Bookshelf recommendation up to $3k max

[LVMF]

I'm looking for recommendations for bookshelf speakers up to a max of $3k...that's the budget, but as we all know more expensive doesn't always mean better with speakers. Unfortuneately I don't have room for floorstanders or a sub-woofer, and don't really need the shake the house bass, but by the same token don't not want something close.

Power is coming from a Musical Fidelity X-150...and they will be used 95% of the time for music, all genres.

I've spent the past 3 months demo'ing Monitor Audio S2's and Gold 10's...they were too sterile for me, at least with the MF amp. I also spent a couple of weeks with the B & W 805's, and they didn't sound as good at home as in the store.

I prefer a warm sound (who doesn't for the most part) and have determined to get this right, no reason to hurry.

So what would you recommend as options...and thanks for the help!!

[newbsterv2]

.......but I'm going to go ahead and say it. I listened to the B&W Nautilius 805S bookshelf speaker last weekend as was loving every minute of it. This bookshelf costs $2,250/pair without stands and the matching stands are $600/pair. Another great speaker is the Joseph Audio RM7Si at $1,800/pair but I don't think it sounds as good as the N805S. I've listened to the entire 700 line of B&W and wouldn't take those speakers if they were given to me. Too midrangey, lightweight, and just all around not fun to listen to. After lookiing at B&W's website I found that any 800 series model speaker with the S(super? special?) or D(diamond) suffix itilizes only one component in the tweeters path. A capacitor. Yep a simple first order on the tweeter maybe that's why it was so enjoyable. No cheapo resistor or anything else just a big old expensive cap they supposedly spend hundreds of hours auditioning by ear. Keep in mind the bass was only solid to about 50Hz but never did I feel like the speaker needed a sub nor did I find it hooty or sloppy or artificial. And these speakers are furniture. Once you see that beautiful veneer and that nautilus tube on top you know you have some quality engineering as well as good looks. I can't honestly recommend anything else because most of the other stuff I've ever listened to wasn't worth what it cost. I own a pair of $150/pair DIY BR-1 speakers from partsexpress.com and until I have the funds and a beautiful home to put the N805S's in I'm going to keep my little great sounding cheapo speakers. Good luck in your quest for beautiful sound!

[newbsterv2]

Did you listen to the 805S or just 805?? I compared them and liked the 805S better.




I'm looking for recommendations for bookshelf speakers up to a max of $3k...that's the budget, but as we all know more expensive doesn't always mean better with speakers. Unfortuneately I don't have room for floorstanders or a sub-woofer, and don't really need the shake the house bass, but by the same token don't not want something close.

Power is coming from a Musical Fidelity X-150...and they will be used 95% of the time for music, all genres.

I've spent the past 3 months demo'ing Monitor Audio S2's and Gold 10's...they were too sterile for me, at least with the MF amp. I also spent a couple of weeks with the B & W 805's, and they didn't sound as good at home as in the store.

I prefer a warm sound (who doesn't for the most part) and have determined to get this right, no reason to hurry.

So what would you recommend as options...and thanks for the help!!

[RGA]

The problem is many with speakers because not veryone likes the same sound or looks. There are many influences that affect our buying habits that go beyond just that which we are listening to. I'm not surprised by your comments on the Monitor Audio or the B&Ws becuase I believe a lot of speakers are pklaying around with the microdynamic events int he treble region which is why "Detail" often becomes fatigue - there is no counter term Detail when we listen live. This is not revealing poorness in the recording but additive grain induced by the speaker at least much or most of the time in my experience. It's an effective way for a speaker to stand out from speakers not adding that grain or zing.

Everyone can recommend speakers for audition in your price range and you could have a list of 250 bookshelf speakers with a supporter - if you're going to at all trust a forumer or a friend etc for advice you need to find people who hear speakers and music in a similar way that you hear it - that may get you as far as auditioning a few things they suggest and that is as far as you should rely on anyone here.

