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  1. #51
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    Adcom amps are a great deal used. If you got lucky a Threshold would be a real find. I would avoid Carver, they are not the most reliable amps.

    For a budget amp you might look at the Emotiva for new.

    For $500.00 you can get a decent DAC for Arcam or Cambridge Audio. The Schitt are coming on strong with performing beyond their price. The guys are from another large company, I'm thinking maybe Theta but not sure.
    Mark Levinson #512 SACD & 532h power
    Pass Labs XP-10 preamp
    Clearaudio Performance DC & Maestro v2 E, AcousTech Ph-1p
    Clarus Crimson loom - AC outlet to speaker terminal
    JBL 4367's & SAM3ha
    Revel S30's & SVS PC13 Ultra (sub)
    Marantz BD-7003 > AV-8003 > LINN 5125
    Transparent cables / Tributaries HDMI
    PS Audio Quintet & Surgex SA15&20

  2. #52
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    Thanks Mr.Peabody. I will be on a lookout for a Tredhold. PA-7 I coukd be expansive but I really want it. So will go on a lookout for that. What do you think of this one
    https://app.audiogon.com/listings/so...-washington-ny

  3. #53
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    that looks like a pretty good deal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bean2011 View Post
    Thanks Mr.Peabody. I will be on a lookout for a Tredhold. PA-7 I coukd be expansive but I really want it. So will go on a lookout for that. What do you think of this one
    https://app.audiogon.com/listings/so...-washington-ny
    Mark Levinson #512 SACD & 532h power
    Pass Labs XP-10 preamp
    Clearaudio Performance DC & Maestro v2 E, AcousTech Ph-1p
    Clarus Crimson loom - AC outlet to speaker terminal
    JBL 4367's & SAM3ha
    Revel S30's & SVS PC13 Ultra (sub)
    Marantz BD-7003 > AV-8003 > LINN 5125
    Transparent cables / Tributaries HDMI
    PS Audio Quintet & Surgex SA15&20

  4. #54
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    Hi guys.

    Had new ideas and wanted to ask your opinion. Remember I could not figure out how to split systems and use Onkyo and Nak to drive fronts separately?
    Mr Peabody suggested Niles switch. I thought of it, but decided to go another rout. Got two Pioneer dss-7 speakers. They sound awesome and I am using them now as main speakers. All Tannoys are now used strictly for HT.
    Now I started doing some research with a goal of enhancing HT experience and perhaps finding something that will maximize potential of Tannoy speakers. Both in terms home theater and audio exoerience.
    I came across Luxman R series. Even though 117 is not anywhere to be found there are plenty of 114s and 115s. Very inexpensive.
    My questions are:
    - Can they be used for video/cable TV?
    - Why do they have 4 speaker outs. Can 4 speakers be driven by them?
    - I saw preouts on the pictures. Are they for another amp?

    How awesome would it be to have even R 115 with 70 wpc to allow for an improved HT and an alternative audio set and experience. .

  5. #55
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Older receivers use to have an A-B button so you could switch between 2 sets of speakers. You could use the Luxman 117 for TV if the TV has analog out puts. If not then you can buy a cheap DAC and run that between the TV and receiver.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  6. #56
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    If your HT system is for HT I wouldn't go with a vintage receiver, you need the HT features of a HT receiver. Besides that Onkyo receivers are higher current than most so to your ears you won't really perceive more power. In fact, it may sound like less. I had one of those R series Luxman receivers, it was very clear sounding, seemingly with a bit of emphasis in the treble, bass was decent but not a big bass sound. If memory serves I believe it did have a couple filter switches to adjust the sound some.

    I had an Onkyo..... 515? I did replace it with a Marantz 1605. The 1605 just rated at 50 watts per channel still sounded better to me and fuller. I was surprised, I didn't think there'd be much difference in HT receivers of similar price.

    It just doesn't make sense to me to go vintage with a bunch of work arounds, which will cost, in a HT system.

    The DAC in the HT receiver directs the movie soundtrack to your various speakers in your surround set up. So messing with a stereo receiver defeats your purpose. Wow, I think I somehow stepped on a soapbox, LOL. done
    Mark Levinson #512 SACD & 532h power
    Pass Labs XP-10 preamp
    Clearaudio Performance DC & Maestro v2 E, AcousTech Ph-1p
    Clarus Crimson loom - AC outlet to speaker terminal
    JBL 4367's & SAM3ha
    Revel S30's & SVS PC13 Ultra (sub)
    Marantz BD-7003 > AV-8003 > LINN 5125
    Transparent cables / Tributaries HDMI
    PS Audio Quintet & Surgex SA15&20

  7. #57
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Well said Mr. P.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  8. #58
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    Thank Mr. Peabody. I agree. Stereo receiver is a bad idea. I guess my obsession is with trying to extract as much sound out of whichever set up I will end up with as possible.

