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  1. #1
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    Onkyo TX-SR875 vs Yamaha RX-V3800

    I was wondering if anyone had auditioned both or either of these receivers (Onkyo TX-875 and Yamaha RX-V3800). I hope to audition them myself in the next 3 months or so, but I live in a rural area and will have to drive a couple of hours to find a place that will have either, much less both of these receivers. If I had to give a ratio to my listening habits I would say 65 audio (live music, blues, jazz, reggae, acoustic, etc.) / 35 Home Theater. Both of these amps have a lot of similarities (TrueHD, DTS-HD, HDMI, Neural Surround Sound, etc.) but each manufacturer has other technologies that differ. I am curious as to how the technologies compare and if any are superior to the other, and if so, in what way. Onkyo has 192kHz/24bit converters, Audyssey MultEQ XT, HDMI Video Upconversion, HQV, THX Ultra 2, Theater-Dimensional, VLSC and WRAT, while Yamaha has Dolby Digital Plus, Digital ToP-ART, CINEMA DSP Digital, SILENT CINEMA and Virtual CINEMA DSP, Compressed Music Enhancer, and YPAO technologies. Ultimately, I was wondering, given my listening preferences, would any of the technologies in these receivers, make one a stronger candidate over the other...

    Thanks in advance for you feedback.

    (in case it makes any difference, it will most likely be connected to Wharfdale 9.5s of 9.6s)

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    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    I had a chance to audition the 805 and 2700, which are almost identical to the 875 and 3800. Both units are very nice and I would suggest you audition both if possible. I'm not gonna get all technical and will just bring out a few points I liked about each unit.

    I really liked the 805, especially for music playback. The Audyssey was freakin' sweet and the adjustability on this unit is crazy. You could spend days tweaking away. The remote is laid out well and easy to use. The only thing was I kept running into problems with the 805 and actually went through 3 before giving up.

    I auditioned several other units (Denon 2807, Yamaha 661, Pioneer 91) but ended up going with the Yamaha 2700. HT plackback on the Yammy was excellent. It was the best for HT, IMO, of all the units I auditioned. The GUI/OSD is really nice and I was suprised how easy it was to get the networking up and running. Lots of flexibility with this unit as well.

    If I could have the music playback of the Onkyo matched with the HT playback of the Yammy, I'd be in heaven Just to confuse you a bit more, lastly I would say both are excellent units and you can't go wrong either way.

  3. #3
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    Problems w/ Onkyo receivers?

    You had trouble with 3 Onkyo receivers?! Wow. What kind of problems? Although not hooked up now, I still have an Onkyo TX-SV414PRO that I bought back in college. I always loved the rich sound from this receiver but the HT technology only has Dolby Pro Logic and 5.1 I think. That is why I "upgraded" to the Onkyo TX-SR502 which is a 6.1 receiver with Dolby Digital EX Prologic IIx. It sounds absolutely terrible! Music from the 502 is very thin sounding. I hardly ever even turn it on. I only have four speakers hooked up to it, 2 front, and 2 rear, and don't know if not having a center chanel is the problem. It is a factory refurbished unit that I bought cheap so I havn't lost much money with it, but I was very disappointed in how it sounds compared with my older Onkyo. Nothing like the 414. I've had the 414 for over 10 yrs and it blows the 502 away. I'm getting ready to switch them out until I my next one. I don't know if it has anything to do with the 502 being refurbished or if that is just a very low end Onkyo or what. Anyway, I've saved up to get the 875 but was thinking that I may give Yamaha a try since the 502 sounds so s$&#ty. To my knowledge, Onkyo does not have a reputation for having problems with their receivers, or do they? Given that you had to try 3 different ones and still were having trouble, that definitely concerns me.

