• 08-05-2008, 06:24 AM
    thxpaul
    Yamaha RX-V3800 Ventilation.
    Hi I have a question about the RX-V3800 and it's temperature/ventilation.

    I've recently upgraded from a Yamaha RX-V2300 to the 3800 and the unit runs considerably hotter than the 2300 did. The manual states that it requires 30 cm on top and 20cm on each side of the unit for ventilation.

    The old 2300 manual says the same thing but i ran the 2300 for 6 years in a space with about 7 inches of open space above it and about an inch or so on each side. It's in a cabinet and while this isn't an enclosed space it's not near the 20cm on each side like the manual states.

    My question is whether or not it's safe to place the 3800 in the same space even though it runs a little hotter? There's plenty of air circulation on the top of the unit but the sides dont have 20cm since its in a wall unit. Will this be ok? Thanks in advance for any help!
  • 08-05-2008, 07:23 AM
    GMichael
    How hot is hot? Can you hold your hand on it for a few seconds? Or can you fry an egg with it?
  • 08-05-2008, 07:32 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by GMichael
    How hot is hot? Can you hold your hand on it for a few seconds? Or can you fry an egg with it?

    I can firmly place my hand on it and leave it there. It's not hot enough to cause pain where i can't touch it. But it does feel as though it runs a little hotter than my previous receiver (the rxv2300)

    I can drop the shelf even lower to give it around 8 or 9 inches of ventilation on top. the front of the shelf it totally open, no glass doors or anything. But the manual suggests 8 inches on each side?!? There's no way I can do that with my current furniture. I've never seen a setup that allowed that much room...

    Up until now I thought I was being OVER generous with the ventilation i gave it (approx 7" on top) but then i see the manual suggests a FOOT on top and 8 inches on each side... and now I'm worried because I can't give it that much space on each side.

    opinions?
  • 08-05-2008, 07:39 AM
    GMichael
    It should be fine. It wouldn't hurt to give it extra room if you can. But I doubt that it really needs it.
  • 08-05-2008, 07:45 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by GMichael
    It should be fine. It wouldn't hurt to give it extra room if you can. But I doubt that it really needs it.

    The sides of the wall unit ar fixed so i cant make the shelf "wider" but i can give it a little more room on top if needed. I just never knew so much space was needed on the SIDE before... i always thought the top of the unit was what mattered in terms of ventilation.
  • 08-05-2008, 07:59 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    thxpaul,

    I have a very similar setup as you, with my 3800 inside an audio cabinet with only about 1" - 2" on the sides. It's more important to have ventilation above, as air is entering from the sides and exhausting out the top. There's about 7" - 8" above mine and everything is fine. You shouldn't have any problems. :thumbsup: on your purchase too!
  • 08-05-2008, 08:06 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rich-n-Texas
    thxpaul,

    I have a very similar setup as you, with my 3800 inside an audio cabinet with only about 1" - 2" on the sides. It's more important to have ventilation above, as air is entering from the sides and exhausting out the top. There's about 7" - 8" above mine and everything is fine. You shouldn't have any problems. :thumbsup: on your purchase too!

    Thanks for the replies guys! More are welcome!

    texas, do you find the temperature levels of the 3800 to be about average for a receiver of such output?

    As I stated I'm just worried now since i discovered what's printed in the 3800 manual - but then i went back to the 2300's manual and discovered the exact same 20-20-30cm ventilation sugggestions for that model as well... so perhaps Yamaha is just erring on the side of caution and using the same guidelines for every receiver manual.
  • 08-05-2008, 08:24 AM
    GMichael
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by thxpaul
    Thanks for the replies guys! More are welcome!

    texas, do you find the temperature levels of the 3800 to be about average for a receiver of such output?

    As I stated I'm just worried now since i discovered what's printed in the 3800 manual - but then i went back to the 2300's manual and discovered the exact same 20-20-30cm ventilation sugggestions for that model as well... so perhaps Yamaha is just erring on the side of caution and using the same guidelines for every receiver manual.

