View Poll Results: Do you listen to gear below your budget when you go equipment shopping?

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  • I usually listen to cheaper items when I audition gear

    7 36.84%
  • I sometimes listen to cheaper gear

    5 26.32%
  • I rarely listen to gear below my budget

    6 31.58%
  • I never listen to cheaper gear

    1 5.26%
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  1. #26
    Forum Regular pixelthis's Avatar
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    I see you never got past Julian Hirsch and the irrelevancy of THD. The real answer is more linear dynamic performance and better spectral distribution of the distortion components. It's easy to get a great spec - just crank the negative feedback. Looks fine on paper. Or for whose who are undiscerning in their hearing.

    Speaking of which, try out this little distortion analyzer test on your PC. 5% distortion correlates to about -26 db. I suspect you'll get about -15 db. Good luck!

    Distortion Test

    rw

    You know, its really sad when someone in the "know" smugly puts down someone
    who states that an obsolete way of doing things is worse, when the facts are obvious.
    The whole tube craze is absolutely insane.
    I once read a review of a monoblock "amp" in stereophile magazine, the distortion was 5%
    and the output a sterling FIVE WATTS.
    The price for two?
    TEN GRAND.
    Of course the reviewer raved about this prime example of something out of a 1934 Sears catalog.
    Tubes are obsolete, they dont perform as good as your basic clock radio.
    You need a heater circuit to warm the emitters, basically a space heater in your gear.
    Tubes wear out, discrete solid state lasts a lifetime.
    And as they wear out the electrical properties change, tubes are a lot less stable than solid state, and produce a lot more heat.
    In order to get even halfway decent sound you have to "warm" your gear for at least an hour, takes awhile for a tube to settle down to spec.
    Its like everybody put away their cars and started using horses, proclaiming
    the great fresh air while ignoring the piles of dung.
    The history of this "hobby" will look back on this fad and go "tisk tisk".
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  2. #27
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    You know, its really sad when someone in the "know" smugly puts down someone who states that an obsolete way of doing things is worse, when the facts are obvious.
    Apparently, you just don't want to benefit from the experience of others and learn any better.

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    ...the distortion was 5%
    You really need to pay attention. Those levels were only at maximum rated power. Look at any Stereophile test. The largely monotonic distortion runs very low only until the last 3 db or so of output. The distortion test I linked to demonstrates that you are incapable of even hearing 5% distortion.

    rw

  3. #28
    Ajani
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    You know, its really sad when someone in the "know" smugly puts down someone
    who states that an obsolete way of doing things is worse, when the facts are obvious.
    The whole tube craze is absolutely insane.
    I once read a review of a monoblock "amp" in stereophile magazine, the distortion was 5%
    and the output a sterling FIVE WATTS.
    The price for two?
    TEN GRAND.
    Of course the reviewer raved about this prime example of something out of a 1934 Sears catalog.
    Tubes are obsolete, they dont perform as good as your basic clock radio.
    You need a heater circuit to warm the emitters, basically a space heater in your gear.
    Tubes wear out, discrete solid state lasts a lifetime.
    And as they wear out the electrical properties change, tubes are a lot less stable than solid state, and produce a lot more heat.
    In order to get even halfway decent sound you have to "warm" your gear for at least an hour, takes awhile for a tube to settle down to spec.
    Its like everybody put away their cars and started using horses, proclaiming
    the great fresh air while ignoring the piles of dung.
    The history of this "hobby" will look back on this fad and go "tisk tisk".
    I believe that $10K for just 5 watts is ridanculous and I think Vinyl, tubes and even some planars are just too outdated and impractical for me to use. However, I do realize that technical measurements are only part of the story. This is a very subjective hobby, so just having a flat frequency response and low distortion doesn't translate into sounding great to everyone. If someone else finds that a $10k 5 watt tube amp and a $15K turntable gives him sonic nirvana, then who am I to say anything?

    Further, if someone prefers riding a horse to driving a car, then so what? A car maybe faster, safer, more comfortable & far more practical, but I'm sure that no car can provide the kind of satisfaction to a horse-rider that a horse will. I think Tubes, Vinyl & Planars vs Solid State, CDs & Cone speakers is pretty much the same thing as horse vs car.

    I like the fact that there is so much variety in the audio world, it just gives audio-lovers more chances to find sonic nirvana.

  4. #29
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    You know, its really sad when someone in the "know" smugly puts down someone
    who states that an obsolete way of doing things is worse, when the facts are obvious.
    The whole tube craze is absolutely insane.
    I once read a review of a monoblock "amp" in stereophile magazine, the distortion was 5%
    and the output a sterling FIVE WATTS.
    The price for two?
    TEN GRAND.
    Of course the reviewer raved about this prime example of something out of a 1934 Sears catalog.
    Tubes are obsolete, they dont perform as good as your basic clock radio.
    You need a heater circuit to warm the emitters, basically a space heater in your gear.
    Tubes wear out, discrete solid state lasts a lifetime.
    And as they wear out the electrical properties change, tubes are a lot less stable than solid state, and produce a lot more heat.
    In order to get even halfway decent sound you have to "warm" your gear for at least an hour, takes awhile for a tube to settle down to spec.
    Its like everybody put away their cars and started using horses, proclaiming
    the great fresh air while ignoring the piles of dung.
    The history of this "hobby" will look back on this fad and go "tisk tisk".
    when was the last time you heard a tube amp?

    I heard quite some systems with tubes in them, and they were amongst the best I've ever heard.

    Keep them spinning,
    Bert.
    Life is music!

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  5. #30
    Ajani
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by basite
    when was the last time you heard a tube amp?

    I heard quite some systems with tubes in them, and they were amongst the best I've ever heard.

    Keep them spinning,
    Bert.
    Bert, You're probably wasting your time asking that question. Pix seems to have dismissed tubes based on measured performance, not sound.

  6. #31
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    I don't know a whole lot about tubes vs SS in stereo amplifiers. But I do have a tube guitar amp. I've heard SS versions of the same amp. The SS sounds cold in comparison to the warm sound from my amp. As far as the numbers go, I've never measured them. But most of the friends I have with SS amps are willing to trade me and pay me a difference even though my amp is much older.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  7. #32
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by basite
    I heard quite some systems with tubes in them, and they were amongst the best I've ever heard.
    I realized that when I was your age, too.. I still remember hearing tMagneplanar T3s tri-amped with Audio Research electronics back in '74. The dealer also sold Crown and we compared a D-76a with a DC-300a. No comparison when the objective is reproducing dynamic musical content, not the test tones from which THD is measured.

    rw

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