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  1. #26
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    OK Eric There's a place I looked in the internet in Maine (I'm in LA) that is a large electronics company called Abesofmaine.com This place was selling the TV I eventually bought for the cheapest price I can get in Los Angeles, $1700 including shipping, for $1400 Mitsubishi WS48315 48 In. Widescreen T . It still is listed at that price, check it out. They charge a couple of hundred dollars for moving which is why I bought from the retail store. Your telling me that you're "friendly small retail store" in Chicago (?) would have sold you that same TV for the $1400 online listed price excluding shipping arrangements. Sorry, I find that very hard to believe.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Z
    my last $.02- the retailer in which i buy great majority of all my electronics matches online prices as long as they are authorized dealers.

    now i'll just sit back and wait for someone to criticize this post and/or tell me i'm lying.

    it seems like some people on this site are angry at the world- people need to just chill out and enjoy life! i wish all the effort the general public puts into arguing a point about politics and similar things would be spent on volunteering and the like- Earth would be a much better place.

    Okay, now I'll really sit back and await the barrage of criticism!

    Enjoy!
    EZ

  2. #27
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    Hershon- First, let me say that my goal isn't to offend anyone or prove a point- I just want to explain what I have here. Also, this thread has been enjoyable! I apologize if my tone wasn't the best in the previos posts.

    If it is an authorized dealer, I bet they can at least come pretty close to the price (to make it worth my while to shop there)! I should go there and just check it out- I guess it will be a nice test, haha. However, let's say they will meet me 1/2 way on the price- that might be worth it because I know they have in-house technicians that work on these electronics. I feel a little weary when I buy something online and then need it to be repaired. I like how I can go to one place (or call them) to meet all my needs.

    Here's an example of when I bought a new camera last week (it's not as big of a purchase like a TV, but still a few hundred bucks). I saw the brand new Sony P150 7.2mp camera on some crazy website (unauthorized dealer) for $389 (MSRP is $499). I talked with the salesperson and he said, "Odds are they are not authorized, but I can still cut you a deal." He went back to the computer to see what he could do. He came back and said he can sell it for $419. I said that still is too expensive and asked if he can throw something in to make it more interesting- he then went ahead and threw in a 256mb memory stick ($80 value). I wanted to buy that anyway, so it worked out perfectly. Now I know it's not a $2K TV, but it's still good service. When I'm in the market for a TV, I'll definitely shop there.

    I asked him how the price impacts his commission. He said the commission isn't a percentage of the sale amount, it's a bonus on how many things they sell. They usually have the MSRP on the item in the store and some items are discounted 5% or so online. In their computer system, there is the bottom line price in which they can sell an item- to get lower than that they need to get approval from a manager.

    When I bought my appliances for my new kitchen, the retail for everything was $2300. I printed the pages of their website for the model numbers, walked into the store and said I can get these 3 for about $1700 from the Great Indoors and Sears. He went to the computer and came back with a price of $1650- they exceeded my expectations- that should be the goal of all retailers!

    It's called Abt Electronics in Glenview, IL (northern suburb of Chicago). They're great- they're one of the largest family owned electronics/appliances retailer in the nation- 350K sq ft store. They've grown this big because of their outstanding customer service and support.

    Now I know saying that they will match everything, is an exaggeration- the price does have to be pretty reasonable. Their motto is, "We say yes to every reasonable request." Reasonable is the word that can get interesting.

  3. #28
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    I'm not offended nor am I trying to criticise you or call you to task. If people on this Board hadn't helped me in the past on electronic stuff, I probably wouldn't have even commented regarding your post. I just thought that if I was looking for info and someone might have unintentionally put some misleading info on it, I would have welcomed the right info. In regards to you, more power to you if you can use online web listings to bargain someone down in price. If that works for someone else great. I truly would use that too but at least it hasn't worked for me in LA. I just wouldn't count on that working though in general.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Z
    Hershon- First, let me say that my goal isn't to offend anyone or prove a point- I just want to explain what I have here. Also, this thread has been enjoyable! I apologize if my tone wasn't the best in the previos posts.