  4. #4
    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JK_Livin22
    You had trouble with 3 Onkyo receivers?! Wow. What kind of problems? Although not hooked up now, I still have an Onkyo TX-SV414PRO that I bought back in college. I always loved the rich sound from this receiver but the HT technology only has Dolby Pro Logic and 5.1 I think. That is why I "upgraded" to the Onkyo TX-SR502 which is a 6.1 receiver with Dolby Digital EX Prologic IIx. It sounds absolutely terrible! Music from the 502 is very thin sounding. I hardly ever even turn it on. I only have four speakers hooked up to it, 2 front, and 2 rear, and don't know if not having a center chanel is the problem. It is a factory refurbished unit that I bought cheap so I havn't lost much money with it, but I was very disappointed in how it sounds compared with my older Onkyo. Nothing like the 414. I've had the 414 for over 10 yrs and it blows the 502 away. I'm getting ready to switch them out until I my next one. I don't know if it has anything to do with the 502 being refurbished or if that is just a very low end Onkyo or what. Anyway, I've saved up to get the 875 but was thinking that I may give Yamaha a try since the 502 sounds so s$&#ty. To my knowledge, Onkyo does not have a reputation for having problems with their receivers, or do they? Given that you had to try 3 different ones and still were having trouble, that definitely concerns me.
    Here's a link that lists a few of the problems. I also had a few problems with HDMI compatibility.
    Onkyo 805

    You can also do a search of "Onkyo 805" and you should find more info. I started a few threads on the subject and was really disappointed because I really like the 805. I own a 603 and have had no problems with it. I think this latest batch of HDMI 1.3 units from Onkyo are kinda hit 'n miss.

    On a side note, I'm curious about why pay the extra $$$ for video scaling in the 875. The diff in price between the 875 & 805 is about what.....$500 or so. I'd rather drop down to the 805 and pick up a BR or HD player. Just a thought.

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    Are you more concerned with the feature set or with sound quality? You say it will be mostly music,why not take a look at the Cambridge Audio 640r,it should easily top either of those 2 for music and equal them for film.It does have a very thin set of features,they spent the money on making it sound great not on a bunch of features that you may or maynot ever use.You wont be disapointed.

    bill
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by L.J.
    ...
    On a side note, I'm curious about why pay the extra $$$ for video scaling in the 875. The diff in price between the 875 & 805 is about what.....$500 or so. I'd rather drop down to the 805 and pick up a BR or HD player. Just a thought.
    I will be much more educated on the subject before I make my final buying decision, but at this point, I am admittedly somewhat ignorant on much of the technology. I have read a couple of articles that say some DVD players can upconvert to almost 1080p, and definitely to 1080i. I have a fairly large DVD collection and therefore would rather optimize the quality of those as apposed to purchasing a BR or HD DVD player and re-purchasing my DVDs in a new format. With my limited knowledge, I was thinking that the HQV would give me the best movie quality for my standard DVDs that I already own. I realize that even with upconvert, the quality will not be quite as good as the BR and HD, but from what I have read, its pretty close.

  7. #7
    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JK_Livin22
    I will be much more educated on the subject before I make my final buying decision, but at this point, I am admittedly somewhat ignorant on much of the technology. I have read a couple of articles that say some DVD players can upconvert to almost 1080p, and definitely to 1080i. I have a fairly large DVD collection and therefore would rather optimize the quality of those as apposed to purchasing a BR or HD DVD player and re-purchasing my DVDs in a new format. With my limited knowledge, I was thinking that the HQV would give me the best movie quality for my standard DVDs that I already own. I realize that even with upconvert, the quality will not be quite as good as the BR and HD, but from what I have read, its pretty close.
    Well besides playing HD movies, many of the BR/HD-DVD players do an excellent job at scaling standard DVDs as well. I've read good things about the players that use the REON chip. My thinking was that scaling in the AVR would be good for those that watch alot of standard def TV or older VHS movies. I guess it all comes down to preference. I am no videophile and I just wonder how much of a noticeable difference video scaling in the 875 or comparable AVR would make over a good DVD player, if any.