    So I decided to go with Nakamichi AV 10. (I know it is an older piece, and I was forewarned by you guys not to mess around with older equipment.) After looking through some of the threads on other forums, I found several fairly recent reports of successful set up with current equipment, such as apple TV, for example. I have Amazon fire with optical connection similar to what was described.
    It is a 5.1 surround sound receiver with 100WPC and decent, as they say DAC, producing good sound with a CDs.
    Connections are either optical or coaxial. The only issue maybe cable. I got an HDMI to component adaptor. We will see how it works
    Bluray plugs directly into projector via HDMI and sound optical through Receiver.

    One thing I don't quite understand on the receiver is the pre-outs. There are 6 of them. Two fronts, center, rears and sub. My primary focus here is sub, although I am curious about the rest as well. I read that an RCA cable is used directly from the sub pre-out into powered sub. Is it true? I don't have to use subwoofer amplifier for that?
    With regards to the rest of the pre-outs. Are they to be used, if I choose so, via an amp? If set up works out I will have plenty of power with 100 WPC. I my possibly power the fronts with an extra amp.
    It is just strange that there would be 5 pre-outs, provided that the sub is a separate thing altogether. Do they presuppose a use of 5 channel amp or whichever combination with 5 channels?

  9. #59
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    Yes, the sub pre out goes directly to a powered sub. The rest of the pre outs are there to use if you want more/different power for those channels.
    ARC SP9 MKIII, VPI HW19, Rega RB300
    Marcof PPA1, Shure, Sumiko, Ortofon carts
    Marantz CD63SE, Yamaha DVD-S1800
    DAC's: MSB Link, Behringer UCA222, Emotiva XDA-2, HiFimeDIY, Accuphase T101 tuner, Teac V-7010
    Emotiva UMC-200 processor, 2 Adcom GFA-545, 2 modified Dynaco MK3's, 2 bridged Crown XLS-402, Behringer CX2310, DBX223sx, Behringer DSP1124P,2 12" Transmission Line Subs (PASS DIY El-Pipe-O), Magnepan 1.7 (fronts), Acoustat Model 1 ESL's/SPW-1 Woofer (rears)

  10. #60
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    Thanks Joe

  11. #61
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    Regular RCA audio cable?

  12. #62
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Yes, you can use regular RCA cables or a sub cable with an RCA Y adapter depending upon whether your sub has a single RCA or 2 RCA inputs.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  13. #63
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    Thanks Raven

  14. #64
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    What sub are you planning on using?

    If you are looking for some good and affordable sub cables or 2 RCA's for sub use, take a look at these-

    Subwoofer Cables for active Sub Woofers


    Stereo Interconnect with Silver Plated RCA Connectors, dual Belden 1505F Cables and Viablue Red Sleeving

    Stereo Cable Interconnect with Silver Plated RCA Connectors and Belden 1505F Cables


    They won't break the bank if you need 6-10 feet or more.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  15. #65
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    Ran out of resources so went with an inexpensive sub. Mirage m-12. Seems like it needs Y cable.
    Thanks for the links

  16. #66
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bean2011 View Post
    Ran out of resources so went with an inexpensive sub. Mirage m-12. Seems like it needs Y cable.
    Thanks for the links
    Mirage makes some nice musical subs. Is it the Omni S12?
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  17. #67
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    The sub I got for $25 is Mirage MS-12. Thought it was a good deal. The overall Mirage brand is reviewed fairly well, not sure about this particular sub. Does not seem too bad. What do you think about this particular one?
    I have not picked it up yet, and will test it either tomorrow with a cable from a local RadioShack. In the interim I will get one of the cables you suggested blackraven. It is bipolar so I will need a Y cable.

  18. #68
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    A question about turntable needle/cartriges. I got a older Kenwood KD 76F from my father-in-law. Works really well. He has not used it in ages. I was curious about cartridge replacement and all. How do I know if it needs replacement soon and where would I even look for one that fits this turntable. Perhaps there are nice cartriges that fit many models?

    Also he brought one old vinyl Chicago and it sounded awesome o Pioneers DSS-7. I played loud and on couple of occasions the needle skipped. The bass on the speakers makes the room vibrate. AS soon as I turned the volume down it went back to normal. It only happened on the first track both sides. Other tracks I blasted without side-effects
    Yesterday I picked up a couple of vinyl's from Newbury Comics. They start skipping and doing unpleasant "vibrato" with volume turned half that of Chicago old record. Is it the quality of modern records? I am sure the placement of turntable and elevation of the speakers plays into this too.

    Also, and this is a side note, it seemed like some pieces on the record sounded worse than others. I came to conclusion that I need to do a thorough research prior to buying a record. Even though, my understanding is that vinyl is supposed to produce highest quality sound, not all vinyl's have been created equal. Is that true?

  19. #69
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    Raven,

    Which Y cable would you suggest? Among the ones you listed I did not see any. Nak AV 10 has only one sub out

  20. #70
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    GO VIKINGS!


