How much does "Power of Suggestion" influence cable purchases?

Sorry to say, but I have to say alot.

Recent review of HomeDepot 14 guage zip cord by The Absolute Sound is a good example (below link).

Lets face it. HD cable is an ordinary zip cord (it is really an outdoor extension cord) which many yeasayers consider lowest common denominator. The way TAS describe HD "sound" gave it such a rosy picture that have created a [buying] zip cord rush by cable savvies. And many agree with TAS about cable's signature after auditioning it. Some even suggested 100 hours of breakin to fully realize these cables :D

The question is would there be such a commotion over zip cord if TAS review have not been so positive? Would buyer's review still be positive?

Here is the picture of HD cable in question:
<img src="http://www.avguide.com/servlet/com.absolutemultimedia.servlets.DownloadLargeProdu ctImage?product=2850">

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/news...e_survey2.html

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Originally Posted by Tony_Montana

Sorry to say, but I have to say alot.

Recent review of HomeDepot 14 guage zip cord by The Absolute Sound is a good example (below link).

Lets face it. HD cable is an ordinary zip cord (it is really an outdoor extension cord) which many yeasayers consider lowest common denominator. The way TAS describe HD "sound" gave it such a rosy picture that have created a [buying] zip cord rush by cable savvies. And many agree with TAS about cable's signature after auditioning it. Some even suggested 100 hours of breakin to fully realize these cables :D

The question is would there be such a commotion over zip cord if TAS review have not been so positive? Would buyer's review still be positive?

Here is the picture of HD cable in question:
<img src="http://www.avguide.com/servlet/com.absolutemultimedia.servlets.DownloadLargeProdu ctImage?product=2850">

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/news...e_survey2.html

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The reviewers didn't recommend it as highly as your post reads, IMHO. Both of them chose several other cables as being the best in their system. However, they certainly liked it more than one would think, based on its stature in the cable caste system.

Your question is a most interesting one. I'd have to say that based on this, audiophiles are very much influenced by reviews. I'd further speculate that many people have made scathing remarks about this cable in the past and are now reconsidering. I've noticed and been told by others that on the rare occasion that a product is given a negative review in the audiophile press, that products resale value takes a nosedive AND there are numerous people wanting to sell that product on the internet. I find it odd that they would have owned and loved this product for sometimes years and then determined it was worthless due to the opinion of a reviewer. It's almost frightening in a way. Someone on this board told me they purchased a $7500 pair of speakers used for $1800 after those speakers received a negative review. The seller had owned them for three years and the buyer/poster had heard them before and knew they were perfect for him!

One question: If this HD is an extension cord, how did they come up with the bright idea to use it as a speaker cable and replace the ends?

"...One question: If this HD is an extension cord, how did they come up with the bright idea to use it as a speaker cable and replace the ends?..."

HE!!...it's only wire...it can be terminated as you like it and used within its service ratings...

A better question should be: How does CAT5 become the darling of some? Or teflon become the insulator of choice? Or gear get nestled on sandbags? Styrofoam cups...green markers?

jimHJJ(...was that in the April Issue? Was it authored by Prof. I. Lirpa?...jus' wunnerin'...)

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Originally Posted by Tony_Montana

The question is would there be such a commotion over zip cord if TAS review have not been so positive? Would buyer's review still be positive?

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Those types of reviews are completely and utterly meaningless to me. Although I cannot say for certain how they evaluated those cables, from the text of their description and reviews it sounds like sighted listening.

Once again, it is completely and utterly meaningless to me. I'm waiting for a real and meaningful wire evaluation, not a bunch of guys doing the cable masterbation dance.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tony_Montana

Sorry to say, but I have to say alot.

Recent review of HomeDepot 14 guage zip cord by The Absolute Sound is a good example (below link).

Lets face it. HD cable is an ordinary zip cord (it is really an outdoor extension cord) which many yeasayers consider lowest common denominator. The way TAS describe HD "sound" gave it such a rosy picture that have created a [buying] zip cord rush by cable savvies. And many agree with TAS about cable's signature after auditioning it. Some even suggested 100 hours of breakin to fully realize these cables :D

The question is would there be such a commotion over zip cord if TAS review have not been so positive? Would buyer's review still be positive?