    If it is an authorized dealer, I bet they can at least come pretty close to the price (to make it worth my while to shop there)! I should go there and just check it out- I guess it will be a nice test, haha. However, let's say they will meet me 1/2 way on the price- that might be worth it because I know they have in-house technicians that work on these electronics. I feel a little weary when I buy something online and then need it to be repaired. I like how I can go to one place (or call them) to meet all my needs.

    Here's an example of when I bought a new camera last week (it's not as big of a purchase like a TV, but still a few hundred bucks). I saw the brand new Sony P150 7.2mp camera on some crazy website (unauthorized dealer) for $389 (MSRP is $499). I talked with the salesperson and he said, "Odds are they are not authorized, but I can still cut you a deal." He went back to the computer to see what he could do. He came back and said he can sell it for $419. I said that still is too expensive and asked if he can throw something in to make it more interesting- he then went ahead and threw in a 256mb memory stick ($80 value). I wanted to buy that anyway, so it worked out perfectly. Now I know it's not a $2K TV, but it's still good service. When I'm in the market for a TV, I'll definitely shop there.

    I asked him how the price impacts his commission. He said the commission isn't a percentage of the sale amount, it's a bonus on how many things they sell. They usually have the MSRP on the item in the store and some items are discounted 5% or so online. In their computer system, there is the bottom line price in which they can sell an item- to get lower than that they need to get approval from a manager.

    When I bought my appliances for my new kitchen, the retail for everything was $2300. I printed the pages of their website for the model numbers, walked into the store and said I can get these 3 for about $1700 from the Great Indoors and Sears. He went to the computer and came back with a price of $1650- they exceeded my expectations- that should be the goal of all retailers!

    It's called Abt Electronics in Glenview, IL (northern suburb of Chicago). They're great- they're one of the largest family owned electronics/appliances retailer in the nation- 350K sq ft store. They've grown this big because of their outstanding customer service and support.

    Now I know saying that they will match everything, is an exaggeration- the price does have to be pretty reasonable. Their motto is, "We say yes to every reasonable request." Reasonable is the word that can get interesting.

  4. #29
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    There's no way to generalize about online retailers, it all depends on what you are buying and where you are buying it from. The best purchasing experience of my life occurred w/ a small online company, Orb Audio, while I've also had some pretty sketchy experiences with other online retailers. I think a few manufacturers are a little picky about honoring their warranty only if you buy from an authorized retailer, so double check before ordering if possible.

  5. #30
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    You and your family go out to dinner at the local chain restaurant. After eating the meal you tip the dim-witted waitress/waiter 15-20% in spite of her not knowing anything about the food, giving you a scripted recomendation of the product... excuse me... dish of the day, and what feels to be the caustic precursor to heartburn. You give this gratuity on top of the full retail price of the food and in spite of the overall lack of service because you recall your stint in the service industry and you do remember having bad nights and not being able to pay the bills, etc.

    A waitress gives, at best, GREAT advice on a meal that will satiate you for approxamately 8 to 10 hours.

    Your local stereo salesperson can spend hours on multiple occasions with you giving advice, making recomendations, rearanging often heavy equipment all without your making a purchase; just in anticipation of your making a purchase that you will keep and enjoy for several years. After spending this period of time with you he hopes that you will not take this newfound knowledge to the... yes... THE INTERNET.

    Of course you can find all of this stuff, this well matched gear that you had the oportunity to audition firsthand, online for less. Or you could haggle with the salesman until he gives you 15-20% off.

    Is it fair to audition gear at Mom and Pop's then buy from Crazy Eddie's Online Outlet?

    Is it fair to not only refuse to pay full retail at Mom and Pop's but to beat Skip the salesboy down on the price until he looses any commision he may have made?

    Tip waitress even if she is not that good. Haggle with salesperson who has given you advice.