You can easily do searches of this and other forums such as audioasylum.com and find people who you think value wwhat you value in the reproduction of music. There is correlational chance that you are more likely to like what they like than some unknowns on an internet forum.

The B&W N805 is raved about - I have heard it for years and overall I find it to be a good loudspeaker and certainly worth an audition - but I know I could not live with what it has on tap. Ditto I'm sorry to say the Monitor Audios. Don't expect most stuff to be great for you. I can easily say a lot of stuff sounds good and some I'd recommend but the vast majority I would not actually buy for myself and that includes a lot of it I would recommend highly to people.

What I would recommend is not accessible to most people - so if I'm forced to recommend between 8 brands that I don't like I recommend the one I dislike the least.

At the end of the day I can suggest that you listen to a wide range of designs with Electrostatic and Planars, speakers using metal tweeters silk domes, ribbons, line arrays, Dipoles, and systems that like Single Ended Triode tube amps(SET) and other low powered tubes with appropriately sensitive speakers using Horns and non horn designs - and I'd try if possible to listen to single driver speakers.

they each have a different take on the music - I found the one I like after many years - and the magazines and forums didn't help(Though I found the forums highly useful for various other things and information etc) - the ears in the end are what did it for me and a dealer that asked me to audition the no-name speaker - dealers you need to be skeptical of but at the same time some of them are pretty straight up and helpful.(Finding such ones is very helpful).

[travk13]

hard to find in states .. but when and if you do they are amazing .. i own their saturn series ...all i can afford .. but they do utilize thier dual concertric technology.. they have new series out now and i know they have a set of bookshelves at 1400 us and 2500 .. i'd have to look into series name etc but for a all around music lover speaker i have trouble finding any music to sound any less than perfect on tannoy ..

[Buzz Roll]

One of the best monitors that I've ever heard is the Reference 3a deCapo. I also liked the RedRose Rosebud II, but I think it's over 3K. I haven't heard them, but I imagine the Green Mountain Audio Europa Max is worth trying too.

[drseid]

While there are any number of superb mini-monitors in your price range, the one I like the best (and it is indeed slightly on the warm side of neutral, while still going down to a very respectable 35 Hz) is the Tyler Acoustics Linbrook Signature...

You can only buy these Internet direct, but Tyler has a money back guarantee that only puts your shipping costs at risk (about $50/pr. each way as each speaker weighs 55 pounds). They also have a group of owners that have volunteered to let people hear their speakers in their home (the link is on the Tyler web page). Even though I am not on the list,if you live in the DC area, I am always willing to show off mine (although I have the matching bass modules as well).

Price is at the top of your range $3250/pr., but Ty is sure to reduce that price about 10% over the phone if asked... The web page is www.tyleracoustics.com for reference.

Oh yeah, I should mention that I have no affiliation with Tyler Acoustics except as a product owner.

---Dave

[LVMF]

I was listening to the 805S, and compared to the Monitor 10's, it wasn't nearly as detailed. With the 10's, when an upright bass was playing, you knew it was an acoustic instrument, not so with the 805's. If the 10's just didn't grate on the ears, or sound sterile as I describe them, they's be the one's at significantly less than $3k.

Snell has just come out with a newly designed bookshelf, is anyone familiar with them?

[kexodusc]

My vote goes to the Focus Audio FS-688, a simply incredibly little performer in your price range. Could be difficult to find, but I cannot think of another commercial offering under 3K that I've been as impressed with. Beautiful finish too...

You've really got a ton of options...IMO the shopping part is as fun as the listening, get out there and start samplin' the wares.

[LVMF]

I absolutely agree, discovering and listening to all the options is great...but I'm inclined to think Amex takes a dim view of all the credits!

[Pat D]

I'm looking for recommendations for bookshelf speakers up to a max of $3k...that's the budget, but as we all know more expensive doesn't always mean better with speakers. Unfortuneately I don't have room for floorstanders or a sub-woofer, and don't really need the shake the house bass, but by the same token don't not want something close.

