Poll: Which AV Receiver is more value for the $$$ ? [Archive] - Audio & Video Forums

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thereal_1_
11-26-2004, 11:10 AM
Hello,

Which of the following AV receiver would offer me the best value for the bucks? I have a buget of $1000 Canadian ($800US) with these Paradigm speakers: Titants front, Cinema 90 rear, CC-170 ctr, and PDR-10 sub. I'm thinking of upgrading my 5-yr old Pioneer VSX-DS509S and my time spent on movies/music ratio is 70/30.

- Marantz SR6400 ($700 Cdn) (don't have the price for SR6500)
- Denon AVR 2105 ($900 Cdn)
- Yamaha RXC1500 ($1080 Cdn)
- Pioneer Elite VX52TX ($1900 Cdn)
If there are any other good receivers I should consider, please let me know.

Thank-you all in advance
Brad

Worf101
11-26-2004, 11:39 AM
Sorry, just had to ask...

Da Worfster

kexodusc
11-26-2004, 11:41 AM
None of the above:
IMO the single best value in A/V receivers today is the RX-V650, 750 or HTR-5760 by Yamaha, with a few models by Denon being very close runners-up. These 650/5760 are identical functionally, a few cosmetic differences, the 750 has a few more features you might use...the price is much more reasonable than the RX-V1500.
You can snag one of these receivers for about $350 US, or $420 Cdn, plus shipping/taxes etc...and save yourself $400 easily. From there, I would use the money saved to upgrade your speakers, as this would result in a far, larger, and more significant improvement to your listening experience than choice of listed receivers (not that there's anything wrong with what you have, just that speakers hold more importance).

Geoffcin
11-27-2004, 04:55 AM
Hello,

Which of the following AV receiver would offer me the best value for the bucks? I have a buget of $1000 Canadian ($800US) with these Paradigm speakers: Titants front, Cinema 90 rear, CC-170 ctr, and PDR-10 sub. I'm thinking of upgrading my 5-yr old Pioneer VSX-DS509S and my time spent on movies/music ratio is 70/30.

- Marantz SR6400 ($700 Cdn) (don't have the price for SR6500)
- Denon AVR 2105 ($900 Cdn)
- Yamaha RXC1500 ($1080 Cdn)
- Pioneer Elite VX52TX ($1900 Cdn)
If there are any other good receivers I should consider, please let me know.

Thank-you all in advance
Brad

As it streets for about $600US new.

http://www.soundpros.com/pioneer_elite_home.cfm

As has been shown in lab tests, the Yammy simply doesn't have near the power of the Pioneer. Independant tests show that in 5.1 mode the Pioneer has DOUBLE the output of the Yamaha. While this doesn't translate to double as loud, I've found that with HT dynamic headroom is everthing. I use discreet amplification in my HT setup just because of it.

kexodusc
11-27-2004, 05:54 AM
Geofficin, do you have a source for those lab tests I could see? I did a side by side audition on Wednesday, and I found that the Yamaha is just a tad bit tougher in the power deliver section. I'm not talking driving sine waves, but real source playback. The difference so small though it's not even worth mentioning. Air Force One was the test DVD. And some Josh Groban CD.
I think they sound about as good as each other.

And for all intents and purposes, that insignificant bit of headroom between the two will create next to zero sound advantage. Now you might like he "tonal qualities" of one of these receivers over the other...I didn't hear anything from either that got me exited. Maybe you're confusing models?

And $1900 CDN is way too much...that receiver might be worth half of that. At $800 or so, it's probably on par with the others in the value department, I didn't ask price of either because I wasn't shopping, just seeing what the difference was between my receiver and the 1500...not much.

thereal_1_
11-27-2004, 11:00 AM
Thanks Kexodusc and others for your input. There was a price typo for the Pioneer Elite VSX-52TX, which should have been $1,090 Cdn. For my Paradigm setup, most people are recommending the Yamaha RX-V750 ($750Cdn) as best bang for the bucks. I might be tempted to spend a few more bucks for an upgrade to Yamaha RX-V1500 for $1,000 Cdn. One of the site I was referred to for buying electronics on-line from Canada is http://www.etronics.com/ where I can get the RX-V1500 for $866 Cdn, including shipping and taxes. The Elite VX52TX from them is only $846 Cdn S/H and tax included.

Most people and sales guys are saying the Pioneer and Marantz sound too warm with Paradigm and so it's either Denon or Yammy for me. I will probably go with the Yamaha RX-V1500 and upgrade my front speakers to Totem Arro later on as they are ideal for my apartment.