    It's typical for manufactures to be very cautious with what they tell you. Especially in writing. They are just covering their butts.
  • 08-05-2008, 08:37 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by thxpaul
    Thanks for the replies guys! More are welcome!

    No problem!

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by thxpaul
    texas, do you find the temperature levels of the 3800 to be about average for a receiver of such output?

    Yes. You should put your hand on top of an Onkyo of similar ilk. You WON'T be able to leave your hand on it.

    Mind you, mine runs slightly cooler because I'm not driving my power hungry speakers with it, but only slightly. I like my rock-n-roll LOUD, and even before I added an amp to the picture, it still ran cooler than an Onkyo in operation.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by thxpaul
    As I stated I'm just worried now since i discovered what's printed in the 3800 manual - but then i went back to the 2300's manual and discovered the exact same 20-20-30cm ventilation sugggestions for that model as well... so perhaps Yamaha is just erring on the side of caution and using the same guidelines for every receiver manual.

    No worries dude. GM is right. It's like torque management for a car. The manufacturer wants to get the automatic transmission through the warranty period, so he retards timing during the shift.
  • 08-05-2008, 09:49 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rich-n-Texas
    No problem!


    Yes. You should put your hand on top of an Onkyo of similar ilk. You WON'T be able to leave your hand on it.

    Mind you, mine runs slightly cooler because I'm not driving my power hungry speakers with it, but only slightly. I like my rock-n-roll LOUD, and even before I added an amp to the picture, it still ran cooler than an Onkyo in operation.


    No worries dude. GM is right. It's like torque management for a car. The manufacturer wants to get the automatic transmission through the warranty period, so he retards timing during the shift.

    Yeah I used to own a Technics receiver about 10 years ago that would get so hot it was scary. It literally felt like food would cook on it.

    How hot did your 3800 get while it was driving speakers? The speakers I'm driving are a set of mission 700 series which are relatively easy for the 3800 to power I assume since they're not terribly demanding.
  • 08-05-2008, 09:56 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    I think I remember posting the temp measurement I took when I first got the receiver and had the B&W's connected directly. IIRC it was 90 degrees air temp above the grill with the cabinet door closed.
  • 08-05-2008, 10:13 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rich-n-Texas
    I think I remember posting the temp measurement I took when I first got the receiver and had the B&W's connected directly. IIRC it was 90 degrees air temp above the grill with the cabinet door closed.

    Yeah I guess I'd need a thermometer to get a reading on mine. I've just been reading about how heat will shrink the life of a receiver and it makes me a little paranoid. :)

    Tonight I'm going to drop the shelf another notch or two I think. But the 1.5" clearance on each side of the unit will have to do i guess
  • 08-05-2008, 11:02 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    Not to worry. Just enjoy the music. :thumbsup:
  • 08-05-2008, 11:08 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rich-n-Texas
    Not to worry. Just enjoy the music. :thumbsup:

    Cheers mate!

    Since you're a 3800 owner as well I want to ask you a question. My previous 2300 sounded almost as though without any setup whatsoever, it had a little more bass right out of the box. The 3800 sounds a little less bassy to me and if i want to achieve the same level I almost need to adjust the bass tone another dB or so.

    Aside from being a different unit, why might this be?
  • 08-05-2008, 11:33 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    Well, this one I can't help ya with. From day one I've had issues with lower frequencies and my listening area. Room modes they call them. :mad: I can walk behind the couch and get good low end, but if I walk inside the area about 10' away from my mains, bass almost completely disappears. Things improved greatly when I added the amp, but the phenomenon still exists.

    Do you have or are you adding a subwoofer to your setup?
  • 08-05-2008, 11:35 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rich-n-Texas
    Well, this one I can't help ya with. From day one I've had issues with lower frequencies and my listening area. Room modes they call them. :mad: I can walk behind the couch and get good low end, but if I walk inside the area about 10' away from my mains, bass almost completely disappears. Things improved greatly when I added the amp, but the phenomenon still exists.

    Do you have or are you adding a subwoofer to your setup?

