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Thread: DVDis dead!

  1. #1
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    DVDis dead!

    I was just at the Ultimate Electronic store today picking up a remote car starter and I asked the salesman how BlueRay player sales were going. He stated that they were selling 40-50 players a day .They had toshiba players selling for $127.

    Also, Walmart is selling a Magnavox player for $79.
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    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    When you start seeing your disc going for $3.99 in the bargain bin of big box stores, you really should start playing taps, and planning the burial.
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    I wonder how the performance of those cheap players are. I was not impressed with the Samsung BD-1500. It could be to the point where good upsampling DVD players compare favorably to a cheap BD player and Blu-ray could defeat their purpose.

  4. #4
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    I wonder how the performance of those cheap players are. I was not impressed with the Samsung BD-1500. It could be to the point where good upsampling DVD players compare favorably to a cheap BD player and Blu-ray could defeat their purpose.

    Last months Consumer Reports magazine reviewed many of the low cost BD players and gave them all high marks for BR picture quality. I think that the people that buy the low cost players won't know or care about any significant difference in picture quality. Most will own cheaper HDTV's.
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  5. #5
    Vinyl Fundamentalist Forums Moderator poppachubby's Avatar
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    Been thinking about Blu-Ray myself. I want to buy a new player. If Blu-Ray plays DVD, I figure why not?

  6. #6
    Sgt. At Arms Worf101's Avatar
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    Welp...

    If things keep going as they are, you'll have little choice. DVD player production might be left to the halt the lame and asian knock-off if all the major players continue dropping production of the format's players.

    Worf

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    Just picked up a BD player for my parents as a Christmas gift. Nice Samsung unit at Best Buy for $150. It will replace their 10+ year old Toshiba unit (one of the first units that boasted a component video output) that will move to my mom's office. They will probably mainly watch DVDs on it still, but should look better than the old Toshiba unit.

    I think that is what will happen for a lot of consumers...the BD players will be so cheap, they'll just replace their old DVD players with a BD player that makes their DVDs look better anyway.

  8. #8
    Forum Regular frahengeo's Avatar
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    For me, the pricing of blu-ray titles are at an acceptable level. $20 for new releases is definitely doable compared to the $35 price point not long ago.
    Also, I just picked up 13 titles for $10 or less each. Gotta love it.
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    Forum Regular BadAssJazz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frahengeo
    For me, the pricing of blu-ray titles are at an acceptable level.
    In my mind, pricing and availability both sound the death knell for DVD...and with The Good, The Bad, & The Ugly released in a Blu Ray format, the fat lady is definitely warming up her pipes. She can blow full throat if they release Cyrano de Bergerac or Car Wash on Blu Ray.
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  10. #10
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Worf101
    If things keep going as they are, you'll have little choice. DVD player production might be left to the halt the lame and asian knock-off if all the major players continue dropping production of the format's players.

    Worf

    Oppo has stopped selling their DVD players!
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  11. #11
    Forum Regular pixelthis's Avatar
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by blackraven
    Oppo has stopped selling their DVD players!
    Thats the canary in the coal mine.
    I said DVD was dead some time ago, but I thought it was going to be more gradual,
    but this is like the trouncing LASER received.
    More important than the players, there was a TON of BLU discs at BEST BUY.
    Some for 9.99.
    Start sounding TAPS for DVD.
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  12. #12
    Forum Regular BadAssJazz's Avatar
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    One wonders how long Blu Ray will survive. A quick inventory of my viewing habits...I usually opt for online streaming for most of the Netflix stuff. No, not nearly the PQ or audio quality of Blu Ray, but in terms of convenience, or for those of us who simply do not have the space to house a BR collection, it's not bad. If they'd only invest some real ducats into the technology, maybe we'd have something truly remarkable. Or not.
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  13. #13
    Man of the People Forums Moderator bobsticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    When you start seeing your disc going for $3.99 in the bargain bin of big box stores, you really should start playing taps, and planning the burial.
    Yup, yup...not to mention all those Red Box thingies in the lobbies of the BBS's....those things are great for sampling movies that are "on the cusp".
    Example: I'm a Liam Neeson fan, knew immediately that I would pay top dollar to get Taken On a lark my gf's daughter decides she wants to see UP! that new animated dealio...horrible, horrible movie...she hated it, the gf hated it, I hated it...glad I rented it for just a few bucks instead of buying the BR.

    I suspect DVD will hang on for a bit longer than some folks think.
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  14. #14
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Worf101
    If things keep going as they are, you'll have little choice. DVD player production might be left to the halt the lame and asian knock-off if all the major players continue dropping production of the format's players.

    Worf
    yep, pretty much the same thing has happened with standalone CD players. There's a whole thread on Linn's recent decision to drop CD player production, but aside from Sony, it seems that most of the CE giants stopped making standalone CD players a while ago.

    Oppo's decision to stop making DVD players is just the first of many such announcements to come. Denon has now pared their DVD player lineup down to just two mid level models, and eliminated all of their high end players. There's simply no market for high end DVD players because the consumers that would spend more than $200 on a DVD player are spending that budget on Blu-ray instead.