    I own about 400 or so DVD's and don't plan on replacing my entire collection either. Some titles I will though.....like Pirates or Spiderman, since these are some of my favorites and I think are worth the double dip. I own about 35 or so BR and most are new releases.

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    [QUOTE=L.J.]Here's a link that lists a few of the problems. I also had a few problems with HDMI compatibility.
    Onkyo 805

    I followed the link and read the post. I don't want to be a guinea pig for the 875 and was wondering if it would be useful to try and contact Onkyo (customer support?) to see if they could advise me on whether or not they had fixed the pauses and noises that they stated were "not a problem". That sounds like something that would definitely get under my skin after a while.

  9. #9
    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JK_Livin22
    I followed the link and read the post. I don't want to be a guinea pig for the 875 and was wondering if it would be useful to try and contact Onkyo (customer support?) to see if they could advise me on whether or not they had fixed the pauses and noises that they stated were "not a problem". That sounds like something that would definitely get under my skin after a while.
    It wouldn't hurt to give them a call. Not sure what can be done about the pause while signals change. What's worse is that if your watching HDTV in DD and the commercials are in stereo you will get the pause each time the signal goes from 5.1 to stereo and so on. I heard this could be fixed by keeping Pro Logic engaged but I'm not sure about that since I never really tried it out.

    There were also some sync issues with TV viewing as well.

    My main concern was the speaker popping though. Last I heard it was an amp related issue and could be fixed by taking your unit to an authorized dealer. I have really read into it so I don't know how much truth there is in that. Onkyo clearly states in a flyer that comes with the units that the popping sound may be present and it is not a malfunction. Every unit has this issue going all the way up to the 905 and I even read the Integra line (cousins) has this as well. I went through 3 805's and had these issues with every one of them. Some have stated that they had no such issues and others claimed it was due to overheating and that a fan blowing over the unit fixed the problem for them, while others said it was PS3 related.

    I have had no such issues with my 2700 or any of the other units I auditioned.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by L.J.
    ...
    My main concern was the speaker popping though. Last I heard it was an amp related issue and could be fixed by taking your unit to an authorized dealer. I have really read into it so I don't know how much truth there is in that. Onkyo clearly states in a flyer that comes with the units that the popping sound may be present and it is not a malfunction. Every unit has this issue going all the way up to the 905 and I even read the Integra line (cousins) has this as well. I went through 3 805's and had these issues with every one of them. Some have stated that they had no such issues and others claimed it was due to overheating and that a fan blowing over the unit fixed the problem for them, while others said it was PS3 related.

    I have had no such issues with my 2700 or any of the other units I auditioned.
    Yeah, the popping is what would bother me the most. If the Integra's (I have an old Integra CD Changer and love it) are doing it too, then I would be very skeptical that it's an issue that has been, or will soon be rectified on the Onkyos. That stinks, as I mentioned that I will probably be using it 60 to 65 % of the time for music, and was pleased to hear that you felt the Onkyo had excellent audio for music. Again, I certainly hope to audition both of these and perhaps one or two others if I have the opportunity to do so (maybe even the Cambridge Audio Azur 640 that was mentioned; although I don't have enough knowledge to understand how it could compete or actually be better (regarding Home Theater) than the others without having THX or similar technology.

    My biggest concern with auditioning equipment is that most retailers usually carry one or the other of these brands but not both. I feel that it would be somewhat difficult to adequately asses which unit sounded better if you listened to one that was connected to B&Ws and then drove 20 minutes across town before you listened to the other connected to Monitors. For that reason, I wonder whether or not it is even worth making a 4+ hour round trip to try and compare several receivers, if they are not all located at the same dealer and hooked up to the same equipment.