    I DID have a mission 70ASA sub up until last october but the amp inside it blew so I've yet to replace it. Up until now bass levels with my fronts were good without the sub powered by the 2300 - but the 3800 sounds as though bass levels are set lower by default or something, nothing an adjustment can't fix - but on my 2300 I didn't play with the treble/bass knobs at all and the bass was stronger.
  • 08-05-2008, 11:50 AM
    GMichael
    Have you run the auto set-up yet? Out of the box, there's no telling what settings you have.
  • 08-05-2008, 11:51 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    There are certainly pluses and minuses to having so much flexibility in a receiver, but I'll take it any day. It's a complicated machine so keep the manual handy. Frankly, I'd put the 2300 out of my mind. The 3800 is the here and now IMO.
  • 08-05-2008, 11:51 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by GMichael
    Have you run the auto set-up yet? Out of the box, there's no telling what settings you have.

    Hey if you're talking about the YPAO setup with the microphone, then yes i ran it but it unbalanced all my speakers and I didn't really like that. Like the left surround was +2 while the right was .5... why the need for different levels?

    Is there any other type of auto setup i should do?
  • 08-05-2008, 12:05 PM
    GMichael
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by thxpaul
    Hey if you're talking about the YPAO setup with the microphone, then yes i ran it but it unbalanced all my speakers and I didn't really like that. Like the left surround was +2 while the right was .5... why the need for different levels?

    Is there any other type of auto setup i should do?

    That's the one. I expect that the distances from each speaker to where you had the mic (where you sit) were not all the same. That's why it sets different levels. This is so that they all sound the same where you are sitting.
    I don't like how it sets the EQ's either. I set each of them to flat when I'm done. Also, the set up doesn't do that great of a job with the sub levels. I always end up turning that up after it's done.
  • 08-05-2008, 04:00 PM
    thxpaul
    Okay so, I dropped the unit another 2 inches in the shelf just for safe measure. I took a logical look at it and there's no way the thing's not getting enough ventilation now....

    I attached a pic just to provide a better idea of the room I've given this thing.

    Ran it for a couple of hours solid and i think the reason (or part of the reason) it feels hotter than my 2300 is because the arc heat sink is pretty close to the top grille.... where as on the 2300 the heat sink/amplifier was deeper in the unit...

    that's an educated guess based on what I can see through the top vents.

    upward and onward :)

    OH one more thing, I've noticed that when listening to the CD player, attached with standard RCA analogue cables - the amp runs a little warmer than when listening to a BluRay soundtrack through the fibre optic connection... why's that?

    http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/8923/rxv3800kr4.jpg
  • 08-06-2008, 09:33 AM
    thxpaul
    "OH one more thing, I've noticed that when listening to the CD player, attached with standard RCA analogue cables - the amp runs a little warmer than when listening to a BluRay soundtrack through the fibre optic connection... why's that?"

    Anybody? :)
  • 08-06-2008, 10:01 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    Can I make a suggestion?

    Don't worry about it! :hand:
  • 08-06-2008, 10:05 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rich-n-Texas
    Can I make a suggestion?

    Don't worry about it! :hand:

    I'm not exactly worried :) I'm just curious why a 2ch. output would warm the amp up more than a 5ch output. Seems as though it should be the reverse no?
  • 08-06-2008, 10:21 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    Did the ambient (room) temperature change during your checks?
  • 08-06-2008, 10:28 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rich-n-Texas
    Did the ambient (room) temperature change during your checks?

    Room temp? Haha no way. I'm just going on what I feel when I put my hand flat against the top grille.
  • 08-06-2008, 10:30 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    What part of the grille? Same place everytime? Are you feeling the area where the power transistors are layed out?
  • 08-06-2008, 10:32 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rich-n-Texas
    What part of the grille? Same place everytime? Are you feeling the area where the power transistors are layed out?

    Forgive my ignorance but I'm not exactly sure where those are... :(

    The part that seems to heat up most is directly at the front right above the heat sink.

