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  1. #151
    RGA
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    Filecat

    I hate cars. I have put so much money into these damn cars that I could have made huge upgrades to my stereo. Once I get a stable job - in one location I am living in walking distance and I'll rent a car on the odd weekend if I want to go someplace.

    Spending $20k+ on a speaker is not crazy - if you choose right and you know you will keep them then they can last 30+ years. A car practically falls apart in year 10 these days. Once mechanic friend who is very very knowledgable about all cars - even Kia (I have a Rondo) noted to avoid virtually any car using a 6 speed automatic transmission). Too small, too hot, blow up fast, expensive to fix - get the warranty! hahaha.

    Just giant money pits. The rondo I bought was 3 years old and only had 18,000Km on it. Had it a year and it's been the best vehicle I have ever owned. I get the same gas mileage out of it that I got on my Toyota Corolla. The Kia is much heavier, stronger, safer and a V6 engine. The Toyota was a big pile of overrated junk - oh and it could probably kill me with the whole - breaks don't override the gas pedal thing. I am selling it to go live overseas but if I come back to the west and do decide to buy another car - I would definitely look into Kia and Hyundai(same company now). More features, longer warranties, generally safer, good mileage and generally cheaper. They came a long way from the Pony.




  2. #152
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RGA View Post
    Filecat

    I hate cars. I have put so much money into these damn cars that I could have made huge upgrades to my stereo. Once I get a stable job - in one location I am living in walking distance and I'll rent a car on the odd weekend if I want to go someplace.

    Spending $20k+ on a speaker is not crazy - if you choose right and you know you will keep them then they can last 30+ years. A car practically falls apart in year 10 these days. Once mechanic friend who is very very knowledgable about all cars - even Kia (I have a Rondo) noted to avoid virtually any car using a 6 speed automatic transmission). Too small, too hot, blow up fast, expensive to fix - get the warranty! hahaha.

    Just giant money pits. The rondo I bought was 3 years old and only had 18,000Km on it. Had it a year and it's been the best vehicle I have ever owned. I get the same gas mileage out of it that I got on my Toyota Corolla. The Kia is much heavier, stronger, safer and a V6 engine. The Toyota was a big pile of overrated junk - oh and it could probably kill me with the whole - breaks don't override the gas pedal thing. I am selling it to go live overseas but if I come back to the west and do decide to buy another car - I would definitely look into Kia and Hyundai(same company now). More features, longer warranties, generally safer, good mileage and generally cheaper. They came a long way from the Pony.
    It's all very well for a single person to advocate spending as much on hi-fi as on one's automobile but it's probably less practical for us married persons.

    The Kia Rondo is an interesting vehical -- a sort of small-but-tall station wagon or mini-minivan -- and I am considering it as a possible replacement for my aging Taurus wagon. Interestingly it doesn't seem to be sold in the USA; in any case it isn't mentioned in Consumer Reports reviews.

  3. #153
    RGA
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    Feanor

    The Rondo got a recommended tag in the prior to the current issues of Consumer Reports. And it got a whopping 4 stars out of 5 from he Lemon-Aid - Honda Accord and Civic only got 3 stars and the Toyota Corolla got 2. Elantra touring got top marks at 5 stars.

    Kia is no longer selling the Rondo in the U.S. market but it is one of the better sellers in Canada. It's kind of strange - I figured it would be a better seller because it offers a huge amount of leg room headroom excellent visibility ample power and cargo space. I folded the seats down and got a full single bed in the back with the box spring and I could still close the hatch - That's pretty good for a mini-mini-van.

    Everyone who's been in it has liked it. It's more of a soccer mom mobile I admit but I choose practical and reliable as first considerations and worry over looks later. While I am selling my Rondo due to working overseas possibilities - I can say when and if I ever come back to Canada I would definitely be looking at Hyundai and Kia. The Lemon aid only really gave good marks to the Rondo - none of their other cars - though I think a couple got 3 stars. It's better than the 1 star ratings most of them got when they first came out.

