First DVD-A...

[Rich-n-Texas]

...And it won't play. The DVD changer is a Panny DVD-F87, and the receiver is a Yamaha HTR 5740. The audio settings on the changer are: PCM Digital Output = up to 96KHz, Dobly Digital = Bitstream, DTS Digital Surround = Bitstream. The changer reads the disk then starts playing like I'd expect, but there's no audio. Lit indicators are: "DVD" (selected) "D.Mix", "PRG" (progressive scan for video) the track number, and "GRP" (group 1) which I can't find any info about in the manual. When the changer is in play mode, some functions at the remote don't work (I know that some aren't supposed to) or return a sluggish response from the player. The PCM indicator on the receiver is lit along with the Dolby PL light, but only the front left & right speaker indicators are lit. Also, when I run a white noise test from the changer, I only hear sound from the left & right, which makes sense. I'm able to switch the receiver to DTS and select Neo:6 music, but I don't think that makes any difference anyway. At the TV I see the screen flash some rectangle boxes, the screen goes blank after that for about a second, and then it's back at the DVD logo. This sequence repeats constantly. I'm sure this isn't enough info, but it's about all I can think of to put out here.

I have no idea what's wrong or what to do next, but I'll be real disappointed if I bought a bad DVD-A from CD Universe.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Rich

[kelsci]

My brother has one of these F changers. I have not read the manual recently but if I do recall properly, it will only play DVD-A in two channel mode.

[markw]

Unless things have changed recently, I believe you need to have the player to decode the DVD-Audio tracks and then pass them, via the six analog outputs on the player, to six corresponding inputs on the receiver.

IOW, receivers DO handle DD, DTS (via bitstream) and redbook CD (via PCM) decoding via a digital feed (coax or toslink) but they don't handle the hi-rez formats, at least not yet.

[N. Abstentia]

Yeah like markw said, unless you're connected via the multi-channel analog you're going to get nada from DVD-A.

[PeruvianSkies]

Some DVD-A's have a variety of audio formats on them. In most cases they will have a DTS 5.1, Dolby Digital 5.1 mix, which can go through your digital connection (coax or optical) however there should also be MLP 5.1, which can only go through 5.1 analog connections. I looked up that player and it does have the 5.1 analog outputs, which you willl need to connect to the receiver if you want to listen to MLP, but if you just want to listen to DTS or DD on the disc than you only need your digital connection. Most likely you will have to go into the settings on the actual player and tell it which mode to play in as well. On my DVD player you have to go under menu, then audio, then output and change the DVD-A setting from either DVD-Video ro DVD-Audio. When the machine is in DVD-Audio mode it will want to read the MLP portion and when it is in DVD-Video mode it will want to read the digital portion. I am sure that this is what you are experiencing and this should fix the issue. I've had loads of experience and problems with this same thing. One other thing...make sure that your receiver is set up to do either digital or analog based on what the player is sending it...sometimes the receiver has an 'auto' setting so it will automatically play either digital or analog if that's what is coming....mine also has a multi-channel imput that I must select when doing 5.1 analog (DVD-A or SACD).

Ask more questions if this doesn't help.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Some DVD-A's have a variety of audio formats on them. In most cases they will have a DTS 5.1, Dolby Digital 5.1 mix, which can go through your digital connection (coax or optical) however there should also be MLP 5.1, which can only go through 5.1 analog connections. I looked up that player and it does have the 5.1 analog outputs, which you willl need to connect to the receiver if you want to listen to MLP, but if you just want to listen to DTS or DD on the disc than you only need your digital connection. Most likely you will have to go into the settings on the actual player and tell it which mode to play in as well. On my DVD player you have to go under menu, then audio, then output and change the DVD-A setting from either DVD-Video ro DVD-Audio. When the machine is in DVD-Audio mode it will want to read the MLP portion and when it is in DVD-Video mode it will want to read the digital portion. I am sure that this is what you are experiencing and this should fix the issue. I've had loads of experience and problems with this same thing. One other thing...make sure that your receiver is set up to do either digital or analog based on what the player is sending it...sometimes the receiver has an 'auto' setting so it will automatically play either digital or analog if that's what is coming....mine also has a multi-channel imput that I must select when doing 5.1 analog (DVD-A or SACD).

Ask more questions if this doesn't help.

...What does MLP stand for, just for my own information.

And now the obligitory and sometimes inflamatory cable question: Since we have analog frequencies present at these outputs, what consideration should I give to cabling? I said I have boatloads of RCA cables but is there a prefered configuration? I'll only need about a 1 meter length and I'm a big fan of Acoustic Research.

[PeruvianSkies]

...What does MLP stand for, just for my own information.