Power is coming from a Musical Fidelity X-150...and they will be used 95% of the time for music, all genres.

I've spent the past 3 months demo'ing Monitor Audio S2's and Gold 10's...they were too sterile for me, at least with the MF amp. I also spent a couple of weeks with the B & W 805's, and they didn't sound as good at home as in the store.

I prefer a warm sound (who doesn't for the most part) and have determined to get this right, no reason to hurry.

So what would you recommend as options...and thanks for the help!!
How large is your room? Where do you intend to place the speakers? Especially in relation to room boundaries and furniture?

There are quite a few good monitor speakers in the $1000 plus category but most of them need to be some way from the room boundaries, including my own PSB Stratus Minis. If space is of that much a premium, then you might look into the Allison Four, which is now back in production. Not that it is all that small, but It is meant to be placed right next to the rear wall, including on a bookshelf, if there is enough space above it. I heard them many years ago and thought they sounded very good indeed, and the present versions of the Allison designs are supposed to be improved.

http://www.allisonacoustics.com/

http://www.allisonacoustics.com/four.html

Otherwise, I could suggest trying lots of speakers, including my own PSB Stratus Minis, the B & W 705, the Paradigm Signature S2, the Joseph Audio RM7Si (I didn't personally like it but I didn't try them at home), and some I have not heard, such as the PSB Platinum M2. I would like to hear speakers from Dynaudio, Kef, Totem, Ethera, Energy, Mirage, Quad, and other brands which don't come to mind right now.

[46minaudio]

I'm looking for recommendations for bookshelf speakers up to a max of $3k...that's the budget, but as we all know more expensive doesn't always mean better with speakers. Unfortuneately I don't have room for floorstanders or a sub-woofer, and don't really need the shake the house bass, but by the same token don't not want something close.

Power is coming from a Musical Fidelity X-150...and they will be used 95% of the time for music, all genres.

I've spent the past 3 months demo'ing Monitor Audio S2's and Gold 10's...they were too sterile for me, at least with the MF amp. I also spent a couple of weeks with the B & W 805's, and they didn't sound as good at home as in the store.

I prefer a warm sound (who doesn't for the most part) and have determined to get this right, no reason to hurry.

So what would you recommend as options...and thanks for the help!!
LVMF,before you give these up try playing with the room..The room has a large effect on how a speaker will sound..Things as carpet,drapes,and a nice big soft sofa will help.Do a search on room correction and see if it helps...

[newbsterv2]

Hey RGA. If you have a dealer near you who carries the N805S model give it a listen. It sounds quite different from the regular N805.



The problem is many with speakers because not veryone likes the same sound or looks. There are many influences that affect our buying habits that go beyond just that which we are listening to. I'm not surprised by your comments on the Monitor Audio or the B&Ws becuase I believe a lot of speakers are pklaying around with the microdynamic events int he treble region which is why "Detail" often becomes fatigue - there is no counter term Detail when we listen live. This is not revealing poorness in the recording but additive grain induced by the speaker at least much or most of the time in my experience. It's an effective way for a speaker to stand out from speakers not adding that grain or zing.

Everyone can recommend speakers for audition in your price range and you could have a list of 250 bookshelf speakers with a supporter - if you're going to at all trust a forumer or a friend etc for advice you need to find people who hear speakers and music in a similar way that you hear it - that may get you as far as auditioning a few things they suggest and that is as far as you should rely on anyone here.

You can easily do searches of this and other forums such as audioasylum.com and find people who you think value wwhat you value in the reproduction of music. There is correlational chance that you are more likely to like what they like than some unknowns on an internet forum.

The B&W N805 is raved about - I have heard it for years and overall I find it to be a good loudspeaker and certainly worth an audition - but I know I could not live with what it has on tap. Ditto I'm sorry to say the Monitor Audios. Don't expect most stuff to be great for you. I can easily say a lot of stuff sounds good and some I'd recommend but the vast majority I would not actually buy for myself and that includes a lot of it I would recommend highly to people.

What I would recommend is not accessible to most people - so if I'm forced to recommend between 8 brands that I don't like I recommend the one I dislike the least.

At the end of the day I can suggest that you listen to a wide range of designs with Electrostatic and Planars, speakers using metal tweeters silk domes, ribbons, line arrays, Dipoles, and systems that like Single Ended Triode tube amps(SET) and other low powered tubes with appropriately sensitive speakers using Horns and non horn designs - and I'd try if possible to listen to single driver speakers.

they each have a different take on the music - I found the one I like after many years - and the magazines and forums didn't help(Though I found the forums highly useful for various other things and information etc) - the ears in the end are what did it for me and a dealer that asked me to audition the no-name speaker - dealers you need to be skeptical of but at the same time some of them are pretty straight up and helpful.(Finding such ones is very helpful).

[RGA]

I have heard the Signature 805. I agree it's generally better I wouldwant to spend a few hours more with it before I attempt a review. I would however go with the Audio Note K/spe.

Interestingly I heard an old set of Acoustic Research standmounts in a used cd shop and it struck me how reminiscent it was with acoustic guitar that the AN K is - even looked a bit the same.

For the money I feel the B&W's have roblems in that something like the K at $2300.00US is IMO tough to beat when properly driven.

It is a bias of course that it fits with the sound I like.

When I go to Soundhounds to buy my new amp in February I will do another round of shootouts and perhaps they will have the sig series in for a direct comparo.

[newbsterv2]

The N805S is not the same as the Signature 805 RGA. The N805S is a new design and the newest of all B&W speakers. The Signatures are known by their super attractive marblelike finishes. These speakers I'm speaking of are regular wood veneer.



I have heard the Signature 805. I agree it's generally better I wouldwant to spend a few hours more with it before I attempt a review. I would however go with the Audio Note K/spe.

Interestingly I heard an old set of Acoustic Research standmounts in a used cd shop and it struck me how reminiscent it was with acoustic guitar that the AN K is - even looked a bit the same.

For the money I feel the B&W's have roblems in that something like the K at $2300.00US is IMO tough to beat when properly driven.

It is a bias of course that it fits with the sound I like.

When I go to Soundhounds to buy my new amp in February I will do another round of shootouts and perhaps they will have the sig series in for a direct comparo.

[MusicLG]

RGA, I've read your many comments over the past several weeks and I'm curious...if you have $2,000-$3,000 to spend on speakers, what would you buy? In fact, tell me your top 3 picks. Can't get more simple than that...
MusicLG

[RGA]

That's a tough quesion to ask - but if it were my $2000.00 to $3000.00 I would consider whether I was willing to build the speaker myself.

My first pick is obviously what I did pick which is the Audio Note J/Spe which lists at $3500.00US but it can be had a bit less and IMO close enough to the $3k to make it worth it. My second pick if I were willing to build the speaker would be the Audio Note E ($1700) kit. Third would be the Audio Note K/Spe.

Taking the kit option away from me my third pick would probably be the Reference 3a MM De Capo (though I think I'd like to hear the original again because I think I might prefer it to the new one).

The Dynaudio Audience 82 would be a consideration as would PMC offerrings the TB2 is very good in the lower price range and the bigger models are quite excellent. The B&W N805 is still there for me too. I think I would stick with my first three until I come across something that persuades me otherwise. I have listened to speakers from JM Labs(some are very very good), Jamo, Proac, Sonus Faber, Hales, PSB, Paradigm, Klipsch,Wilson, Legacy, Vandersteen, Apogee, Mordaunt Short, Monitor Audio, Energy Veritas, MB Quart, Acoustec Labs, Acoustic Research, Wharfedale, Quad, Magnepan, Cabasse, Martin Logan, Bang and Oluffson, Bose, JBL, Athena Acoustics, Linn, Pioneer Elite, Kef, Gershman Acoustics, Avante Guarde, Cerwin Vega, Infinity, Advent, Dynaudio, Hales, Castle, Boston Acoustics, Snell, Mirage, Totem, Tannoy, M&K, Mission, Epos,Acoustic Energy,Polk, and Thiel

This was off the top of my head so I likely missed a pile - obviously I have not heard every speaker from all of them and many with varying degrees of time spent on them.

[LVMF]

Room size runs 12 X 20 X 8, with setup on the narrow width due to room limitations, ie, patio door in the middle of long run. I've toed in, out, on axis, and the 10's pretty much remain the same. I may have to figure out a way to fit in a small sub in the end, but am trying to avoid if possible, as that pairing can be just as tricky.

[LVMF]

I'm trying out the Joseph Audio this weekend, and ordered the MM deCapo i for a listen as well.

[RGA]

Look for an AN E kit ---- you won't need a subwoofer. They don;t look too hard to build or get someone to build them for you - You'll be under $2k - I've heard nothing under 2k in my life that comes anything close to an AN E.

It's full range can be put in corners - prefer corners hit 17hz and 94db sensitive. They have horn like dynamics and electrostatic speed in the midband. The De capo needs lots of space very good but no where near the bass of the J or E.

This fellow named Nico at AudioAsylum just received his E Kit(a more expensive one than I'm recommending but the cabinet and drivrs are the same.

Check it out. Ideally you want to hear a production E someplace first...then you save a ton by having someone build one - the guy who built his did an absolutely stunning job.

I'm not saying to buy them or not to buy the De Capo - I like the De Capo a lot - but given the money here I'd really look into the E or J. Ask one of the dealers if nothing else to send you a set for a home audition. I think the K is better than the De Capo as well but at least the two are in the same ballpark. http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/audionotekits/bbs.html

[LVMF]

Found a demo pair of de Capo's at significant discount, I was very surpized. If I remembered correctly I'd be driving 200 miles to listen to the AN's...it's on the way when I go the the derby this spring in Louisville, if I haven't pulled the trigger by then, I'll definitely give them an ear.

[RGA]

It'll be the best 200 miles you will ever drive IMO. The DeCapo is no slouch - it has a deeper soundstage than the K and a generlally Lusher sound than the K - What made me buy the K in the end was that the De Capo presented that depth a bit too much - ie; on recordings where it wasn't there.

Good luck - at least you're listening and not buying out of the rags.

[theaudiohobby]

I'm trying out the Joseph Audio this weekend, and ordered the MM deCapo i for a listen as well.

Could you post your impressions about the Joseph Audio, I have heard good things about this line but have never come across it.

[LVMF]

Will do...but I'll have to do it without the $600 speaker cables as presented in the store.

[LVMF]

Spent last weekend with the Joseph Audio RM7Si's, and they deliver a very fine reproduction...a wide soundstage that is enjoyably realistic...a midrange that I would describe as smooth...female vocals are silky smooth and clear...percussion can be a bit harsh, but not overly so...their only shortcoming is the low end; they just can't seem to get there as compared to other speakers in this price range...overall, they have beat the other speakers I've heard to date overall.

[theaudiohobby]

Spent last weekend with the Joseph Audio RM7Si's, and they deliver a very fine reproduction...a wide soundstage that is enjoyably realistic...a midrange that I would describe as smooth...female vocals are silky smooth and clear...percussion can be a bit harsh, but not overly so...their only shortcoming is the low end; they just can't seem to get there as compared to other speakers in this price range...overall, they have beat the other speakers I've heard to date overall.

thanks for posting your impressions. :)

[LVMF]

I hooked up my old KEF Reference 102's with a sub and without their equilizer and they sound better than anything I've listened to yet...and I haven't had these out of their box in 10 years! Still waiting onthe de Capo's.

[m1go1blue]

http://www.avihifi.co.uk/NuNeutron%20Monitors%20/Neutron%20IV.html

I just heard these this past weekend, and I was absolutely floored. They may be hard to listen to for you unless you live in the southeastern MI area though.

Has anyone else heard these speakers yet? My local HiFi dealer just started to carry the AVI brand. I believe these speakers are in the $1,000 range.



I'm looking for recommendations for bookshelf speakers up to a max of $3k...that's the budget, but as we all know more expensive doesn't always mean better with speakers. Unfortuneately I don't have room for floorstanders or a sub-woofer, and don't really need the shake the house bass, but by the same token don't not want something close.

Power is coming from a Musical Fidelity X-150...and they will be used 95% of the time for music, all genres.

I've spent the past 3 months demo'ing Monitor Audio S2's and Gold 10's...they were too sterile for me, at least with the MF amp. I also spent a couple of weeks with the B & W 805's, and they didn't sound as good at home as in the store.

I prefer a warm sound (who doesn't for the most part) and have determined to get this right, no reason to hurry.

So what would you recommend as options...and thanks for the help!!

[LVMF]

100 hours into break-in of de Capo i's...so far they are hands down winners, without reaching the $3K threshold...more to come

[RGA]

Very nice speakers indeed - the Reference 3a.

[Shwamdoo]

I'm in the same boat as you man. Except that I don't have quite as much cash. I have been auditioning all kinds of bookshelfs in the $1,000.00 range and today I think I found what I was looking for. I heard the Quad 11L and 12L and I was blown away. These are both extremly musical speakers, they seemed to reproduce each sound in the music just as it had been recorded, without added characteristics. The 12L was most impresive to me because, in addition to its lower frequency extension, it had a more open and less congested sound. And, just to top it off, these speakers are gorgeous. They come in several different wood grains, all with high gloss finishes. The cabinets are well constructed and are of resonable size. I was impresed and I think you will be too. I highly recomend you take a listen.

Also, I have been impressed with the ProAc Response 1SC. It was a bit out of my price range, but it seems to fall into yours, so you might want to take a look.

Goodluck.

[LVMF]

The 'musical' aspect seems to be lost on most speaker manufacturers, but it's obviously in the 'ears of the listener' as well. Most of the speakers I demo'd had vocals way out in front of the rest of the sound, and for the life of me I can't figure out why.

I had listened to a pair of used Quads, but they were almost out of my budget; the room didn't help the sound and they wouldn't let me have them for a weekend, so....they lost.

I didn't listen to the Reference 3A's smaller moniter, the Dulcet, but it's in your price range. Audiogon has a used pair of the 'original' de Capo's at a great price as well.
Internationl Audio/Video Review speaks of them here...
http://www.iar-80.com/page65.html

Most of the speakers just didn't sound like I was listening to the original recording or instruments...but hey, that's why there's oranges and apples! Good luck.

[LVMF]

Well, the Reference 3A De Capo's it is...review to follow.
Thanks for all your suggestions, not a bad one in the bunch!

[LVMF]

What a long strage trip its been...The de Capo's are boxed up and ready to ship.

The wife didn't like them and made me go buy some floorstanders, ended up with Jamo D450's. Sold the MF-150 and X-ray, ended up LOVING tubes. Now that system is being powered by an Eastern Electric M 520, with too much $$$ in tube upgrades.

A basement system started up with the last youngin' living in the big city, waiting on a 2A3 to be built. Power by either a Sonic Fronteirs SFS-40 or AES Super 25, Melos Sha-Gold preamp, and First Horn speakers by Atelier Audio in Canada. The de Capo's weren't quite efficient enough for the DIY 2A3 I tried, and probably should have kept them as one day I'll want them back and I'd bet the amp was the problem. The First Horns are a nice full range single-driver speaker, love the single-driver sound.
Thanks to everyone who made recommendations....

L'wood