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    I had a Cambridge in my home for almost a week and i can tell you it sounded very good.I am not that familiar with Onkyo,i have a friend with an older Integra,and i have heard several Yamaha recievers and the Yamaha might stay with it for HT but for music the Yamaha or Onkyo will not even be close to the 640r and you said you did about 65% music.You owe yourself a lesson.

    bill
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  12. #12
    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JK_Livin22
    Yeah, the popping is what would bother me the most. If the Integra's (I have an old Integra CD Changer and love it) are doing it too, then I would be very skeptical that it's an issue that has been, or will soon be rectified on the Onkyos. That stinks, as I mentioned that I will probably be using it 60 to 65 % of the time for music, and was pleased to hear that you felt the Onkyo had excellent audio for music. Again, I certainly hope to audition both of these and perhaps one or two others if I have the opportunity to do so (maybe even the Cambridge Audio Azur 640 that was mentioned; although I don't have enough knowledge to understand how it could compete or actually be better (regarding Home Theater) than the others without having THX or similar technology.

    My biggest concern with auditioning equipment is that most retailers usually carry one or the other of these brands but not both. I feel that it would be somewhat difficult to adequately asses which unit sounded better if you listened to one that was connected to B&Ws and then drove 20 minutes across town before you listened to the other connected to Monitors. For that reason, I wonder whether or not it is even worth making a 4+ hour round trip to try and compare several receivers, if they are not all located at the same dealer and hooked up to the same equipment.
    I auditioned all my units, 7 total, at home and spent a little time with each unit. It took me about 3 months to finally settle on something. At one point, I had 3 units in my house at once. I agree that you can find gear out there that puts more focus on SQ vs. features as Musicman mentioned. I really have no experience with these though so I really can't comment. In the end, the Yamaha came the closest to what I was looking for. I've been toying with the idea of separating my music & HT playback though.

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    If you were going to watch a live music concert on DVD, would you get better sound by watching it/listening to it on a receiver that excelled at music quality or a receiver that excelled at Home Theater?
    Do you think I should start a new thread for this question?

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    Quote Originally Posted by L.J.
    I auditioned all my units, 7 total, at home and spent a little time with each unit. It took me about 3 months to finally settle on something. At one point, I had 3 units in my house at once. I agree that you can find gear out there that puts more focus on SQ vs. features as Musicman mentioned. I really have no experience with these though so I really can't comment. In the end, the Yamaha came the closest to what I was looking for. I've been toying with the idea of separating my music & HT playback though.
    I would love to do the same if I lived closer to retailers, but being several hours away, it would cost me quite a bit of money (either on shipping or gas) to get the equipment back and forth... especially if I too had to try several different units from the same manufacturer. But I guess ultimately I am going to have to audition at least my top two choices at home while hooked up to my other equipment in order to really be able to determine which one is going to sound best to me. How long are you typically allowed to keep a unit before you run the risk of having trouble returning it? Having to pay for two receivers would be a pretty big bummer...

  15. #15
    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JK_Livin22
    I would love to do the same if I lived closer to retailers, but being several hours away, it would cost me quite a bit of money (either on shipping or gas) to get the equipment back and forth... especially if I too had to try several different units from the same manufacturer. But I guess ultimately I am going to have to audition at least my top two choices at home while hooked up to my other equipment in order to really be able to determine which one is going to sound best to me. How long are you typically allowed to keep a unit before you run the risk of having trouble returning it? Having to pay for two receivers would be a pretty big bummer...
    In most cases 30 days.

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    Quote Originally Posted by musicman1999
    I had a Cambridge in my home for almost a week and i can tell you it sounded very good.I am not that familiar with Onkyo,i have a friend with an older Integra,and i have heard several Yamaha recievers and the Yamaha might stay with it for HT but for music the Yamaha or Onkyo will not even be close to the 640r and you said you did about 65% music.You owe yourself a lesson.

    bill
    You definitely have sparked my interest in Cambridge. I wondering though, as I consider Yamaha and Onkyo to be comparable manufacturers, is there a competitor of Cambridge that manufactures a comparable receiver in the same price range that would serve as a good comparison for the Azur 640?

