coffee-house folkies...

    jimHJJ(...as I recall beer was our beverage of choice...)