And now the obligitory and sometimes inflamatory cable question: Since we have analog frequencies present at these outputs, what consideration should I give to cabling? I said I have boatloads of RCA cables but is there a prefered configuration? I'll only need about a 1 meter length and I'm a big fan of Acoustic Research.

this is what MLP stands for. There are a few sites out there that explain what it is in more detail. It's essentially a high-rez format that in most cases offers more refinement and definition over DTS or DD. I, however, always find myself preferring the thickness of DTS over MLP.

[markw]

And now the obligitory and sometimes inflamatory cable question: Since we have analog frequencies present at these outputs, what consideration should I give to cabling? I said I have boatloads of RCA cables but is there a prefered configuration? I'll only need about a 1 meter length and I'm a big fan of Acoustic Research.

All you need is six solid analog cables with RCA's on the ends, and that one meter length pretty makes anything else moot. AR cables are more than adequate but you might try what you have lying around first. The point of diminishing returns is a lot lower on cables than the marketing mavens want you to believe.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Well, there's nothing in the guide to indicate extra cabling is required, but the guide is extremely hard to follow anyway, at least for my eyes.

I read machani's review of this player, and some quotes include:

I bought this DVD-changer for two reasons: DVD-Audio playback and multi-disk capability. The F87 appears to be an exact replica of the Panasonic F85, except that the digital audio output is coaxial instead of optical which the F85 has. It can play a variety of formats: DVD, DVD-A, DVD-RAM, SACD, VCD, CD, CD-RW, etc.

And this:

CONNECTIONS: I connected the player using component video cables, since I have a HD TV monitor. I also I have it connected to my JVC RX-6030 receiver using the digital coax and also to my Cayin TA-30 tube amplifier using RCA cables (in stereo mode). I use the JVC receiver for movies and the Cayin amplifier for music in stereo mode.

I just looked at a diagram of the back of the changer and did notice accomodations for 5.1 analog output so I guess I mis-interpreted what he said in his review. And I guess you have to tell the changer to output to those connections "in stereo mode" right? My receiver will accept a six channel analog input, and I've got boatloads of RCA cables so I guess it's worth the money I paid for the DVD to connect it up.

Thanks for the help all.

PS: Thanks PS. You responded while I was composing this (at work so I have to fit actual work in) so there'll be some redundancy here. -Rich

[kelsci]

Those 5.1 analog outputs may only output dolby digital or dts from a built in dolby digital/dts in that player. I do not believe that player has a decoder for 5.1 DVD-A, but only a 2.0 or a 2.1 DVD-A. MLP if I am correct stands for Meridian Lossless Packing which is another name for DVD-A sound. I think Meridian had some input on the invention of this.

[markw]

Those 5.1 analog outputs may only output dolby digital or dts from a built in dolby digital/dts in that player. I do not believe that player has a decoder for 5.1 DVD-A, but only a 2.0 or a 2.1 DVD-A. MLP if I am correct stands for Meridian Lossless Packing which is another name for DVD-A sound. I think Meridian had some input on the invention of this.

I was under the assumption that you were working with a DVD-Audio player, but upon checking it out on the web, this doesn't look like one of them.

Just like if you had wanted to play back SACD discs, you would need a player that's capable of it, you need a player that's capable of playing DVD-Audio discs.

As you just found out, just because it says "DVD" doens't mean it'll play back the hi-rez DVD-Audio format in just any DVD player. You may get something, but it won't be Hi-Rez DVD-Audio.

Sorry for the misleading info before. It just proves that the word "assume" consists of three distinct parts.

[PeruvianSkies]

MLP - Meridian Lossless Packing is the data-reduction technique selected for DVD-Audio. MLP sounds better because it is a lossless data algorithm. It is not like MP3 for instance. You get back exactly what you put it, so it does not distort or change any of the audio information. MLP on average reduces the size of the file by about 50%. So, with MLP you can put 6 channels of 24/96 on the disk, and still not hit the 9.6 Mbs data limitation. MLP can also be used to simply get longer recording times onto the disk.

According to the specs on CRUTCHFIELD that player does do DVD-Audio...here is the spec sheet...

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-C3NnHLV...133DVDF87S#Tab

[markw]

According to the specs on CRUTCHFIELD that player does do DVD-Audio...here is the spec sheet...

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-C3NnHLV...133DVDF87S#Tab

It's good for RiT in that he CAN do DVD-Audio after all and for me as it seems the only mistake I made here is thinking I made one.

[PeruvianSkies]

It's good for RiT in that he CAN do DVD-Audio after all and for me as it seems the only mistake I made here is thinking I made one.

Do you have issues with being proved wrong? Apparently so. You can't deal with the fact that you were not right with what you posted. Rich also found all the information that I provided helpful, which is why he responded with...

I dig into to your example ASAP PS. Thanks again.