  17. #17
    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by musicman1999
    I had a Cambridge in my home for almost a week and i can tell you it sounded very good.I am not that familiar with Onkyo,i have a friend with an older Integra,and i have heard several Yamaha recievers and the Yamaha might stay with it for HT but for music the Yamaha or Onkyo will not even be close to the 640r and you said you did about 65% music.You owe yourself a lesson.

    bill
    Geez your makin' me wanna go pick one up

    Actually I've been toying with the idea of picking up an integrated with HT passthrough. When I was auditioning gear I started to realize that my taste for music & HT are kinda different. The Yammy is excellent with HT and although not 100% what I was looking for, for music, it is pretty close.......but I'm still a little interested in improving music playback.

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    The ratio is probably more like 60/40, but still definitely skewed to the music side. L.J.'s last post gave me a great idea. If I am able to audition these and agree that the Cambridge is exceedingly superior in music playback that would most likely be my choice. Given that HT is not my #1 priority, I'm sure that the HT quality of the Azur would be more than fine for now, and if I decide later that it isn't, I can add another unit that has THX, etc., for HT down the road. Again, I am a bit of novice, and am not clear on whether or not you can have two separate receivers both hooked up to the same speakers.

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    L.J.,

    Is there a good source for getting a quick education on integrated receivers, HT passthrough, etc.?

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    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JK_Livin22
    The ratio is probably more like 60/40, but still definitely skewed to the music side. L.J.'s last post gave me a great idea. If I am able to audition these and agree that the Cambridge is exceedingly superior in music playback that would most likely be my choice. Given that HT is not my #1 priority, I'm sure that the HT quality of the Azur would be more than fine for now, and if I decide later that it isn't, I can add another unit that has THX, etc., for HT down the road. Again, I am a bit of novice, and am not clear on whether or not you can have two separate receivers both hooked up to the same speakers.
    If your main concern is music, then the Cambridge should be enough. I trust Musicmans opinion on this 100%.

    My ratio is more like 70% HT/Gaming 30% music, but is starting to change. I spend alot more time listening to music lately so this ratio is starting to change.

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    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JK_Livin22
    L.J.,

    Is there a good source for getting a quick education on integrated receivers, HT passthrough, etc.?
    This thread breaks it down.

    Integrated Amps with HT bypass?

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    Quote Originally Posted by L.J.
    If your main concern is music, then the Cambridge should be enough. I trust Musicmans opinion on this 100%.
    Yeah me too. But if his enthusiasm isn't enough, check out these reviews (most are very positive, with only a few exceptions)...

    http://www.cambridgeaudio.com/assets...sedreprint.pdf

    http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/azur640c_e.html

    http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...4&print_page=y

    http://www.tech.co.uk/home-entertain...udio-azur-640r

    http://www.hometheatersound.com/equi..._azur_640r.htm

    http://www.audio-advisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=CA640R

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    Here is a link to a page that has links to about a dozen reviews on the 640r.

    http://www.cambridgeaudio.com/produc...MI+AV+Receiver

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    Quote Originally Posted by L.J.
    Geez your makin' me wanna go pick one up

    Actually I've been toying with the idea of picking up an integrated with HT passthrough. When I was auditioning gear I started to realize that my taste for music & HT are kinda different. The Yammy is excellent with HT and although not 100% what I was looking for, for music, it is pretty close.......but I'm still a little interested in improving music playback.
    Okay, I followed the link on HT passthrough and think I have a pretty good grasp on it. From my understanding you wouldn't want or need the second receiver to have HT correct? If this is right, then a two channel receiver like the Azur 840A would be a seemingly good choice. If I understand this note from the Cambridge Audio website correctly "Fixed level inputs allow the 840A to provide the front channel amplification when integrated with home cinema systems that use an AV processor" indicates that this unit has HT passthrough. I am understanding that correctly? Here is the link to that page:
    http://www.cambridgeaudio.com/summar...ed%20Amplifier

    Can you determine if the less expensive models (740A or 640A) have HT passthrough?

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