Here is the picture of HD cable in question:
<img


src="http://www.avguide.com/servlet/com.absolutemultimedia.servlets.DownloadLargeProdu ctImage?product=2850">

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/news...e_survey2.html

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I bet Home Depot is thrilled to know that all the audio engineering that went into their AC extension cord is finally getting noticed :D I guess practical and reasonable is the new pretentious and outrageous.

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Originally Posted by Tony_Montana

Sorry to say, but I have to say alot.

Recent review of HomeDepot 14 guage zip cord by The Absolute Sound is a good example (below link).

Lets face it. HD cable is an ordinary zip cord (it is really an outdoor extension cord) which many yeasayers consider lowest common denominator. The way TAS describe HD "sound" gave it such a rosy picture that have created a [buying] zip cord rush by cable savvies. And many agree with TAS about cable's signature after auditioning it. Some even suggested 100 hours of breakin to fully realize these cables :D

The question is would there be such a commotion over zip cord if TAS review have not been so positive? Would buyer's review still be positive?

Here is the picture of HD cable in question:
<img src="http://www.avguide.com/servlet/com.absolutemultimedia.servlets.DownloadLargeProdu ctImage?product=2850">

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/news...e_survey2.html

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Tony:

You apparently conclude that the "commotion over zip cord " which followed the TAS review is evidence in support of the conclusion you have reached that the power of suggestion has a "lot" to do with influencing the purchase of cables.

I know that you adhere strictly to the scientific method and would not reach a conclusion using "evidence" that wasn't based on solid empirical test or study results.

I'm just curious as to the results of your study. According to your study, how many people purchased the HD wire as a result of the TAS review and how was that figure determined?

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Originally Posted by rb122

I'd further speculate that many people have made scathing remarks about this cable in the past and are now reconsidering.

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Before TAS made review of this cable, I don't think anybody mentioned or reviewed this cable (to my knowledge) since it is an extension cord. I have seen review of HomeDepot speaker wires (which is 12 gauge and clearly marked speaker wires) but not their extension cord. I bet you a dollar that before the TAS review, if anybody would have used HD extension cord and gave it a positive review, she/he would have been shot down by cable gurus faster than speeding train :)

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Originally Posted by Resident Loser

A better question should be: How does CAT5 become the darling of some? Or teflon become the insulator of choice? Or gear get nestled on sandbags? Styrofoam cups...green markers?

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Easy. Just approach those matter subjectively and everything is possible. Even earth can be flat :D

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Originally Posted by Monstrous Mike

Once again, it is completely and utterly meaningless to me. I'm waiting for a real and meaningful wire evaluation, not a bunch of guys doing the cable masterbation dance.

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One funny thing about these kind of subjective reviewing is that they always mention how wire improved soundstaging, improve high, midrange, low, or made vocal clearer. Those improvement make it sound like that they evaluate those wires on less than stellar system and/or room acoustic-which lack quality[s] brought on by cables. So fundamentally those reviews are either flawed, or it has been evaluated on a flawed system.

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Originally Posted by Rockwell

I bet Home Depot is thrilled to know that all the audio engineering that went into their AC extension cord is finally getting noticed.

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May HD should start applying the same cable engineering know how to their speaker wires :D

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Originally Posted by pctower

I'm just curious as to the results of your study. According to your study, how many people purchased the HD wire as a result of the TAS review and how was that figure determined?

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I have to say 99 if not 100%. I have seen plenty reviews of HD "speakers" wires, but I have not seen any review of that particular extension cord before TAS review it. Right after the TAS article, flood gate of reviews opened on this cable.

Here is the latest:

http://www.audioasylum.com/audio/cab...ges/92702.html

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Originally Posted by rb122

One question: If this HD is an extension cord, how did they come up with the bright idea to use it as a speaker cable and replace the ends?

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I think this may be a mixup. Why would anyone think of using a 3 conductor extension cable? Of course it will work just fine. It's per foot cost may or may not compare to their regular 12ga or 14 ga speaker wires.

It may very well be cheaper than buying zip cord by the foot. You can always parallel the third wire to cut down resistance to a degree.

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Originally Posted by Tony_Montana

Sorry to say, but I have to say alot.

Recent review of HomeDepot 14 guage zip cord by The Absolute Sound is a good example (below link).

