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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob_a
hahaha! yes, it probably sounds distorted and inaccurate since you have listened to it. I don't have highend ears so lousy is what I like. :ciappa:
Please do not put words in my mouth, I never said I heard this system...did I?
As far as you liking lousy, if that is true, you are not alone...
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Let's keep the personal sniping to a minimum guys. Thanks!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob_a
...the bottom end of his systems is ridiculously huge but...
Then you know something is wrong. The best HT system I've heard uses five Nola Thunderbolt subs (dual for L/R, single for center) which don't call attention to themselves unless the content asks for it. A constant boom is not accurate. While it wasn't a great movie, I remember watching Blue Crush, a flick about surfing. Naturally, there were numerous beach scenes. What I found remarkable was the ability of that system to convey the weight of incoming waves in a most realistic way.
rw
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Thanks for all of the input. I came out with several take-aways. The first being one good sub with proper placement is more beneficial then two inferior subs. So, rather than trying to bring in another sub, I'm going to stay the course with my PS1200 for now. I plan on looking for something bigger and better in the future. Of course, if I happen to come across another PS1200 secondhand, I'll jump on it and then put off the bigger/better upgrade for a little while longer.
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I have checked out a lot of sites regarding subwooofer placement and the preference of 2 smaller subs over a single large growling variety of these beasts!
In theory and for the sake of symmetry, the left speaker and right speaker sides should be mirror images so as not to introduce MORE errors, leaving us with placement techniques and the dreaded room treatments to try to tame the other anomalies. The 2 subs in this case have to be placed so as NOT to reinforce but to minimize the standing wave patterns, otherwise a heavy bass headache will result.
Most cone speakers bow out around the 60 Hz mark, leaving the sub to fill in the rest. Electrostatic and other panel speakers hand over the heavy work to the sub at around 100 Hz. I am generalizing here, so please donīt get upset if your speakers cross over to the sub at different frequencies!! The 100 Hz wave can be localized as to be coming from 1 sub wherever it is placed breaking the effect desperately desired by our lot. Hence, the use of 2 subs removes this localizing annoyance.
So much for rules, but I am married, and the only rules that apply at home are made up by the wife and cats! To start with, nothing is symmetrical in my speaker placement and the recommended speaker to wall distances have been ignored in favor of me sleeping in the matrimonial bed instead of on the sofa. I have Electrostatic speakers, so the need for a second sub became evident quite early on. I am using a 2nd sub that is a lot different from the Final Sound sub that came with my 300i panels. Obviously, it took much longer to set up and the test tones easily distinguish the better sub, but for music and movies I am rewarded with a more enveloping bass than with a single sub setup.
Hope to have been of help.....
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasir
I have checked out a lot of sites regarding subwooofer placement and the preference of 2 smaller subs over a single large growling variety of these beasts!
In theory and for the sake of symmetry, the left speaker and right speaker sides should be mirror images so as not to introduce MORE errors, leaving us with placement techniques and the dreaded room treatments to try to tame the other anomalies. The 2 subs in this case have to be placed so as NOT to reinforce but to minimize the standing wave patterns, otherwise a heavy bass headache will result.
The problem with this theory is that it requires a sub to be placed in the center of the room, suspended equally in between the floor and ceiling not touching any surface. I do not know many that would be comfortable with that set up. We have not even mentioned the complete lack of low frequency support that set up would have.
Quote:
Most cone speakers bow out around the 60 Hz mark, leaving the sub to fill in the rest. Electrostatic and other panel speakers hand over the heavy work to the sub at around 100 Hz. I am generalizing here, so please donīt get upset if your speakers cross over to the sub at different frequencies!! The 100 Hz wave can be localized as to be coming from 1 sub wherever it is placed breaking the effect desperately desired by our lot. Hence, the use of 2 subs removes this localizing annoyance.
Two subs crossed over at 100hz would not exactly localize at exact locations, but you sure would know if they were both located at the front of the room, or in the rear of the room. If you split them up into front and back placement, you sure would know exactly where they sound is coming from. 80hz and below is a safer bet for both saving the smaller main speaker, and for not giving away the subs location.
Quote:
So much for rules, but I am married, and the only rules that apply at home are made up by the wife and cats! To start with, nothing is symmetrical in my speaker placement and the recommended speaker to wall distances have been ignored in favor of me sleeping in the matrimonial bed instead of on the sofa. I have Electrostatic speakers, so the need for a second sub became evident quite early on. I am using a 2nd sub that is a lot different from the Final Sound sub that came with my 300i panels. Obviously, it took much longer to set up and the test tones easily distinguish the better sub, but for music and movies I am rewarded with a more enveloping bass than with a single sub setup.
Hope to have been of help.....
On one hand it is great to be married, on the other not if you are a video or audiophile.
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I would tend to agree with you on all counts.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nasir
So much for rules, but I am married, and the only rules that apply at home are made up by the wife and cats!
Fortunately, I was able to train mine from day one. She moved into the house I had purchased while still a bachelor with the system in place. E-Stat's low-WAF environment circa late 1985:
http://home.cablelynx.com/~rhw/audio/system8510.jpg
That tapestry draped over the stair rail behind the couch became my first room treatment when I hung it on the back wall. We later the finished the basement which became my first dedicated listening space. The other two houses we've owned since that time were chosen as having a dedicated listening room. Other than the audio room and the garage, the rest of the house is hers. :)
rw
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Great pic EStat, love it!
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ALL the rooms in our apartment are dedicated listening rooms : dedicated to listening to HER!!!
Mind you, I shouldn*t be one to complain a lot, as I have got away with a lot.
In my bachelor days, I did entertain the idea of buying towering ESLs, but they cost serious money and it was still baby steps for me in the realm of audio. Nowadays, the audio-video hobby is the only one I can pursue and there is a wealth of information out there from forums like this one, not to mention the chance of slipping in a wife joke. By the way, we are capable of taking a husband joke from the forum.
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