    The prices on entry level DVD players from brand name manufacturers have been stuck around $60 for a few years now. That's already commodity-price range, and it's not that far from the $150 street prices you now see for brand name Blu-ray players. There's no question that Blu-ray player prices will continue to tumble throughout 2010. As the street prices dip below $100 in the next year, the rationale for continuing to produce (and purchase) low margin DVD players also erodes.

    So, indeed this means the remainder of the DVD hardware market will indeed go to those knockoff brands. But, that's not necessarily a bad thing, because it simply means that the broader market will have already transitioned over to the higher quality Blu-ray format.
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    Man of the People Forums Moderator bobsticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woochifer
    yep, pretty much the same thing has happened with standalone CD players. There's a whole thread on Linn's recent decision to drop CD player production, but aside from Sony, it seems that most of the CE giants stopped making standalone CD players a while ago.

    Oppo's decision to stop making DVD players is just the first of many such announcements to come. Denon has now pared their DVD player lineup down to just two mid level models, and eliminated all of their high end players. There's simply no market for high end DVD players because the consumers that would spend more than $200 on a DVD player are spending that budget on Blu-ray instead.

    The prices on entry level DVD players from brand name manufacturers have been stuck around $60 for a few years now. That's already commodity-price range, and it's not that far from the $150 street prices you now see for brand name Blu-ray players. There's no question that Blu-ray player prices will continue to tumble throughout 2010. As the street prices dip below $100 in the next year, the rationale for continuing to produce (and purchase) low margin DVD players also erodes.

    So, indeed this means the remainder of the DVD hardware market will indeed go to those knockoff brands. But, that's not necessarily a bad thing, because it simply means that the broader market will have already transitioned over to the higher quality Blu-ray format.
    All of this is true, especially regarding hi-end product, but, let us not forget how many people watch DVDs on computers and gamig systems....so, I agree with your assessment of the hardware situation but still feel the format will stagger on for some time...

    ...hell, you can still find VHS at truckstops, lol...
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    She said : "Eh, I know you, and you cannot sing"
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  16. #16
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobsticks
    All of this is true, especially regarding hi-end product, but, let us not forget how many people watch DVDs on computers and gamig systems....so, I agree with your assessment of the hardware situation but still feel the format will stagger on for some time...

    ...hell, you can still find VHS at truckstops, lol...
    With hardware sales up 125%, and disc sales up 187% from last years, the format is hardly staggering. 2010 is when the format will really pop.
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  17. #17
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobsticks
    Yup, yup...not to mention all those Red Box thingies in the lobbies of the BBS's....those things are great for sampling movies that are "on the cusp".
    Example: I'm a Liam Neeson fan, knew immediately that I would pay top dollar to get Taken On a lark my gf's daughter decides she wants to see UP! that new animated dealio...horrible, horrible movie...she hated it, the gf hated it, I hated it...glad I rented it for just a few bucks instead of buying the BR.

    I suspect DVD will hang on for a bit longer than some folks think.
    How can anyone hate the movie UP? Are you sure you two were not in a bad mood that night or day?
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  18. #18
    Man of the People Forums Moderator bobsticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    How can anyone hate the movie UP? Are you sure you two were not in a bad mood that night or day?
    We'll accept that as a theory my brotha...
    So, I broke into the palace
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    She said : "Eh, I know you, and you cannot sing"
    I said : "That's nothing - you should hear me play piano"

  19. #19
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    I tell you where a backlash may be, that's with firmware updating. As I sat down with the wife to watch Drag Me To Hell, a fine piece of theatrical treasure, which she picked out I might add, any way I digress, I popped it into the 7003 only to have it go black screen on me after the pirate warning and all that crap. I checked the website and sure enough a new firmware was available as of 11/10. After updating the player I was enjoying top shelf entertainment like eye balls appearing in harvest cake and Academy Award potential acting in no time. I wonder how well Joe 6-pak will deal with this? Also, how readily available will updates be with cheap brands? I'm really surprised I don't hear more about this. I wonder if people are saying "oh, it won't play it" and just getting the DVD or are more people tech savvy than I think?

  20. #20
    Forum Regular BadAssJazz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    I tell you where a backlash may be, that's with firmware updating. As I sat down with the wife to watch Drag Me To Hell, a fine piece of theatrical treasure, which she picked out I might add, any way I digress, I popped it into the 7003 only to have it go black screen on me after the pirate warning and all that crap. I checked the website and sure enough a new firmware was available as of 11/10. After updating the player I was enjoying top shelf entertainment like eye balls appearing in harvest cake and Academy Award potential acting in no time. I wonder how well Joe 6-pak will deal with this? Also, how readily available will updates be with cheap brands? I'm really surprised I don't hear more about this. I wonder if people are saying "oh, it won't play it" and just getting the DVD or are more people tech savvy than I think?
    I shouldn't be surprised, but nevertheless I usually am when I pop in a blu ray title only to discover a stability issue. Every technology goes through these sorts of growing pains, but I doubt that Joe 6-pack has the patience for that sort of thing. I barely do, and I'm now on my, what, third or fourth Blu Ray player.

