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  1. #1
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    DIY floor speakers

    I have been reading a lot from many different sites about diy speakers.
    check this out and tell me what you think:

    http://www.partsexpress.com/projectshowcase/veritas.htm

    I'm going to do a tweater substitution with the Vifa D27TG-05 from parts express...
    i'm interested in the quality of the speakers and total ability to really rock...??
    I'm think about pairing them up with the karmon kardon hk3480

    what do you guys think? any other suggestions?

    thanks

  2. #2
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    Why sub the tweeter?

    Why do a tweeter substitute? If you do, you'll likely have to modify the crossover to correctly integrate the new driver with the rest of the system.

  3. #3
    DIY Dude poneal's Avatar
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    If you can wait a month or so

    RomanB is almost finished with his RS three way using the RS28, RS125, and RS225. He has been keeping me informed and this guys looks awsome. +/- 1db pretty much across the entire FR. I have built a two way using the RS150 and it just totally rocks how musical it is. These RS drivers were made specifically with music in mind. Just an outstanding bargain. Here's Romans site: http://home.twcny.rr.com/cnydga/

    My site is here: http://home.stx.rr.com/poneal/

    BTW, the veritas is a nice tower too. I wouldn't go changing out tweets though as it will change the xover.

  4. #4
    Forum Regular PAT.P's Avatar
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    poneal Nice site Im trying to build my first speaker still waiting on the cross-over to be figure out.My tweeter is a Audax and 2 X8" MG Heavy duty woofer frequency 40 -8000hz ,db around 90+.This is a centre channel .Pat.P

  5. #5
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    I definitely wouldn't substitute a tweeter in Wayne J's Veritas. Poneal's suggestion is a good one...Roman knows his stuff for sure, and the Reference line of drivers are very good for the money (though I'm a bit disappointed in the tweeter).

    For a first floorstanding project, for less money, why not look at the Jubilees?
    http://www.partsexpress.com/projects...ilee/index.htm.

  6. #6
    DIY Dude poneal's Avatar
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    Thanks

    Pat for the compliment. Kex, have you actually bought the RS28 or are you going from heresay? I personally think it's a bit expensive for having that drop at 12K+ and its not really very efficient. I was modeling a new 3way using the RS10" and RS6" and the RS28 couldn't keep up with them. I guess I should say it was borderline to keeping up. Think I'll stick with my MDT-20. Inexpensive and does the job although I've heard the Seas 27TDFC is a bit better for the same price.

  7. #7
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poneal
    Pat for the compliment. Kex, have you actually bought the RS28 or are you going from heresay? I personally think it's a bit expensive for having that drop at 12K+ and its not really very efficient. I was modeling a new 3way using the RS10" and RS6" and the RS28 couldn't keep up with them. I guess I should say it was borderline to keeping up. Think I'll stick with my MDT-20. Inexpensive and does the job although I've heard the Seas 27TDFC is a bit better for the same price.

    No I haven't bought it, but I'm not saying this from heresay...I've heard it personally, the proof is in the listening. A few DIY-ers at our little weekly group here recently heard it executed in a design with the RS125S-8...And yeah, it was the Seas 27TBFCG (similar to the 27TDFC if I recall) that was preferred 3-2 in a head to head against the RS-28 (don't know if it was shielded, I can't see that mattering though.) Both speakers had the 5" RS woofer. The two of us that didn't outright prefer it (myself and another )had to admit that the differences refinement weren't all that much...to the point that it might not have existed at all..
    When you factor in for us, the cost of shipping to Canada ($20) vs. buying from Solen and paying $5 for shipping, the Seas tweeters are less than 1/2 the price.

    I truthfully thought the speaker with the RS-28 was a tad bit better than the one with the 27TBFCG (note, I like things a bit bright, that might have been why?). But this is one case where I think it's not a great value. Not that it isn't a great tweeter, just a bit expensive IMO.

    The 5" RS woofer is a helluva performer though.

    It's possible the difference in the two speakers might have been the culprit, but the guy who did both of these has been DIY-ing for years and knows his stuff I believe...

    A few folks on the Madisound board (and John Krutke has a blurb on his website if I recall)) echoed similar sentiments about the RS28 compared to the Seas tweeter.
    Maybe It's not the Dayton is bad, but that the Seas is a real gem?

    For me with Solen just a few hours away, the RS28 is just outmatched in the value department...oh well, can't win em' all.
    .

  8. #8
    DIY Dude poneal's Avatar
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    Thanks for your honesty....

    I just can't justify that added expense at the moment. I have decided to do a three way using the RS150 and MDT20 which I already have and mate it with the RS270 10". The RS270 is more efficient than the 8" and seems to match well with the efficiency of the RS150. This way I will only have to spend 120+ in drivers plus im sure 100+ for the crossover. I'll keep everyone informed. Regards, Paul.

  9. #9
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    The MDT20 is another one I've been sitting back on...pretty much everyone agrees its a great tweeter, but I get a bunch of people telling me to go for the Dayton 1-1/8" Silk tweeter. The Silkie's been compared to the MDT-29 by the PE staff and the Tech Talk regulars,, which is supposedly a small step up over the MDT-20...For $10 cheaper, that's not too bad at all. Since I have access to measurement equipment, any QC variance that seems to occur with different version isn't too big of a deal.

    You won't see me saying this or anything bad about the RS28 on the PE Forums though, I said something negative about the Classic 6-1/2" woofers once and I got nasty e-mails for a month!

    PE has some incredibly loyal customers.