    If we continue buying online because we can save a little money we will have fewer or even no salespeople left with whom we can look eye to eye and get any sort of advice. As soon as we can all audition specs, glossy photos, and manufacturer propoganda this will be a non-issue. In the time being we should support those who give us good advice, don't support those who give bad advice, and invest some unearned tip money into more worthy causes.

    Signed,

    Ridiculously-wealthy-stereo-salesman-who-laughs-all-the-way-to-the-bank-with-these-huge-profit-margins (laugh now)

  6. #31
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    It don't pay the bills sorry

    Hey, if I have alot of surplus extra money, I can totally see where you're coming from. The thing is I don't and alot of other middle class people don't either. So given the choice of paying $100 less online than buying from a salesman/small business owner, I'll take online any day of the week, sorry. In regards to your restaurant analogy, the thing is usually the tip isn't going to be more than $10-$15 or so on the extreme, which is alot less than a savings of $100 or more. Most people will not buy online, unless they either save significantly on the selling price or they can't get the item anyplace else. Salesmen at chains like Best Buy and Circuit City are for the most part morons who know little more than anyone else. Salesmen at more high end specialty stores such as Ken Crane's in LA which specializes in big screen HD TV's know there stuff totally and will match the price of any product they sell within a 30 day period of any store/chain within the area. In regards to mom and pop stores, sorry I don't feel sorry for them, they have to adjust to the times/competition or get out. When I got out of college I could have taken a higher paying much riskier in terms of job security, job in private industry or a more secure not close to the same pay job with much less promotional opportunities, working for the Federal Government. I chose the Federal government & job security and have no regrets as I got a good early retirement package from them and great health benefits. Its called free enterprise & I don't feel sorry for these people one bit.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by hershon
    Hey, if I have alot of surplus extra money, I can totally see where you're coming from. The thing is I don't and alot of other middle class people don't either. So given the choice of paying $100 less online than buying from a salesman/small business owner, I'll take online any day of the week, sorry. In regards to your restaurant analogy, the thing is usually the tip isn't going to be more than $10-$15 or so on the extreme, which is alot less than a savings of $100 or more. Most people will not buy online, unless they either save significantly on the selling price or they can't get the item anyplace else. Salesmen at chains like Best Buy and Circuit City are for the most part morons who know little more than anyone else. Salesmen at more high end specialty stores such as Ken Crane's in LA which specializes in big screen HD TV's know there stuff totally and will match the price of any product they sell within a 30 day period of any store/chain within the area. In regards to mom and pop stores, sorry I don't feel sorry for them, they have to adjust to the times/competition or get out. When I got out of college I could have taken a higher paying much riskier in terms of job security, job in private industry or a more secure not close to the same pay job with much less promotional opportunities, working for the Federal Government. I chose the Federal government & job security and have no regrets as I got a good early retirement package from them and great health benefits. Its called free enterprise & I don't feel sorry for these people one bit.
    Well, yes and no. The issue in going online versus brick-and-mortar is whether the product that you're getting is actually same thing.

    In economic terms, retail is more than just pushing product, it's also adding value to a commodity by marketing and displaying, providing aftersales service, providing a place to try things out and return them for repair, offering home trials and upgrades, etc. These things add costs onto the products, and if a consumer is willing to forego those kinds of niceties, then obviously they're willing to trade these things for lower costs. The thing about value is that it involves a lot more than just costs, and consumers make their decisions based on value. Cost is but one component of value, not the sole determinant.

    The manufacturers of most higher end gear have already decided how they want their products distributed, which is through specialty stores. That's why so many of them do not authorize their products for mail order sales, and will invalidate the warranty for any unit bought through an unauthorized source. Getting back to the value added angle, a commodity with a factory warranty is NOT the same thing as that same product without the warranty. Whether or not it's worthwhile to a consumer to buy a product without the warranty depends on their risk tolerance and whether the savings by going mail order is worth that risk.

    The independent shops HAVE already adjusted to the competition. That's the reason why so many of them now offer home installation and design services, because they can no longer survive on the margins provided by the audio and video products alone.

  8. #33
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    QUOTE=Woochifer]Well, yes and no. The issue in going online versus brick-and-mortar is whether the product that you're getting is actually same thing.

    I agree 100% of what you're saying about a warranty. My whole thing of buying online is if the product is alot cheaper after factoring shipping than what you could get it new from someplace else, assumes you're getting the exact same product sealed new with the same warranty. Therefore you need to verify this before you buy online. If I'm only saving a small amount of money it isn't worth my time.

    Here's what I've bought, all new & sealed, online in the past year & what I bought at a retail store:

    Online A new sealed Monster surge protector that sells for $84 at all the chains for $47 with shipping, a bunch of new sealed Monster Component Video Cables that would cost me about $300 at the chains for $125 or so from a permanent EBay vendor using buy it now option, an extrental computer DVD recorder that sells for $350 for $140 online with a 1 year warranty, A DVD Lite on Recorder from Circuit City.Com (they don't sell it at their store) that retails for I think $375 for $170 online (that included a full warranty), 2 JVC receivers for about $200 each that retail for about $450 each (with warranty) . What I've bought in stores: $1600 with shipping 48" Mitsubishi HD TV from a high end store in LA that matches the lowest price ( I also paid an additional $250 or so for an extended 5 year warranty), $800 with shipping a 30" Samsung HDTV at Circuit City (Again I bought a 5 year extended warranty for about $200), an HP Media Center Computer that I purchased for $800 also at Circuit City (I bought a 5 year extended warranty direct from HP mainly for free technical help after a year for $250?), & 2 sets of home theater sound systems (5 satellite speakers & a sub each) for about $1250 or so from Orb.Audio. I also spent foolishly about $200 in Monster speaker wire that I could have bought on Ebay for less than $100.

  9. #34
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    Sorry Hershon. My original post was aimed at the high end retail customer. Circuit City and the like make all of their money by selling buzz words (like DIGITAL, HIGH DEF, and THX CERTIFIED), extended warranties, and gear that is more aesthetically pleasing than it is high performance. Stab your Circuit City salesman in the pocketbook; that will put a small dent in the Wal-Martization of America.

    Disclaimer: If there is a speaker in your sytem smaller than a grown mans fist the following rant does not apply to you.

    The consumer that I was aiming at was the one who I help to cut through all of the marketing BS that the consumer electronics industry pushes on the public. The customer who I "down-sell" from something that all of the advertising has convinced him he can't live without. The customer who is prepared to spend 3K in one afternoon but leaves having spent only 2K because I helped him weed out all of the shinny lights, bells and whistles, and other supperfluous stuff that he will never use.

    You can live without Mom and Pop; ok. This country is taking a turn in that dirrection for sure. I don't want to be left with the choices that large retailers give me though. Soon enough we will be buying Beer Brand beer, Pickle Brand pickles, and Shoe Brand shoes (which will be a subsidiary of Martha Stewart Living by the way).

    Restaurant analogy does hold. Meal that satiates for 10 hours = $10 tip; stereo that will last you 4 to 8 years (depending on upgrade-bug-reststance-gene... or lack thereof) = save $100 online? The math is just not jibing man.

    Those who are going to haggle, burn bridges, and shop online are going to do just that.
    Those who prove to be easy to work with, receptive to good advice, and repeat customers will get substantial discounts on new in box merchandise, favoritism on special manufacturer price drops, favoritism on discontinued merchandise, extra time and effort in dealing with manufacturers on their behalf, etc.

    The butcher saves the good cuts for his best customers.
    The Wal-Mart Super Store meat shelf stock boy gets pissed if you ask him where the frozen chicken wings advertised in the circular are.

    The world may be a beter place if we all spent a little less money (even on online merchandise) on all this stuff and bought a couple of blankets, soup, egg McMuffins and the like for bums.

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