    Even more alarming is how some sales persons are pushing the compatibility of Blu Ray players with standard DVD's without also conveying some of the issues and curtailing expectations. Nothing will tick the common man off more than a sin of omission or a bold face lie. A friend of mine -- a layman if ever there was one -- purchased an LG blu ray player on sale, loved the blu ray performance for the most part, but was extremely upset upon discovering that it took his DVD's much longer to load and the PQ wasn't nearly as good as his "reference" DVD player (by that I mean the el cheapo DVD player that he was used to using).

    You can guess how this story ends. He returned the LG Blu Ray player and bought more standard DVD movies for his collection. If DVD doesn't die, it will be because of guys like him. You'll have to pry the last DVD from his cold, dead fingers.
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  21. #21
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobsticks
    All of this is true, especially regarding hi-end product, but, let us not forget how many people watch DVDs on computers and gamig systems....so, I agree with your assessment of the hardware situation but still feel the format will stagger on for some time...

    ...hell, you can still find VHS at truckstops, lol...
    I think next year will be when the Blu-ray disc prices begin inching down closer to the DVD levels. Right now, BDs already account for 20-30% of the sales for new releases, which is where the studios make their money (the Blu-ray sales for Star Trek accounted for 38%, and supposedly over half of the sales for the new extended edition of Watchmen). With the format now in its 4th year, you also have more older titles, and those are the ones that have already gone into the sub-$10 price tiers.

    The DVD format will indeed survive for at least a few more years -- there's a glut of low priced product sitting on store shelves. It's now a low end movie-only product. Those feature packed special editions are getting phased out, and even the two-disc DVD sets often leave out items that are included with the Blu-ray versions.

    If Blu-ray continues its accelerated growth, it's inevitable that the DVD format will eventually take a back seat to Blu-ray. It took the DVD format more than six years before it displaced VHS. But, once that happened, the studios and retailers began to rapidly phase VHS out. The DVD format took over the sales lead in 2003, and the final VHS movie release (Borat) came out in 2006. The last standalone VCRs were discontinued in 2007.

    Those items you see at the truck stops were produced years ago (frankly, I haven't seen any VHS tapes sold through those channels in quite a while) and passed through several hands before they wound up in those truck stop bins. I recall a NY Times article from a couple of years indicating that only one company still distributed VHS movies, and those were all bulk items purchased through liquidation sales and auctions. The company said that they still had some demand, but were planning to get out of the business soon.

    I think in less than four years, none of the brand name manufacturers will make standalone DVD players anymore. It will all be Blu-ray. Of course, by that time the Blu-ray players will sell for the same commodity prices that DVD players currently sell for. It's when the hardware side hits that tipping point that you will see stores very quickly move DVD off the shelves and studios stop making new release DVDs. At that point, the last bastion of DVD sales very well might be those truck stop bins.
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  22. #22
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    I tell you where a backlash may be, that's with firmware updating. As I sat down with the wife to watch Drag Me To Hell, a fine piece of theatrical treasure, which she picked out I might add, any way I digress, I popped it into the 7003 only to have it go black screen on me after the pirate warning and all that crap. I checked the website and sure enough a new firmware was available as of 11/10. After updating the player I was enjoying top shelf entertainment like eye balls appearing in harvest cake and Academy Award potential acting in no time. I wonder how well Joe 6-pak will deal with this? Also, how readily available will updates be with cheap brands? I'm really surprised I don't hear more about this. I wonder if people are saying "oh, it won't play it" and just getting the DVD or are more people tech savvy than I think?
    You don't hear more about it because it's not a huge issue. The firmware and player compatibility issues have been getting less and less frequent with every successive generation. At this point, Joe6p is hardly in the mix as far as Blu-ray goes, except maybe through the PS3 and that's by far the easiest BD player to update.

    I don't think this is anymore an issue than it was with the early DVD players, which had problems with things like dual layer media, seamless branching, and DTS streaming. It took a few generations before those playback problems subsided. Unlike the current crop of BD players, many of those DVD players had to actually have the physical ROM chip swapped out if a firmware update was needed.
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobsticks

    ...hell, you can still find VHS at truckstops, lol...
    I still regularly use two VHS machines

  24. #24
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    How can anyone hate the movie UP? Are you sure you two were not in a bad mood that night or day?
    I'm old, old, old, but the acclaim of these Disney/Pixar efforts get eludes me personally.

    They vary for somewhat to utterly puerile -- OK for sub-teen children maybe, not adults. I just saw Ratatouille: I was disappointed even though my expectations were low.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Feanor
    I'm old, old, old, but the acclaim of these Disney/Pixar efforts get eludes me personally.

    They vary for somewhat to utterly puerile -- OK for sub-teen children maybe, not adults. I just saw Ratatouille: I was disappointed even though my expectations were low.
    Oddly, I am almost completely opposite to you. I am feeling that it's a damn shame when animated movies are better than those with actual people in them these days.

    I just watched Horton Hears a Who again and I am amazed at the thought provoking content that children would not even come close to understanding, unless of course they are into quantum physics and have the understanding that the earth we live on is just a SPEC of dust in the big picture.

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