Geoffcin
11-27-2004, 11:12 AM
Geofficin, do you have a source for those lab tests I could see? I did a side by side audition on Wednesday, and I found that the Yamaha is just a tad bit tougher in the power deliver section. I'm not talking driving sine waves, but real source playback. The difference so small though it's not even worth mentioning. Air Force One was the test DVD. And some Josh Groban CD.
I think they sound about as good as each other.

And for all intents and purposes, that insignificant bit of headroom between the two will create next to zero sound advantage. Now you might like he "tonal qualities" of one of these receivers over the other...I didn't hear anything from either that got me exited. Maybe you're confusing models?

And $1900 CDN is way too much...that receiver might be worth half of that. At $800 or so, it's probably on par with the others in the value department, I didn't ask price of either because I wasn't shopping, just seeing what the difference was between my receiver and the 1500...not much.

It was the Yamaha 2400, compared to the Pioneer Elite 55txi. The tests were conducted by Home Theater magazine.

quote;

This graph shows that the RX-V2400's left channel, from CD input to speaker output with two channels driving 8-ohm loads, reaches 0.1% distortion at 102.9 watts and 1% distortion at 130.5 watts. Into 4 ohms, the amplifier reaches 0.1% distortion at 158.4 watts and 1% distortion at 195.3 watts. With five channels driving 8-ohm loads, the amplifier reaches 0.1% distortion at 43.5 watts and 1% distortion at 44.1 watts. With seven channels driving 8-ohm loads, the amplifier reaches 0.1% distortion at 32.3 watts and 1% distortion at 36.9 watts.

Great 2-channel performance, but seriously truncated performance for HT operation.

The Pioneer 55txi;

This graph shows that the VSX-55TXi's left channel, from CD input to speaker output with two channels driving 8-ohm loads, reaches 0.1% distortion at 110.2 watts and 1% distortion at 129.3 watts. Into 4 ohms, the amplifier reaches 0.1% distortion at 192.6 watts and 1% distortion at 220.8 watts. Five channels driven into 8-ohm loads: 0.1% distortion at 87.9 watts; 1% distortion at 97.7 watts

The Pioneer has almost exactly TWICE the available power for HT operation. For movies with heavy use of multichannel signal, and also, for mulitchannel music the extra power is very useful.

To be honest I was shocked that Yamaha would limit this receiver so much.

kexodusc
11-27-2004, 01:11 PM
Not to downplay the power of that sweet Pioneer receiver, but that's not really very much at all, despite numerical difference....If you were driving say Paradigm's, B&W's, or PSB speakers to 90 dB, blisteringly loud for most people, all channels driven, you would have still have 15 dB of dynamic headroom, which is heckuva lot extra for most aps. On the most demanding classical scores you'd be hardpressed to find a peak of 12 dB's. If you had really inefficient speakers or wanted to listen to movies louder, that 3 dB's in the Pioneer isn't enough to prevent you from buying some separate power amps.

Thereal_1: I wouldn't say that Pioneer will make Paradigm's sound too warm at all. To tell you the truth, to my ears, Yammies and Pioneer Elites both sound pretty much the same as far as tonality goes...very neutral...denon's have a bit of a nice warmth to them IMO...to each their own though. Don't rule out the Pioneer just yet though. Go look at it and see for yourself.

Geoffcin
11-27-2004, 01:41 PM
Not to downplay the power of that sweet Pioneer receiver, but that's not really very much at all, despite numerical difference....If you were driving say Paradigm's, B&W's, or PSB speakers to 90 dB, blisteringly loud for most people, all channels driven, you would have still have 15 dB of dynamic headroom, which is heckuva lot extra for most aps. On the most demanding classical scores you'd be hardpressed to find a peak of 12 dB's. If you had really inefficient speakers or wanted to listen to movies louder, that 3 dB's in the Pioneer isn't enough to prevent you from buying some separate power amps.

Thereal_1: I wouldn't say that Pioneer will make Paradigm's sound too warm at all. To tell you the truth, to my ears, Yammies and Pioneer Elites both sound pretty much the same as far as tonality goes...very neutral...denon's have a bit of a nice warmth to them IMO...to each their own though. Don't rule out the Pioneer just yet though. Go look at it and see for yourself.

I liked the abilities & features of nearly all the receivers in this price bracket, Yammies included, but not the amplification(in ANY). My only nod to the Pioneer is the power, and even though I give it, I don't actually USE the power (for the mains) from my Pioneer receiver in my setup. It might be my choice of speakers, but I was never happy with the power from a receiver.