    My car has 40,000km on it and I still have a full wrap warranty to 2017 and 180,000km - so if you know anyone on Vancouver Island/Vancouver looking for one let me know

  4. #154
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    hey good one!

    the car is a load of bollocks! unless you were some high flying corporate exec who obviously needed good wheels to go places specially those high profile client visits. then again most exec's these days would be provided with cars from the company and all paid for.

    that's good because then you can focus some decent monies into your audio system. I have not bothered to go the other way, plus fuel prices are crazy these days in Australia, more of the smaller cars are coming up in a big way. Hyundai, Kia, Mitsubishi, Toyota, Honda etc, all are extremely good on fuel/milage; I would trade in my Honda sports accord any day for one of these smaller babies.

    the wifey is also pleased to run around in a smaller car, hepls with the parking; that's when I just sit back on the weekends and listen to my favorite tracks until late. afterall that's what it's all about "enjoy the music!"
    cheers, RJ

    p.s. now I have started saving for my daughter's education... that's more important than audio systems, plus in a span of the last 6 years I have reached the pinnacle with my system and very content with the results. Quad & c-j what more do you need.

  5. #155
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feanor View Post
    It's all very well for a single person to advocate spending as much on hi-fi as on one's automobile but it's probably less practical for us married persons.
    Yep... I can't imagine explaining to my GF (much less my wife - if we get married) that I intend to spend more money on the HiFi than on a car....

    I do agree with RGA and Raj J that a car is really just a status symbol for many people... (though of course, expensive HiFi can also be just a status symbol for some persons)... My feeling is to spend your money on what you like; so if you value HiFi more than cars (and are single or have a VERY understanding spouse) then get that ultra expensive HiFi rig...

  6. #156
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by filecat13 View Post
    I'd forgotten about this until I got spammed back to the forum by another thread I'd subscribed to. Your skepticism deserves a response, and I neglected to do so.

    As simple as it gets.
    1. I went to CAS with no intent to purchase.
    2. I heard JBL Everest II loudspeakers while there.
    3. I was blown away by the MF and HF produced by those horns. Best of show IMO, despite the problematic room.
    4. I went back to that room more than once to be sure I really liked high-priced horns that much.
    5. I knew I could not afford $66,000 speakers.
    6. The dealer had $44,000 JBL K2 speakers with similar horns/drivers sitting unused on the same room and had no plans to hook them up. (Why bring them?)
    7. As the show closed for the day, we prevailed on him to hook them up after most everyone had left.
    8. Upon hearing them that one time I was compelled to get them. They were nearly as good as the SOTA K2s (and available for less than 44k).
    9. Without hearing those unobtainable (to me) SOTA Everests I would never have desired to hear the K2s and decided to purchase them. I cannot think of a logical sequence in which I would have sought out a dealer to listen to K2s before going to the show, since I was not in the market for expensive speakers.
    10. Hearing $66k speakers, then hearing how very close much cheaper speakers are makes a (less than) $44,000 expenditure seem "reasonable," whereas, going out to look/listen/buy $44k speakers seems "unreasonable" to me. That's why I'd never go to the trouble of seeking a hard-to-find dealer to get the speakers I ended up with.


    At least my original story was entertaining. Thanks for that.
    The chain of events makes perfect sense... But suppose that the dealer had initially setup the K2s instead of the Everest at the show; in that case you would have heard the K2 but not the Everest. Chances are that you might have opened your chequebook in that scenario as well, as the K2 is clearly top quality speaker in its own right...

    But yes I can understand that if I went to a show and heard a SOTA piece from a manufacturer and was blown away, then I'd want to audition any cheaper gear they have in my price range...

  7. #157
    RGA
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    Ajani

    Agreed. The Lemon aid guide for example rates cars on quality, reliability and safety - A Hyundai Elantra Touring (designed in Germany) is given 5 stars. All Mercedes and B&W Models get 3 stars or lower and basically called overpriced junk in some cases.