If he just follows what I told him to do instead of getting confused by your statements about how you HAVE to have analog to play DVD-A's than this would go much smoother. Maybe you need to stay out of things that you don't know very much about or be more careful when providing a solution with the words you use.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Yes, it will "playback" DVD-A and HDCD, and even though the specs @ crutchfield don't show the 5.1 audio out RCA jacks, I do still have to use them correct?

Note: I have the uncanny ability to make things more confusing and complicated than they need to be, witnessed by markw's false mistake. It doesn't even have to be obvious.

OTOH, he's from North Jerrrsey, (I from SJ) so we can't be too sure anyway!

[markw]

Yes, it will "playback" DVD-A and HDCD, and even though the specs @ crutchfield don't show the 5.1 audio out RCA jacks, I do still have to use them correct?

Yeah, the only way to getDVD-Audio is vis those analog jacks. IT sounds like your manual was written as a well as my Denon 2802 manual.

Note: I have the uncanny ability to make things more confusing and complicated than they need to be, witnessed by markw's false mistake. It doesn't even have to be obvious.

OTOH, he's from North Jerrrsey, (I from SJ) so we can't be too sure anyway!

SJ? Wazzat? South Jersey? I thought you were from Texas?

[PeruvianSkies]

Yeah, the only way to getDVD-Audio is vis those analog jacks.

No you don't. You can play DVD-Audio without 5.1 analog jacks, you however will NOT be able to play the Advanced Resolution/MLP audio portions. You can still play the DTS or DD parts of the disc. In which case all you need is a digital coax or optical connection.

[markw]

No you don't. You can play DVD-Audio without 5.1 analog jacks, you however will NOT be able to play the Advanced Resolution/MLP audio portions. You can still play the DTS or DD parts of the disc. In which case all you need is a digital coax or optical connection.

Hell, anybody can do DD/DTS with a standard DVD player and any HT receiver. Do you really think that's what he's asking about here?

Why in pulperfect he!! would anyone want to bother buying a DVD-Audio player and a DVD-Audio disc unless they wanted to lsten to what you are so fond of referring to "the Advanced Resolution/MLP audio portions", or what normal people simply call "DVD-Audio"?

Do you even bother to think about what you're saying. or are you operating on autopilot?

[PeruvianSkies]

Hell, anybody can do DD/DTS with a standard DVD player and any HT receiver. Do you really think that's what he's asking about here?

Why in pulperfect he!! would anyone want to bother buying a DVD-Audio player and a DVD-Audio disc unless they wanted to lsten to what you are so fond of referring to "the Advanced Resolution/MLP audio portions", or what normal people simply call "DVD-Audio"?

Do you even bother to think about what you're saying. or are you operating on autopilot?

Oh please. You are just upset because I corrected you when you were absolutely wrong on the matter. Don't say things that are only partially true. You made a statement that is not 100% correct. You CAN play DVD-A's without having the 6 analog connections, so maybe you should revise your comment and simply say that you MUST have analog in order to play advanced resolution or MLP.

Don't blame me for your errors.

[PeruvianSkies]

Why in pulperfect he!! would anyone want to bother buying a DVD-Audio player and a DVD-Audio disc unless they wanted to lsten to what you are so fond of referring to "the Advanced Resolution/MLP audio portions", or what normal people simply call "DVD-Audio"?

Do you even bother to think about what you're saying. or are you operating on autopilot?

Hey markw...answer me this since you know so much....

What is DTS Entertainment known for? Oh wait...releasing DVD-Audio's and holding the largest part of the DVD-A market. Hmmmm. Interesting since you claim that people are buying DVD-A for MLP and that's the only reason they are bothering with the format.

[PeruvianSkies]

Yeah, the only way to getDVD-Audio is vis those analog jacks.

YOU ARE SOOOOOOOOO WRONG ON SOOOOOOOO MANY LEVELS.

You say that you can ONLY get DVD-A to play with analog, which is obviously wrong as you can play DVD-A's with a digital connection as you are now aware of and perhaps you already knew, but didn't come across very well. The original poster RICH-N-TEXAS never mentions anything about specifically playing MLP or analog in his initial post, he simply has a problem playing his first DVD-Audio title that he purchased and wants to know what it won't play. Therefore, my responses have been clarifying the matters and explaining to him what MLP is. He was unaware of the differences between having the player set for analog or digital.

YOU ARE THE ONE who is making this issue muddy by telling him that he MUST have analog connections to play the darn thing. Get your facts straight and then provide them accurately. Don't attack me for your wrong information. Is 1949 the year that mothers dropped kids on their heads or something?

Rich.....

If you need help with this just ask me or PM me...I actually know what I am talking about unlike certain OTHER people around here.

[markw]

YOU ARE SOOOOOOOOO WRONG ON SOOOOOOOO MANY LEVELS.