Lets face it. HD cable is an ordinary zip cord (it is really an outdoor extension cord) which many yeasayers consider lowest common denominator. The way TAS describe HD "sound" gave it such a rosy picture that have created a [buying] zip cord rush by cable savvies. And many agree with TAS about cable's signature after auditioning it. Some even suggested 100 hours of breakin to fully realize these cables :D

The question is would there be such a commotion over zip cord if TAS review have not been so positive? Would buyer's review still be positive?

Here is the picture of HD cable in question:
http://www.avguide.com/servlet/com.a...e?product=2850

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/news...e_survey2.html

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I hate the color. Sheesh!!!!!!!! If I had to, I'd pay up to twice as much for clear, off white, tan or black. But of course, I don't have to!

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Originally Posted by Pat D

I hate the color. Sheesh!!!!!!!! If I had to, I'd pay up to twice as much for clear, off white, tan or black. But of course, I don't have to!

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DANG-IT!!!!!!!!!

I just threw away an orange extension cord that I cut in two with a hedge trimmer this last weekend. The trash is being picked up today! I wonder if I can get home in time? I never knew.

I actually went and bought a new one from ACE Hardware. I wonder if it would work as well. It's green in color so it might not be as good as the orange, but the next time I chop it in two with the hedge clippers, I'm hookin it up.

JSE :D

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Originally Posted by JSE

DANG-IT!!!!!!!!!

I just threw away an orange extension cord that I cut in two with a hedge trimmer this last weekend. The trash is being picked up today! I wonder if I can get home in time? I never knew.

I actually went and bought a new one from ACE Hardware. I wonder if it would work as well. It's green in color so it might not be as good as the orange, but the next time I chop it in two with the hedge clippers, I'm hookin it up.

JSE :D

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JSE you crack me up !!!!!!!!!!!!

well, I have a nice blue one .... flexible in cold weather, wonder what the sound quality of that wire is in Island WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

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Originally Posted by omikey

JSE you crack me up !!!!!!!!!!!!

well, I have a nice blue one .... flexible in cold weather, wonder what the sound quality of that wire is in Island WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

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What kind of sound out of a blue extention cord? Um...... a cold shrill sound. Duh!

Some people just don't get it. :D

JSE

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Originally Posted by JSE

What kind of sound out of a blue extention cord?

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May be Blues music sound good on that cable :D

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Originally Posted by Tony_Montana

May be Blues music sound good on that cable :D

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LOL ! :D :D :D

JSE

"A better question should be: How does ..... teflon become the insulator of choice?"

The answer to that is easy. It is the insulator of choice for professionals and there is a logical explanation that has nothing to do with sound.

In many if not most commercial buildings built in the last few decades in the United States, the air conditioning system uses the space above a false hung ceiling as a return air plenum. Much audio wiring such as that used for PA systems runs exposed through this space. Since a terrible famous fire in the late 1970s where 6 executives of Arrow Electronics of Sunnyvale Ca were killed at the Stoffer's Inn in New York due to toxic gas resulting from the combustion products of PVC in the return plenum and spread by the air conditioning system, the fire and electrical codes were revised to require specially rated wiring in these spaces and teflon fits the bill. It must have taken a while for contractors and even consultants to get it into their heads but after absorbing the cost of replacing pvc wiring they installed by mistake, most if not all finally settled on teflon because there will be no mistake and the additional cost for an entire job is minimal. Besides, teflon is stonger than pvc and therefore less prone to subsequent damage and it IS a better insulator and dielectric. However, given the outstanding performance of pvc coax for example for video in TV studios and at rf frequencies at brodcast stations, it is highly unlikely that teflon offers any audible improvement in home sound systems whatsoever.

...I'm well aware of the facts and the myths...it's all we can use in the Big Apple in those situations....

jimHJJ(...as I pointed out to JR some time ago...)

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Originally Posted by skeptic

However, given the outstanding performance of pvc coax for example for video in TV studios and at rf frequencies at brodcast stations, it is highly unlikely that teflon offers any audible improvement in home sound systems whatsoever.

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Hey Skep

I agree with you about the questionability of Teflon vs PVC sound improvement for audio applications, but electrically PVC have very poor Dielectric Constant. It is almost twice as high as Teflon. Given that air have the best Dielectric Constant (K=1), Teflon Constant is about K=2, while PVC is around K=4. The higher Dielectric Constant, the poorer it will perform as dielectric.

But now days, most cables use Polyethylene (PE) insulation which have Constant of K=2.1, and it is much cheaper than Teflon :)

:o ..more than pure BULL SH!# :) :cool: