aftermarket power chords

I am thinking about purchasing 3 aftermarket power chords. An internet site is offering 3 ft. 12 ga ptf shieldied wire with connectors that everyone seems to think are good. The price is around 100.00 each. Seems like a fair price for the products. I am not interested in replacement power cables from speaker cable companies at several hundred dollars each. Questions are: 1) Am I likely to detect any sonic upgrades from doing this and 2) 12 ga seems like an overkill in wire guage.

system

Gallo Reference III Speakers
Van Alstine Pre (ss)
Van Alstine Power (ss) 220w
Cambridge Audio 640 CD deck.
Magnum Dynalab Tuner
AQ diamondback interconnects
AQ Bedrock speaker cable.

your thoughts...... thanks, dk

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Originally Posted by daviethek

I am thinking about purchasing 3 aftermarket power chords. An internet site is offering 3 ft. 12 ga ptf shieldied wire with connectors that everyone seems to think are good. The price is around 100.00 each.
your thoughts...... thanks, dk

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$300.00. That's 42 Naxos discs at $7 each from Archiv Music ... or 60 at $5 each if you download them as you can, or soon will be able to do.

The choice is easy for me.

If you are not sure about the benefits I would not buy 3 at once. I use the PS Audio power punch with my Cambridge Audio Azur 640 and notice a deffinate improvement. Better dynamics and smoother sound. The cable is $49.95 from several sources such as Audio Advisor. It is very well made and even has a removeable ground plug if you develop a hum problem. I would check them out for a 12 guage power cord.

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Originally Posted by JohnMichael

If you are not sure about the benefits I would not buy 3 at once. I use the PS Audio power punch with my Cambridge Audio Azur 640 and notice a deffinate improvement. Better dynamics and smoother sound. The cable is $49.95 from several sources such as Audio Advisor. It is very well made and even has a removeable ground plug if you develop a hum problem. I would check them out for a 12 guage power cord.

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solid suggestion, thikk I'll try it. thanks. dk

I would make you own power cords, some good quality 12/3 and a good quality edison plug like the Leviton ones, and a good quality IEC plug. To get the same quality of a $100 one you should be spending about $18 to $20

I'm very sceptical about power cords based on my limited experience.

I tried a PS Audio Power Bunch with my Panasonic SA-XR25 "digital" receiver -- made bugger-all difference.

I made my own PCs using Wattgate connectors and Belden cable for use between the wall and my PS Audio Ultimate Outlet and between that an my Bel Canto amp -- again, there was root-of-dick-all difference.

(By the way, the Ultimate Outlet makes not perceptible difference either.)

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Originally Posted by Feanor

I'm very sceptical about power cords based on my limited experience.

I tried a PS Audio Power Bunch with my Panasonic SA-XR25 "digital" receiver -- made bugger-all difference.

I made my own PCs using Wattgate connectors and Belden cable for use between the wall and my PS Audio Ultimate Outlet and between that an my Bel Canto amp -- again, there was root-of-dick-all difference.

(By the way, the Ultimate Outlet makes not perceptible difference either.)

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I'm not familiar with the phrase "Bugger-all" or "root-of-dick" but I too am skeptical of the perceived benefits of power cords. If there is improvement to be found in power cords, then I would also assume wiring inside the walls and power distribution box should also be improved upon before audible improvements are realized.

Since my profession is in information technology, I encounter strict power requirements. Clean, solid, and quiet power is often found behind a UPS. ALthough i've seen some battery powered transformers running some DACs and Phono stages, why are UPSs not used for sensitive audio equipment? There are units available that could easily sustain the high amperage requirements of most amplifiers. And the cost is equivalent to some of these power stations I've observed for sale in audio retail stores.

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Originally Posted by squeegy200

If there is improvement to be found in power cords, then I would also assume wiring inside the walls and power distribution box should also be improved upon before audible improvements are realized.

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The experience of many suggests otherwise. The "miles and miles from the substation" argument assumes the only benefit to be found relates to current. Digital devices throughout modern homes, especially nearby CD players, generate RF and inject that back into the AC line. Tune an AM radio in close proximity to your CDP. Better power cords use multiple shielding strategies and sometimes include filter networks.

The audible difference to these ears in three systems is a quieter, "darker" background where more low level details can be discerned.

rw

just a thought, if your power cord it shielded thats all nice but if the RF was leaked back into the main lines then its in the power and no shield will stop the RF. Just think all through your walls is a bunch of wire acting like an antenna sucking up any RF flying around. And all romex is is some solid core 12 or 14 gauge wire, so if that is the source of your power it is also the source of the RF interference. Consider a power conditioner and filter before new power cords. Just a power cord isnt going to help anything unless you stop the problem at the source which would involve changing the wiring in your house, or running dedicated circuits to your system with shielded cable and a power filter right at the circuit breaker, or just do the simple move and make some heavy duty power cords of your own and get a good power conditoner. And another thing make them as short as possible, I am yet to see a home amplifer which needs more than some 14/3 for power as long as you make it like about 18 inches, hell if you could make it 1 inch you could use 20/3.

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Originally Posted by pelly3s

just a thought, if your power cord it shielded thats all nice but if the RF was leaked back into the main lines then its in the power and no shield will stop the RF.

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Reread my comments.

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Originally Posted by pelly3s

Consider a power conditioner and filter before new power cords.

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Already have two conditiioners, a Monster HTS-1000 and an HTS-3500. They're not the same with my amps.

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Originally Posted by pelly3s

Just a power cord isnt going to help anything unless you stop the problem at the source which would involve changing the wiring in your house...

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Actually, it does. You'll find your theory lacking. Yes, I already have a clean line for the system.

rw

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Originally Posted by squeegy200

I'm not familiar with the phrase "Bugger-all" or "root-of-dick" but ...

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Sorry about that fancy language, Squeegy :)

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Originally Posted by Feanor

Sorry about that fancy language, Squeegy :)

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Just teasing you ;)

Question for any of you engineering types:
Any reason why there is not more applications of a UPS as a buffer/filter for incoming power? The power behind many UPS units are pure clean smooth sin wave and I'm curious as to why I don't see them more often in audiophile applications.

Try out the UPS before you buy one. My experience with an APC unit is that it primarily controls the AC voltage but doesn't clean up the ambient electrical disturbances that you might be experiencing.

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Originally Posted by Feanor

I'm very sceptical about power cords based on my limited experience.

I tried a PS Audio Power Bunch with my Panasonic SA-XR25 "digital" receiver -- made bugger-all difference.

I made my own PCs using Wattgate connectors and Belden cable for use between the wall and my PS Audio Ultimate Outlet and between that an my Bel Canto amp -- again, there was root-of-dick-all difference.

(By the way, the Ultimate Outlet makes not perceptible difference either.)

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I'm also a sceptic, no, a total non believer in aftermarket power chords, filters et all for the following reasons:-

1, We have been sold (so called) quality pieces of equipment. Surely that equipment has been provided at the factory with a decent power supply capable of producing adequate voltage and power to run the equipment properly.

2, Surely the manufactuer has at least a legal obligation to supply a power chord of adequate size.

3, If an exotic power chord was going to make any difference, the equipment manufacturer would have supply it as standard. After all, they would get better reviews if it did make any improvement and it would only cost them coppers.

4, What do people think is on the other side of the socket they are pluggung their exotic aftermarket power chord into. Cheap sh1t (another specialized technical term) domestic mains cable.

5, Even if the odd fanatic wires his / her power outlets in exotic grade cable back to their distribution board, there is still literally miles standard grade cable feeding heir house from the power station.

I'm too old to get caught on that one

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Originally Posted by Chas Underhay

I'm also a sceptic, no, a total non believer in aftermarket power chords, filters et all for the following reasons:-

1, We have been sold (so called) quality pieces of equipment. Surely that equipment has been provided at the factory with a decent power supply capable of producing adequate voltage and power to run the equipment properly.

2, Surely the manufactuer has at least a legal obligation to supply a power chord of adequate size.

3, If an exotic power chord was going to make any difference, the equipment manufacturer would have supply it as standard. After all, they would get better reviews if it did make any improvement and it would only cost them coppers.

4, What do people think is on the other side of the socket they are pluggung their exotic aftermarket power chord into. Cheap sh1t (another specialized technical term) domestic mains cable.

5, Even if the odd fanatic wires his / her power outlets in exotic grade cable back to their distribution board, there is still literally miles standard grade cable feeding heir house from the power station.

I'm too old to get caught on that one

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Thank you

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Originally Posted by pelly3s

Thank you

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I'm not an electronics engineer so please feel free to correct me if I am wrong but....

It is my understanding that a quality power supply in any peice of equipment would be capable of providing a clean DC supply whatever the state (within reason) of the mains. That power supply would also be capable of storing sufficient power to deal with the worst case momentary current drain of the equipment.

It is also my understanding that fuses would start blowing long before the current draw by the equipment got anywhere near the current handling capacity of even the most basic mains cable.

I am however a mechanical engineer and as such can smell bull sh1t a mile off.

If a dealer was in the process of trying to sell me a piece of quality equipment then told me that I also needed a different mains lead or a filter, I would immediately leave the shop.

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Originally Posted by Chas Underhay

I'm not an electronics engineer so please feel free to correct me if I am wrong but....

It is my understanding that a quality power supply in any peice of equipment would be capable of providing a clean DC supply whatever the state (within reason) of the mains. That power supply would also be capable of storing sufficient power to deal with the worst case momentary current drain of the equipment.

It is also my understanding that fuses would start blowing long before the current draw by the equipment got anywhere near the current handling capacity of even the most basic mains cable.

I am however a mechanical engineer and as such can smell bull sh1t a mile off.

If a dealer was in the process of trying to sell me a piece of quality equipment then told me that I also needed a different mains lead or a filter, I would immediately leave the shop.

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I agree with everything you said.

Regardless of the "root of dick" results, or whatever else was reported, my original question was not about the efficacy of the tweak but rather if purchasing three after market chords was warranted. John Michael posted a good reply and I appreciate his input. I took his advice since I own similar equipment and noticed some positive results with one relatively cheap aftermarket power chord on my CD player.

I too am an engineer but I don't criticize people who drive Jaguars over Saturns even though both accomplish the same thing.

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Originally Posted by daviethek

Regardless of the "root of dick" results, or whatever else was reported, my original question was not about the efficacy of the tweak but rather if purchasing three after market chords was warranted. John Michael posted a good reply and I appreciate his input. I took his advice since I own similar equipment and noticed some positive results with one relatively cheap aftermarket power chord on my CD player.

I too am an engineer but I don't criticize people who drive Jaguars over Saturns even though both accomplish the same thing.

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Sir you asked a QUESTION; if purchasing three after market chords was warranted.

John Micheal said; NO , try one at a time and suggested a cheaper one.

Pelly3s said; NO, but suggested making your own.

Feanor said; NO, he had tried it and noticed no difference and suggested you spent the money on music instead.

I said; NO and gave some reasons why.

I call the above providing ANSWERS to your QUESTION and being helpful but it seems from your last post that you didn't want ANSWERS, you just wanted someone to agree with you.

I stand corrected. In this hobby, when it comes to spending money, I'm always looking for someone to agree with me I suppose.

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Originally Posted by daviethek

I stand corrected. In this hobby, when it comes to spending money, I'm always looking for someone to agree with me I suppose.

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We are not trying to stop you spending money mate but trying to dissuade you from wasting money.

I've said on this site before that I believe a lot of aspects of hi-fi equipent and particularly cables of all descriptions are much like The Emporer's New Clothes, "only a wise man can hear the difference, to a fool it's inaudible.

If you really do think the mains lead supplied with the kit is crap then try making up a new one with decent but not exotic components as Pelly3s suggested. I agree that not all plugs and not all cable is equal but higher grade components would be more likely to provide robustness and longevity than noticeable audible improvements.

Look in a recording or broadcasting studio and see what cables they use.

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Originally Posted by Chas Underhay

Sir you asked a QUESTION; if purchasing three after market chords was warranted.

John Micheal said; NO , try one at a time and suggested a cheaper one.

Pelly3s said; NO, but suggested making your own.

Feanor said; NO, he had tried it and noticed no difference and suggested you spent the money on music instead.

I said; NO and gave some reasons why.

I call the above providing ANSWERS to your QUESTION and being helpful but it seems from your last post that you didn't want ANSWERS, you just wanted someone to agree with you.

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Just to clarify I stated I noticed an improvement with the addition of the better power chord. I also know that I also can hear differences in speaker cables and interconnects. My point was for him to try one at a time to see if it would be a benefit to him. We can be sensitive to different aspects of sound. What is musical to some might be torture for me. I know people who like bright agressive systems and after about 20 minutes I have to excuse myself. If a better cable improves the sound of your system then enjoy.

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Originally Posted by JohnMichael

Just to clarify I stated I noticed an improvement with the addition of the better power chord. I also know that I also can hear differences in speaker cables and interconnects. My point was for him to try one at a time to see if it would be a benefit to him. We can be sensitive to different aspects of sound. What is musical to some might be torture for me. I know people who like bright agressive systems and after about 20 minutes I have to excuse myself. If a better cable improves the sound of your system then enjoy.

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I did acknowledge that you suggested that he tried one at a time.

To be honest I have never heard any significant differences when comparing speaker cables or interconnects unless I'm comparing the adequate with the inadequate, maybe I just have cloth ears. From a technical point of view I accept that cable has different characteristics; inductance, impedance, capacitance etc however the legnths involved are normally too short to have much impact. You infer that you do not like bright agressive systems and allude that a better cable may improve it but I would suggest that it may well be a worse (high capacitance) cable that 'apparently' improves the sound by slightly attenuating the HF.

In my experience, equipment that sounds 'musical' isn't necessarilly accurate. I find that it is either particular records or very often certian tracks on records that sound bright and agressive, a similar number, to me, sound too wooly or bass heavy. Most however sound fine to my ears. I don't like bright and agressive and I don't like fat and wooly either.

The thing that makes me laugh is that I have seen adverts for £4,000 speaker cables, give me 4 grand and I'll by a pair of electrostatics and hook em up with 4mm mains wire I'll guarantee they will sound fine.

All the best

I guess I'm in the camp that notices diffferences. Only recently though. For about 20 years I didn't think wire of any kind had that much effect until recently with my new system I had the "chore" of selecting speaker cable and interconnects I could live with.
I say chore because the experience got to be less than enjoyable after a while. Most economy speaker cables just got in the way of some aspect of the music or bloated one end of the spectrum a noticeable bit. When I found a pair that didn't interfere with the music, I stopped looking. I was at the 180.00 price point for the speaker wire when that happened. thank God.

As far as the power cables go, I guess I was tempted like a lot of people are, by the potential of some noticeable benefit. The sugestion to use the economy power cable upgrade on the CA CD deck was to me a good suggestion since I noticed differences in speaker cable, I thought what the hell. It was I think a good purchase. I'm certainly not going to exagerate the benefit, but I am left with the feeling that if the manufacturers should spend a few pennies more on the power chord.

My theory on power cord is pretty much this, you dont see recording studio changing the cords on the gear they have. and like I always say no matter what you play something through it cant get better than what it was recorded on