You say that you can ONLY get DVD-A to play with analog, which is obviously wrong as you can play DVD-A's with a digital connection as you are now aware of and perhaps you already knew, but didn't come across very well. The original poster RICH-N-TEXAS never mentions anything about specifically playing MLP or analog in his initial post, he simply has a problem playing his first DVD-Audio title that he purchased and wants to know what it won't play. Therefore, my responses have been clarifying the matters and explaining to him what MLP is. He was unaware of the differences between having the player set for analog or digital.

YOU ARE THE ONE who is making this issue muddy by telling him that he MUST have analog connections to play the darn thing. Get your facts straight and then provide them accurately. Don't attack me for your wrong information. Is 1949 the year that mothers dropped kids on their heads or something?

Rich.....

If you need help with this just ask me or PM me...I actually know what I am talking about unlike certain OTHER people around here.

.. out of your arse again.

You obviously didn't even read or at least comprehend my posts. Please note that in every post I made, I referenced "DVD-Audio".

to wit: (or twit, whichever)

he simply has a problem playing his first DVD-Audio title

DVD-Audio? Funny, according to you that's not the same as "DVD-A, is it? Then why bring it up here? Why not just refer to it as a "DVD-A" disc like you do everywhere else?

Now, here you go using it. I guess that proves my point that you knew he was asking about "DVD-AUDIO", Not just any old format on a that disc, but just wanted to get your moneys worth out of that verbal exlax you took. I'd say you did well

Can you say "burn-out", kiddies?

But, I hear drug use cause a lot of birth defects in children born between 1979 and 1981. Must be tied into sitting too close to laserdiscs.

[PeruvianSkies]

Yeah, the only way to getDVD-Audio is vis those analog jacks. IT sounds like your manual was written as a well as my Denon 2802 manual.

SJ? Wazzat? South Jersey? I thought you were from Texas?

If you write so well than please tell me what a VIS is?

I don't need to back up my words...I have not said anything on here that you can prove is wrong. Show me one thing on here that I said as advice to Rich that is incorrect? Please enlighten me....

Once again you are just bitter because you are being schooled by someone younger than yourself. Just face that fact that you were not giving all the correct information.

[markw]

If you write so well than please tell me what a VIS is?

Bwahahaha. You're kiddng, right? You know what that means, doncha?

I don't need to back up my words...I have not said anything on here that you can prove is wrong.

Well, by implying that one needs a DVD-Audio player to extract DD and DTS soundtracks is dead wrong and my link proves that, yet you tried to pass that off as justification for needing a DVD-Audio player. Actually, I'm pretty sure that was ignorance on your part and you were bluffing your candy-a$$ off, but I'll leave that up to the forum to make that decision.

Show me one thing on here that I said as advice to Rich that is incorrect? Please enlighten me....

Dunno, but you threw so much stuff that I doubt he's too clear on anything.

Once again you are just bitter because you are being schooled by someone younger than yourself. Just face that fact that you were not giving all the correct information.

Bitter? No. I gave correct info and you're the only one who is too arrogant and stubborn to admit it. You really should get out of that damp, dark cellar some time and get some sunlight. It might do your attitude some good. You just might even make a friend or two. Miracles DO happen.

I just love taking an arrogant newbie who think they are G-D's gift to this hobby and rubbing their faces in their own verbal excrement. You've been a sterling example.

And, as far as "proving you wrong". there's no need. It's here for all to see where you lied and tried put words in my mouth. No, there's nothing for me to prove. You've done it for me.

Thanks for playing. You're the weakest link.

How's it feel to hit rock bottom in front of the whole forum?

[PeruvianSkies]

Bwahahaha. You're kiddng, right? You know what that means, doncha?

Well, by implying that one /needs a DVD-Audio player to extract DD and DTS soundtracks is dead wrong, yet you tried to pass that off as justification for needing a DVD-Audio player. Actually, I'm pretty sure that was ignorance on your part and you were bluffing your candy-a$$ off, but I'll leave that up to the forum to make that decision.

Dunno, but you threw so much stuff that I doubt he's too clear on anything.

Bitter? No. I just love taking an arrogant newbie who think they are G-D's gift to this hobby and rubbing their faces in their own verbal excrement. You've been a sterling example.

And, as far as "proving you wrong". there for all to see where you lied and tried put words in my mouth. No, there's nothing for me to prove. You've done it for me.

Thanks for playing. You're the weakest link.

How's it feel to hit rock bottom in front of the whole forum?

Who is a newbie here? I've been on this site well over a year and have nearly as many posts as you do. I have 1000+ with this name and another 800+ with my other name, whcih was retired back in October. I have nearly as many posts here as you do in over 5 years that it took you. I have 7 years of experience in this hobby and while I may not be as old as you...I am hardly a newbie. I think my information provided speaks volumes to that and it's not my fault that you can't handle the information that I gave. Apparently you just can't keep up with my speed.