    Pictures of the MS-12 show that it has 2 RCA low level inputs not one. So you won't need a Y connector but you will need 2 RCA cables. Here is the manual and a picture of the rear of the MS-12. It looks like a decent older sub. It has good weight to it.

    Here is a Y connector that I use to use. It is well made-

    Monster Cable 1 Female/2 Male RCA Y-Adapter at Crutchfield.com

    Mirage info-

    MIRAGE BPS100 MANUAL Pdf Download.

    http://img.usaudiomart.com/uploads/l...ot_working.jpg

    As far as vibration and skipping of the TT goes, what do you have it sitting on? It may not give you good isolation from vibration since it skips when the volume is high with heavy bass. I was going to say that you don't have the tone arm set up right but from the pictures and and manual it is a cheap linear tracking TT and there are no adjustment. I would save your money and buy a good budget TT with a decent cartridge that won't ruin your Vinyl.

    But if you want a new cartridge, look here-

    Kenwood KD-76F turntable stylus,Kenwood KD 76F turntable stylus,Kenwood KD76F turntable stylus,Kenwood KD-76F turntable needle stylus,Kenwood KD 76F turntable needle stylus,Kenwood KD76F turntable needle stylus,Kenwood KD-76F turntable stylus needle,


    Here are some well regarded budget TT's-

    Turntables | Accessories4less

    The Denon DP-300F is a pretty good entry level TT

    Orbit Basic Turntable ? U-Turn Audio

    Teac TN-300 Turntable with Phono EQ and USB (Cherry) TN-300-CH

    The Teac is just a beautiful looking TT, and it has good reviews.

    Pro-Ject Debut Carbon (DC) (Gloss Black) Manual belt-drive turntable with pre-mounted cartridge at Crutchfield.com

    The Orbit is the cheapest and it has very good reviews from the Pro's. The Pro Ject is the best of the bunch.

    By the way. Make sure the foam around the woofer on the sub is not deteriorating. If it is, skip it or else you will have to pay some one to refoam it. Don't be in a rush when buying gear, especially used. Save your money and buy something that will last a long time and also sound good.
    Last edited by blackraven; 01-10-2016 at 09:40 AM.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  21. #71
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    Thanks Blackraven. Great info. Love the turntables. Will save and buy one of them.
    As to the cable, I was just told at RadioShack that the preout on the sub is digital coaxial, and that I need a converter to connect to component sub. I bought it all and was pretty pricy. Saved the receipt To return it.

  22. #72
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Thats BS. You should not need a converter as the signal is analog not digital. You can use a digital coax or a single RCA or sub cable to 1 input (usually the left) of the sub or add a Y splitter to both inputs on the sub. Subs do not have a DAC built in to convert a digital signal to analog. You can use RCA cables or digital coax. The guys at Rat Shack don't know what they are talking about. Return the converter.
    Last edited by blackraven; 01-10-2016 at 11:25 AM.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  23. #73
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    The only reason to use a Y connector is that some subs will have a higher output if both the L and R inputs are used. A sub is mono not stereo. Read my post above.
    Last edited by blackraven; 01-10-2016 at 11:26 AM.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

  24. #74
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    i will return the converter. He said that the out on AV receiver is digital and needs to be converted to analog. The preout is black in color which he said indicated bit was digital and needed coax. He said that if you put it analog, the signal will go through but will be distorted.
    So I should return the converter and replace it with a spliter or whatever it is called to split the signal from one cable into two?

  25. #75
    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bean2011 View Post
    i will return the converter. He said that the out on AV receiver is digital and needs to be converted to analog. The preout is black in color which he said indicated bit was digital and needed coax. He said that if you put it analog, the signal will go through but will be distorted.
    So I should return the converter and replace it with a spliter or whatever it is called to split the signal from one cable into two?
    He is wrong. The sub out is a line out which is analog. If it was digital it would be labeled digital out on the receiver. It has both channels combined when it is a single mono output. You don't need the splitter but you can buy one and see if it sounds better. I would consider a nice cable from Ram electronics or Blue Jeans cables. Just make sure that you have an extra 3-4 feet of cable so you can move the sub around for the best sound.
    Pass Labs X250 amp, BAT Vk-51se Preamp,
    Thorens TD-145 TT, Bellari phono preamp, Nagaoka MP-200 Cartridge
    Magnepan QR1.6 speakers
    Luxman DA-06 DAC
    Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube DAC
    Dual Martin Logan Original Dynamo Subs
    Parasound A21 amp
    Vintage Luxman T-110 tuner
    Magnepan MMG's, Grant Fidelity DAC-11, Class D CDA254 amp
    Monitor Audio S1 speakers, PSB B6 speakers
    Vintage Technic's Integrated amp
    Music Hall 25.2 CDP
    Adcom GFR 700 AVR
    Cables- Cardas, Silnote, BJC
    Velodyne CHT 8 sub

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