    The right side of the unit and the back corner also heat up a little.
  • 08-06-2008, 10:40 AM
    GMichael
    Not for nothin', but you guys seem to be feeling up your receivers a little much. Have you at least taken them out to lunch first?:ihih:
  • 08-06-2008, 10:43 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by GMichael
    Not for nothin', but you guys seem to be feeling up your receivers a little much. Have you at least taken them out to lunch first?:ihih:

    For that money I better be able to grope whenever and wherever I please
  • 08-06-2008, 10:58 AM
    GMichael
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by thxpaul
    For that money I better be able to grope whenever and wherever I please ;)

    Are you blowing me a kiss?
  • 08-06-2008, 11:02 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by GMichael
    Are you blowing me a kiss?

    ...whatever do you mean?! lol
  • 08-06-2008, 11:10 AM
    GMichael
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by thxpaul
    ...whatever do you mean?! lol

    Thanks. I feel safer now.
  • 08-06-2008, 02:58 PM
    thxpaul
    Here's a question that is stumping me...

    Why is it that when I select DolbyTrueHD on a bluray disc connected to my receiver with a fiber optic cable that the "trueHD" light on the 3800's front panel doesn't light up? It just stays at dolby digital?
  • 08-07-2008, 12:47 AM
    pixelthis
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by thxpaul
    Here's a question that is stumping me...

    Why is it that when I select DolbyTrueHD on a bluray disc connected to my receiver with a fiber optic cable that the "trueHD" light on the 3800's front panel doesn't light up? It just stays at dolby digital?

    ITS GOTTA GO thru that gateway of DRM, the HDMI cable.
    If your receiver doesnt have HDMI 1.3 you are screw-dooed.
    Sorry.:1:
  • 08-07-2008, 04:43 AM
    thxpaul
    I hate to beat a dead horse but the heat coming off the 3800 is really starting to concern me. After some 2 channel music at a moderate volume the thing is so hot that its borderline painful to the touch. My old Yammy didn't get anywhere NEAR this hot and I used to push it harder for longer.

    I have a gut feeling this isn't normal. :(
  • 08-07-2008, 02:12 PM
    thxpaul
    GAH! now the front display on the unit has started flickering and acting all glitchy. ...the hell?!

    Back to the store for this puppy.
  • 08-13-2008, 04:15 AM
    thxpaul
    Can anybody tell me if the left side of their front panel display flickers slightly when they dim the display all the way?

    I exchanged my 3800 for an 1800 and it's doing the exact same thing. I figure it's just something they all do.

    It's fine when the display is at full brightness. Then as I dim it a couple of the little icons on the left side of the display flicker slightly.
  • 08-13-2008, 05:18 AM
    Rich-n-Texas
    I'm beginning to wonder about you dude. You exchanged your 3800 for an 1800, which completely goes against the grain of ANY audio enthusiast, based on things which have NO effect on the performance of the unit. You sacrificed a very capable unit for one with so many fewer features and now you ask if other people have the same condition? You've been a member here since 2003 right? What was your previous identity? Maybe that'll give us a little background about you.
  • 08-13-2008, 05:30 AM
    thxpaul
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Rich-n-Texas
    I'm beginning to wonder about you dude. You exchanged your 3800 for an 1800, which completely goes against the grain of ANY audio enthusiast, based on things which have NO effect on the performance of the unit. You sacrificed a very capable unit for one with so many fewer features and now you ask if other people have the same condition? You've been a member here since 2003 right? What was your previous identity? Maybe that'll give us a little background about you.

    Then I suppose you would really have a hard time swallowing the fact that the 1800 sounds better than the 3800 did? When in fact it seems to be the case. The 3800 seemed to lack punch in the low end, and for some reason the less capable 1800 with it's 10 less watts per channel seems to sound better than the 3800 did. Maybe it's better suited to my speakers because of the lower wattage? Hell I don't know and personally don't really care but it was a nice little bonus to my "downgrade" :)

    Aanyways the network capabilities of the 3800 would be wasted on me. Why pay an extra $500 for things I'll never use?

    However that's neither here nor there. If you or any other 3800/1800 owner can tell me about this display dimmer foible I'd really appreciate it. If not then that's cool too. Just thought I'd check out what other people experience with theirs.

    So far the 1800 is sounding better and running cooler. So I'm happy :)