    I don't think I'll be using the RS line anytime soon. I have a higher end Vifa/Scan-speak combo in towers I use for critical listening that are probably a step up on those, and the rest of my projects have been for other people lately. I like making things work with cheap drivers, satisfies the building urge and is easier on my wallet - got a wedding coming up and trip to Egypt that's taking up to much of my speaker building money!
    The Dayton Aluminums are up next for my brother...just finished the Hi-Vi B3N full range HT for my uncle and I'm modeling a 2 way with the B4N and TN28 for a friend at work, might just stick with the Dayton Budget Project though for about the same money.

  10. #10
    DIY Dude poneal's Avatar
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    I've used the B3N

    nice little bugger for the size. Well, you probably know me by now. When it's time for the next project I just can't make up my mind. Thus, I have changed my mind again. Roman sent me some preliminary data on his RS28, RS125, and RS225. Very nice indeed. He was able to notch the RS28 so that it doesn't dip at 12k. He had a friend over and his buddy said they sounded a tad bit better than his B&W 802s. Here's a sample from his email and I quote

    "Now for a quick review of the Daedalus design. These are probably the best sounding speakers I've built so far. I haven't had them side by side with my Alpheus design but I would have to say that these sound better and my friend agrees. Compared to the Alpheus design these aren't as dry but have a more musical sound to them. They are about as neutral and natural as you can get with hardly any peaks in the response that might jump out at you. With the notch filter on the tweeter it sounds great. It has a nice extended top end with a pretty balanced response. It has a smooth and detailed sound and is the best sounding metal dome tweeter that I've heard. It definitely sounds better than the Vifa XT19 in the Alpheus design and is probably just as good as the Hiquphon OW1, my old favorite (although the OW1 has better off axis response). Since the off axis response of the tweeter isn't exceptional, these speakers sound best with a little toe-in because as you move off axis the top end of the tweeter response drops off pretty fast (that's part of the reason that the 1 ohm tweeter resistor sounds so good). The midrange is very detailed and balanced without being too harsh. Like the Alpheus design, they are sensitive to the quality of source material but probably to a lesser degree. The bass response is very very nice and deep. The bass is tight and smooth and probably has an in room f3 in the mid to low 20's. Overall they sound amazing.

    It's kinda funny when my friend was listening to my speakers he was trying to compare them to his B&W Nautilus 802's and most of the comments that he made favored my speakers. For example when one song was playing he noted that the vocals were much stronger with his speakers but with mine they were less prominent but matched the rest of the music much better. He also said that the bass was very similar to his speakers which is a big compliment because he raves about the bottom end of his 802's."

    I too agree about the voicing on the RS series. Best damn voicing I've heard in a speaker. Well, its off to the garage to start the boxes. Cheers, Paul.

  11. #11
    Forum Regular PAT.P's Avatar
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    Kexodusc Where do you buy most of your driver and parts.I know in the state there lot Parts Express,Madison ect.In Canada I found Solen ,Mc Bride,and a smaller Creative Sound.Made a mistake to go to the only speaker shop around my place and paid a premium and still waiting on a crossover .Pat.P

  12. #12
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    Pat.P...You've named most of the places I can think of...a few smaller places that carry the odd brand of drivers but that's it..Speaker City too I guess, MCM electronics for great cheap stuff.

  13. #13
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    Paul,
    The 802, eh? Not bad for a what? $300-400 in parts?

    Finished a little 8" DVC/ 70 watt plate amp for my sister, man that little $20 woofer plays hard!!!
    That's some kind of sub for dirt cheap...used the PE vinyl for the first time with it...saves hours of work, and doesn't look to shabby at all.

  14. #14
    DIY Dude poneal's Avatar
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    Nope more like

    $600+. About $230 for the drivers and the rest crossover, mdf, vinyl, etc. Those large inductors and caps get expensive fast.

    Yup, 8" subs can sound pretty good. I bought a Peerless 8" CC and one of those MCM plate amps for 29.00 that were on special like a year ago. Put it in a smalled sealed box and instant bass. It sounded so good, I thought shoot I'll put it in a vented box. MISTAKE, that sucker bottomed out and I wasn't even playing it hard. That's the good thing about sealed, you can make them small and playem loud.

    Cheers, Paul.

  15. #15
    Forum Regular PAT.P's Avatar
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    Kexodusc Thanks for your reply.Wanted to built my centre channel before the wife and son come back but the place I order the crossover in my city did'nt to the plans and size I need for box.Next time I'll know better.Pat.P

  16. #16
    DIY Dude poneal's Avatar
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    Update on Romans Design....

    He posted preliminary data on his web site here:
    http://home.twcny.rr.com/cnydga/

  17. #17
    Forum Regular Swerd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kexodusc
    The MDT20 is another one I've been sitting back on...pretty much everyone agrees its a great tweeter, but I get a bunch of people telling me to go for the Dayton 1-1/8" Silk tweeter. The Silkie's been compared to the MDT-29 by the PE staff and the Tech Talk regulars,, which is supposedly a small step up over the MDT-20...For $10 cheaper, that's not too bad at all. Since I have access to measurement equipment, any QC variance that seems to occur with different version isn't too big of a deal.
    Are you aware of the QC problems PE has had with the 1 1/8" silk tweeter? Apparently, the manufacturer in China had some trouble with the ferrofluid. I don't know any more details. It has been on back order for since the spring, until they sort this problem out.

  18. #18
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    More than aware of the QC problems (which I believe have been a bit overstated, but worrisome nonetheless), but I'm optimistic they'll be worked out. Not only that, I'm pretty sure Darren and the gang at PE will be testing the bejeezus out of the next batch to ensure QC anyway.
    I think they're do in a the next several weeks. Then again, that MDT-20's been on my list for awhile now for 2 projects. If I buy 4 from Solen with a discount, and factor in the shipping savings it's probably the way to go.

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