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  1. #26
    AR "Wisdom of Yoda"Member LEAFS264's Avatar
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    No, i didn't use an SPL meter. I just asumed that once you set the speaker distance from the listening position the receiver would do the rest. I have a subwoofer,and all speakers are set to small.I also have the front and center levels all the same. Quagmire suggested using an SPL meter in an earlier post and i gave him attitude. I feel terrible. I will get one......from where? Does Radio Shack carry those? If not ,my local hi-end dealer must have one.
    Thanks

  2. #27
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    "...And YES Quagmire that is my way of saying sorry!!"

    Well for what it's worth, I'm sorry too. I didn't post anything here to waste your time or provoke you: I only wanted to make sure you had some of the basic stuff covered before you moved on to more elaborate and expensive cures. And like I said in the previous post, even if you should decide to replace the receiver, wouldn't it be nice to know how to get the best performance from it?

    "Bye the way...."otherwise what"?"

    We've finally had some civil words between us, so let's just leave it at that. ;-)

    Q

  3. #28
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    Yes, Radio Shack sells a very good one for pretty cheap. That's what most people use for home theaters, I suspect. Are you located in Canada, the USA, or elsewhere?
    Do you have a test disc that will emit different test tones? No biggy, the receiver will probably have a test function that basically sends a static like signal to one speaker at a time...use that in the meantime. I think everyone should have an SPL meter, but maybe you can borrow one from someone in the meantime? I think they are about $40 US or $60 canadian or so...

    You will probably find that your speakers are off from each other by quite a bit. Most people I know that try to do it by ear don't even come within 3 dB. Each speaker is usually of by 5 or 6 dB or more...this is actually quite a bit...in my case, I thought I had it done perfectly by ear, and I was shocked when the front right speaker was 4 dB louder than front left, and the center was 4 dB below the front left...the surrounds were waaaay too low. If you haven't even touched the levels, your center might be 5, even 10 dB more quiet than your mains. Or louder? Or one main might be too loud, etc. Then again it might not...won't know until you get at it.

    Whether you eventually upgrade the speaker or not, it's important to do the proper calibration, etc (the stuff the stores don't tell you) to make your system sound as good as it can. You've invested a lot of money already, you might as well have it running at an optimal level.

  4. #29
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    "No, i didn't use an SPL meter. I just asumed that once you set the speaker distance from the listening position the receiver would do the rest."

    That would be nice, but no... Setting the speaker distances adjusts the delay times but has nothing to do with setting levels. However, setting the delays is a very important function that is part of the overall calibration and needed to be done anyway. Is the distance from your listening position to the main speakers much different than the distance from the listening position to your center channel speaker? If so, is the center speaker closer to you than the mains or farther away? How much flexibility do you have to change the placement of the mains or center speaker?

    As Kex pointed out, setting channel levels accurately by ear is a very difficult thing to do, much more difficult than most people think, and having them set correctly does make a tremendous difference in sound quality. We're not saying this is guaranteed to solve your problem, but it could, or it could at least help things to the point that you can live with it. Also, if and when you do upgrade your receiver, having channels properly adjusted will optimize your system so that you know it is operating as it was intended.

    If you have all of your speakers set to small already, this is the best bet for getting a close timbre match between the center and the mains. If your interested to learn why, just say so. Once you get levels adjusted correctly, you will be able to make a more accurate determination as to whether the center speaker is ever going to function properly in your system with the existing mains. After you make that determination it will be much easier to advise you on where to go from there. If the problem remains, most likely the solution will involve changes to the speakers -- not the receiver. As I said before, it is never a mistake to invest in good quality amplification, and if you've got the cash to upgrade the receiver AND make the necessary changes to your speaker system, that's great. But if you don't and you really want to solve this problem, you will probably need to address the speakers before moving on to the receiver.

    "Quagmire suggested using an SPL meter in an earlier post and i gave him attitude. I feel terrible."

    Don't. Just don't go all postal on us either. Whether you agree with us or not, we are only trying to help.

    Q

  5. #30
    AR "Wisdom of Yoda"Member LEAFS264's Avatar
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    Well, to be honest the only reason i was going to change receivers is because my mains are 4olm and i was afraid that it couldn't drive them,even though there is a 4-8 switch on the back!!.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by LEAFS264
    Well, to be honest the only reason i was going to change receivers is because my mains are 4olm and i was afraid that it couldn't drive them,even though there is a 4-8 switch on the back!!.
    Ahhhh.... yet another clue. The 4-8 ohm selector switch on the back of your receiver is purely a protective device. It in no way improves sound when using low impedance speakers, in fact it has just the opposite effect. It will sacrifice sound in order to protect equipment. It could very well be that your hearing the effects of this device, or even if you don't have it set to the 4 ohm position, the receiver's amp section may not be keeping up with driving these 4 ohm speakers. Are any of the rest of your speakers rated at anything less than 8 ohms?

    Q

  7. #32
    AR "Wisdom of Yoda"Member LEAFS264's Avatar
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    No, all other speakers are 8 only the Silveri's are 4. Should i have the switch at 4 or 8. the rear speakers are bookshelf.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by LEAFS264
    No, all other speakers are 8 only the Silveri's are 4. Should i have the switch at 4 or 8. the rear speakers are bookshelf.
    You will get better performance from you receiver and speakers with it set in the 8 ohm position. BUT YOU MUST BE VERY CAREFUL!!!! If you operate this system at very high levels, or you notice any warning signs that you are exceeding the receivers power limits, turn it down or off imediately. Warning signs could include audible distortion, the receiver getting very hot or shutting down, and eventually smoke, fire or a burning smell. Obviously you don't want to get to the point of noticing some of the later signs because it could very well be too late and the damage could already be done.

    To be absolutely safe you should set the switch to the 4 ohm position, but like I said, doing so could sacrifice sound quality. Usually I recommend that people set it to 8 ohms then listen at "reasonable levels"; always being alert for the warning signs. If you're not confident in your abilities to detect these warning signs, you're better off playing it safe and leaving it set to the 4 ohm position.

    By the way, using speakers which are too different in terms of impedance and/or efficiency can create system imbalances that can't adaquately be compensated for by changing receiver settings. Buying a receiver with a more capable amp section could improve things (or not) but may not be enough to eliminate the problem entirely. Like I said before, it is never a mistake to invest in good amplification, but even good amplification can't undo every problem.

    Q

    Q

  9. #34
    AR "Wisdom of Yoda"Member LEAFS264's Avatar
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    Ok......now my receiver is "RATED" and i use this term loosely,at 110w per. If that is true that should be enough to drive a 5.1 system at high levels, even w/4olm mains??????? i hope

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by LEAFS264
    Ok......now my receiver is "RATED" and i use this term loosely,at 110w per. If that is true that should be enough to drive a 5.1 system at high levels, even w/4olm mains??????? i hope
    How receivers are rated can be confusing, even a little deceptive at times. It depends on how they arrived at that rating. Some companies will rate their receivers with "All Channels Driven" while others rate them with only "One Channel Driven"; some will rate them through a full spectrum of frequencies ranging from 20 Hz to 20kHz while others only rate them at a single frequency -- typically 1kHz. Some rate them into low impedances, others only at 8 ohms. All of this makes a difference into how much "power" the receiver or amp really has. The weakpoint of most mass market receivers is the power supply, which unlike many seperates monoblock style amps has only one shared power supply for everything electrical going on in that receiver. Low impedance speakers draw more electrical current or "amps" from the power supply and so under the right circumstances, it is very possible that your receiver would not be able to keep up with current needs of these speakers. Having a subwoofer in the system and running the mains as small will help, but there is still no guarantees.

    Q

  11. #36
    AR "Wisdom of Yoda"Member LEAFS264's Avatar
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    Thanks for all the input. We'll see how it go's .


    Jay

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by LEAFS264
    Thanks for all the input. We'll see how it go's .


    Jay
    You bet. Best of luck to you, Jay. Let us know how it goes.

    Q

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