Keeping it all analog

[nightflier]

I sold an Onkyo TX-601 receiver to a friend a couple of years ago and this weekend he got a new set of speakers, so we took the opportunity to also rewire the setup with better cables. This receiver has one caveat: the 6.1 channel input pyggy-backs on the DVD a/v input - essentially, the designers assumed that any SACD/DVD-A player would also be the DVD-V player. To keep things simple I thought why not just use the analog 6.1 inputs for all DVD-V content as well - which is the way we left it Sunday night, although I can easily come back and reconfigure.

Is this configuration compatible with 6.1 DTS & DD? If so, then I presume that any conversion is then handled inside the player, right?

A couple of side notes: we had to adjust the volume up a bit (compared with using the coax digital input). The sub volume also needed to be turned up, but it seemed a bit crisper and punchier than with coax digital.

[Woochifer]

Using the multichannel analog inputs only works if your DVD player has both an internal DD and DTS decoder along with the multichannel outputs.

Generally, you're better off with the digital connection for the 5.1 and 6.1 DD/DTS content. This is because DVD players generally provide much more limited configuration options compared to the receiver. Receivers generally give you more flexible bass management options, and better control over the delay timing and levels. Plus, with the multichannel analog inputs, the signal goes through a redundant A/D-D/A conversion if the receiver uses a pure digital volume control or allows the DSP chip to process the multichannel input signal. You don't get a pure analog signal unless you know for sure that the multichannel analog input operates in an analog direct mode. I believe that Onkyos are analog direct, but I don't know this for sure.

[Dusty Chalk]

Yes, it's compatible, as long as your player can perform the conversion.

Generally, you're better off with the digital connection for the 5.1 and 6.1 DD/DTS content.

Not true. I recently revisited the digital vs. analog cables setup in my admittedly modest HT system, and I couldn't tell the difference. I was only using Outlaw PCA's.

Plus, it's easier to setup the cables, as was the impetus for starting this thread (I presume).

[Rock789]

what sacd/dvda player does he have?
perhaps it has better dac's than the receiver (if the receiver is now being used as a pass thru preamp)

for the 6.1 dts/dd, yes if the dvd player can decode internally, you'de have to check its specs...

[Woochifer]

Not true. I recently revisited the digital vs. analog cables setup in my admittedly modest HT system, and I couldn't tell the difference. I was only using Outlaw PCA's.

Did you read the rest of my reply? My comment has nothing to do with whether or not one can "tell the difference" between digital and analog cables. It has to do with the more flexible controls that you typically find with a receiver compared to a DVD player with multichannel outputs.

Want to change the crossover point?
Want to adjust the distances/delay timing to compensate for any differences in the speaker alignment?
Want to adjust the LFE levels separately from the subwoofer output?
Want to route the bass through both the subwoofer and mains in a parallel configuration?

DVD players generally won't allow you to adjust these settings, whereas most receivers do.

Try changing any of these parameters, and I can assure that you will easily "tell the difference."

[nightflier]

Rock,

The player is a bit older of a model that he bought second hand: an Onkyo DV-SP800. It used to be a top-of-the-line unit, so I think the processing inside should be better than what's in the receiver. I didn't go into the setup menu on the DVD player because I didn't think that with analog there was anything to adjust. I'll have to check that out this weekend.

Wooch,

I'm not sure I understand what you said: "with the multichannel analog inputs, the signal goes through a redundant A/D-D/A conversion if the receiver uses a pure digital volume control or allows the DSP chip to process the multichannel input signal." Isn't it the case that the receiver is just passing the analog signal straight through, w/o any processing?

Also...
Not that I plan on giving him my ICBM, but theoretically, I could insert this in between and get most of those adjustments (except distance/delay), right?

I guess the reason I'm asking, is because if this is the better connection, then that might be something I'd like to investigate with my own Outlaw pre/pro and my Sony SACD.

[Dusty Chalk]

I'm not sure I understand what you said: "with the multichannel analog inputs, the signal goes through a redundant A/D-D/A conversion if the receiver uses a pure digital volume control or allows the DSP chip to process the multichannel input signal." Isn't it the case that the receiver is just passing the analog signal straight through, w/o any processing?

That's why he said "if" -- it depends on the receiver.

[Woochifer]

Isn't it the case that the receiver is just passing the analog signal straight through, w/o any processing?

That's actually a hit or miss question. Many receivers convert all analog signals to digital, regardless of whether the signal gets channeled into the DSP section or not. Receivers that use pure digital volume controls, for example, can only work in the digital domain. Also, nearly all receivers handle the bass management exclusively in the digital domain. The multichannel analog inputs do not always pass the signal directly to the amp section. If you can still use the DSP effects or the bass management with the multichannel analog input, then the signal likely got converted first. A lot of newer receivers now allow you to use the DSP processing and bass management with the multichannel analog inputs, but they will also include a clearly denoted bypass/direct mode.

[nightflier]

Since it was not well documented in the manual, I asked these same questions to Outlaw Audio about their pre/pro. Here is the response:

"I'm sorry if the 7.1 inputs weren't clear, they are grouped with the DVD input jacks.

The 970 uses a VCA to control volume, it is controlling the volume via Op amps in the analog domain by using a Voltage Controlled Amplifier. It is also using the DSP whenever digital bass management is applied.

Your output levels are probably due to the player's setting for speaker size, channel cal., and possibly other audio settings within the player.

If you set the rear panel switch for Bass Management to "Digital" you are using the same bass management for the 7.1 input as the digital and stereo analog inputs. You must have the player's speaker size setting to Large for all channels and Sub On to use the HP/LP or Digital bass management on the 970.

HP/LP and Bypass modes require that you use the delay setting within the player and "Digital" bass management uses the speaker distance settings within the 970."