• 09-01-2006, 07:55 PM
    bubslewis
    Like Geoffcin's setup...kinda
    I have this rinky dink little powered subwoofer (100 W) from an HT-in-a-box set. I have it tied into my system and I use it mostly when watching DVD/movies.

    I don't use it when I listen to music thru my Maggie 1.6's. The thing only goes down to 40 Hz and that's no lower than the Maggies. I just use the "pure direct" thru the a/v receiver to an external amp to the Maggies for music listening.

    The few times that I have used the subwoofer with the Maggies, it just seems to drag behind the Maggies. Very disconcerting and not at all pleasant. Planar speakers have always been described as "fast". Am only partially sure what that means but the little sub certainly sounds "slow" when paired up with the Maggies.

    I notice that one of our truly worthy moderators employs two 15" Velodyne subs with his Maggie 3.6's. This prompts the following questions:

    If I wanted to upgrade my subwoofer to help out the Maggies, would I still run into the same type of slow vs fast problems? Are there slower and faster types of subwoofers? How much might subwoofer placement contribute to the problem?

    Geoffcin, I was wondering if you had the same type obstacles to overcome when you originally set up your speaker system?

    tx,
    Bill
  • 09-01-2006, 08:14 PM
    Florian
    Well, Geof wont get a seemless blend either BUT this is mopstly not because the subwoofer is too slow but that the frequencys are not time aligned, not in phase and the room plays a huge role. Read up on it on the TACT website ;-)

    Very cool info, and the integration can work but its not easy.
  • 09-02-2006, 06:36 AM
    JoeE SP9
    What do you have the crossover point set to? It "sounds" as if the setting is too high. Set it for 80hz or lower.:cool:
  • 09-04-2006, 07:09 AM
    Feanor
    I understand the problem
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bubslewis
    ...
    I don't use it when I listen to music thru my Maggie 1.6's. The thing only goes down to 40 Hz and that's no lower than the Maggies. I just use the "pure direct" thru the a/v receiver to an external amp to the Maggies for music listening.

    The few times that I have used the subwoofer with the Maggies, it just seems to drag behind the Maggies. Very disconcerting and not at all pleasant. Planar speakers have always been described as "fast". Am only partially sure what that means but the little sub certainly sounds "slow" when paired up with the Maggies.
    ...

    I miss the bottom octave with my MG 1.6's too. For a while I was using a PSB Subsonic 6 with with them: not too bad but I think I was having some of the same issues as you. When my HT sub died, I demoted the Subsonic to duty there, but someday I'd like to find a sub that really works with the Maggies.

    My tyro theory is that a sub with very quick transient response would be a better match with the 1.6's. Closed-box systems have the reputation of having better transient response, so I've been considering a DIY effort using a Dayton Reference Hi-Fi driver, probably the 12". I'm wondering whether to drive this with Parts Express' 500 watt BASH plate amp or a Behringer EP1500. If I go ahead with this project, I'll let everyone know my impression of the results.
  • 09-05-2006, 09:49 AM
    E-Stat
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bubslewis
    The thing only goes down to 40 Hz and that's no lower than the Maggies...The few times that I have used the subwoofer with the Maggies, it just seems to drag behind the Maggies. Very disconcerting and not at all pleasant. Planar speakers have always been described as "fast". Am only partially sure what that means but the little sub certainly sounds "slow" when paired up with the Maggies.

    While I agree that getting direct radiator subs to work well with bipolars is tricky, I think the "slow" vs "fast" issue is really about proper blending. The tendency for most folks is to run the subs at a higher level than they should. That simply "fattens" the bass, especially the upper bass.

    I was reminded of that recently after a move. I needed to recalibrate my HT system in its new room. The mains are small Polks that have decent response down to about 50 hz. Using a Radio Shack SPL meter and a Stereophile test CD, I was able to get the levels matched. Using a high pass setting of 40 hz for the mains, it required setting the sub on its lowest setting (50hz) at a fairly low gain setting to add the bottom octave without adding to the upper ones.

    You will rarely hear a well blended sub. It should never call attention to itself. It should only speak when the program material really requires it and unless you're a pipe organ freak, that isn't too frequent.

    rw
  • 09-05-2006, 04:20 PM
    bubslewis
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by JoeE SP9
    What do you have the crossover point set to? It "sounds" as if the setting is too high. Set it for 80hz or lower.:cool:

    Correction. The sub only goes down to 50 Hz. The crossover Hz dial is not indexed, just goes from 50 all the way counter clockwise to 150 all the way clock wise. For sure, if I turn it all the way up to 150 it sounds awful. Usually I have it set somewhere just short of middle, which I guess would be around 90 Hz or so. Will tweak it downwards. Thanks for the tip.
  • 09-05-2006, 06:11 PM
    E-Stat
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bubslewis
    Correction. The sub only goes down to 50 Hz. The crossover Hz dial is not indexed, just goes from 50 all the way counter clockwise to 150 all the way clock wise. For sure, if I turn it all the way up to 150 it sounds awful. Usually I have it set somewhere just short of middle, which I guess would be around 90 Hz or so. Will tweak it downwards. Thanks for the tip.

    Keep in mind that is the crossover point, not cutoff point. Even when set to 50hz, there will still be considerable output an octave higher.

    rw