    But because the sticker is $90,000 it is automatically viewed as being better.

    I have heard $50,000+ amplifiers from Krell, Soullution, Edge that I would not trade my modest amplifier for - and it's not close. And I think back to that lemon-aid guide about the cars. I don't get it.

    Even if I was to factor in performance on the car front - it still doesn't make sense - It is illegal to drive the cars to the point where the performance is going to matter - so basically the only way to get the performance factor advantage is to skirt the law and put lives in jeopardy.

    With stereo gear - it comes down to design. A good Single Ended amplifier is a single ended amplifier and no amount of money spent on solid state high negative feedback will match it no matter how expensive the amp. Of course there is a subjective aspect to this in that you have to hold the design as the best sounding design you've heard. So IMO and IME are tags that have to be used. And more expensive SET tends to sound a lot better than less expensive SET. So a direct car analogy can't be truly made.

  8. #158
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    I've only had five cars in my life. But then, I've only had two speakers, excluding my office speakers and the Dunlavy SCIVs I bought from my brother: the classic AR 3a and the Fulton Js. BTW, I have NEVER heard a system that is significantly better than my mostly decades old one (Fulton J speakers, AR SP 8 preamp or Mystere CA21, AR D70 amp, VPI Scoutmaster tt, Benz Ruby 3, Fosgate phono or Counterpoint CA 2 prepreamp). I am currently looking into a tube reel-to-reel tape deck after hearing one at the 2111 CAS. BACK TO THE FUTURE!

  9. #159
    ISCET CET, FCC CTT, USITT Dual-500's Avatar
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    For me it's not about leading edge state of the art - it's about buying quality gear in the first place. About 1/2 of my system was purchased "used". All the amps were picked up used - one got a full restoration before being put into service. System controllers were purchased new and the outboard eq's. All used speaker components.

  10. #160
    Forum Regular filecat13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tube fan View Post
    BTW, I have NEVER heard a system that is significantly better than my mostly decades old one (Fulton J speakers, AR SP 8 preamp or Mystere CA21, AR D70 amp, VPI Scoutmaster tt, Benz Ruby 3, Fosgate phono or Counterpoint CA 2 prepreamp). I am currently looking into a tube reel-to-reel tape deck after hearing one at the 2111 CAS. BACK TO THE FUTURE!
    What a curious statement!
    I like sulung tang.

  11. #161
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    State of the art seem to be more sloganism designed to entice consumers to go visit certain showrooms. For me, I'll be more careful when manufacturers touts their products being their flagship or top of their line etc. I'd learn a costly lesson in some of my Yamaha and DBX components which no longer gives me listening pleasure but keeps my office documents and magazines organized as paperweights!

  12. #162
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    A product that's "the top of the line" or the "flagship" is not necessarily related to being "state of the art". AFAIK DBX has never truly aspired in that direction. Although Yamaha has made some true state of the art, their "sota" products are few, far between and widely sought after. TBH, that rules out just about every receiver, expander, or equalizer and a very large percentage of of integrated amps.
    If you have some Yamaha mono blocks or one of their sold only in Japan preamps I'd be interested in taking those paperweights off your hands.

    The price of an inexpensive paperweight would, I believe, be appropriate.
    ARC SP9 MKIII, VPI HW19, Rega RB300
    Marcof PPA1, Shure, Sumiko, Ortofon carts, Yamaha DVD-S1800
    Behringer UCA222, Emotiva XDA-2, HiFimeDIY
    Accuphase T101, Teac V-7010, Nak ZX-7. LX-5, Behringer DSP1124P
    Front: Magnepan 1.7, DBX 223SX, 2 modified Dynaco MK3's, 2, 12" DIY TL subs (Pass El-Pipe-O) 2 bridged Crown XLS-402
    Rear/HT: Emotiva UMC200, Acoustat Model 1/SPW-1, Behringer CX2310, 2 Adcom GFA-545

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